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Refuse (lemmy.blahaj.zone)
submitted 2 months ago by Catoblepas to c/microblogmemes@lemmy.world
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[-] PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat 163 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Not only that: They rely on people pre-emptively obeying them before even being threatened. Zuckerberg, Tim Cook, all those guys, they know better. They're also doing fine money-wise. They had every option to just tell Trump to get fucked, and mess up their company if he wanted to make that decision. They wouldn't have been out on the street, whatever happened, and they would have had a chance to do something noble instead of just optimizing for the money function like a malfunctioning AI superintelligence.

One of the critical factors in fascists taking power is "obeying in advance." Because, yes, they can't be everywhere. Fuck that. I fully support this message.

Edit: Typo

[-] grue@lemmy.world 52 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Zuckerberg, Tim Cook, all those guys, they know better. They’re also doing fine money-wise. They had every option to just tell Trump to get fucked, and mess up their company if he wanted to make that decision

You say that as if they're complying reluctantly instead of enthusiastically.

All the billionaire plutocrats are fucking GLEEFUL at what's happening. Every. Single. Fucking. One. is the enemy of the People.

[-] PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat 4 points 2 months ago

They don’t seem at all reluctant, no. Why are you saying they’re gleeful, though? How do you know?

[-] FinalRemix@lemmy.world 29 points 2 months ago

Because this makes them money. Either indirectly, through kickbacks, or through stripping of regulatory powers.

[-] PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat 5 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Not really. Big company incomes, along with pretty much any other economic metric you want to choose, very consistently do better under liberal government in the US. It is one of very few actual consistent and simple truths about economics and politics in the world. And Trump is infinitely worse than an average Republican. He’s likely to crash the entire economy, or worse.

https://www.epi.org/press/new-report-finds-that-the-economy-performs-better-under-democratic-presidential-administrations/

[-] FinalRemix@lemmy.world 10 points 2 months ago

Oh, I don't disagree, but they definitely seem to be in a "rip the copper outta the walls and run" pattern of behavior right now. Quick Buck / pump'n'dump / whatever rather than a functioning economy.

[-] swab148@lemm.ee 10 points 2 months ago

Plus, when economies crash, rich people can just buy everything for pennies and sit on it.

[-] PunnyName@lemmy.world 22 points 2 months ago

"On Tyranny" covers that in the first chapter.

2 hour audiobook.

[-] rockerface@lemm.ee 16 points 2 months ago

Well, you don't become a billionaire by doing the morally right thing, so it would have been a miracle.

[-] solarvector@lemmy.dbzer0.com 135 points 2 months ago

Depending on the context, acquiescing and then not following orders can be quite effective as well, especially if you're in a position of direct contact.

E.g., your supervisor instructs you to do something like take down the company DEI site? Say no, get fired... Or say yes, and just don't do it. You forgot, it's a cached version, etc. Eventually you have to take it down and then a month later when the site updates it's back. Someone must've left it in the update package.

Be creative, be active. Anyone who wants to gaslight the world is owed nothing but deception and disrespect.

[-] jmcs@discuss.tchncs.de 43 points 2 months ago

A good example of this is the Rosenstraße Protest. Nazi Germany was unable to deal with popular pushback at height of Hitler's totalitarian power at the literal center of repression.

[-] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 29 points 2 months ago

As a relatively privileged person, nobody is making me do anything. I'm passively benefiting from completely evil systems of exploitation around the planet. There is nothing to refuse except my own comfort which every human deserves.

I think it's more important to actively resist but resistance will be violently suppressed as always. It's not a risk that many privileged people are willing to take.

[-] pennomi@lemmy.world 28 points 2 months ago

I suspect we’ll have another Rosa Parks moment for the history books sometime in the next four years or so.

[-] em2@lemmy.ml 5 points 2 months ago

If they don't burn or ban them.

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[-] HappySkullsplitter@lemmy.world 25 points 2 months ago
[-] roguetrick@lemmy.world 21 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

They're close, but not quite there. Any government(democratic or otherwise) requires participation for it's legitimacy. If enough folks decide to stop participating in a critical mass, the government falls. That's why mass protests and general strikes are so effective and why governments really don't want people to understand they have that nuclear option and will do anything to prevent people from organizing for it.

[-] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 12 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

A great deal of the modernization of finance and policy enforcement has been about pre-enforcement. You get your IRS money taken out before it hits your paycheck. You don't speed in a neighborhood with speed bumps because it immediately fucks up your car. Your ability to access your office space or bank account or the electricity/water that goes into your home even the ability to turn on newer models of car is predicated on a permission slip that a third party can disable with a button click.

On the flip side, so much of our daily life is alienated from the other people that make our standard of living possible. I don't know who works at my grocery store, much less who actually picks my fruit or bakes my bread or slaughters my beef. I don't know who provides me with electricity or water. I don't know who is on the other side of the teller window when it comes time to cash a check or pull out cash.

Participation is mandatory because the interfaces that allow us to interact with one another are gate-kept by remote and indifferent agents. Opting out of these systems is difficult and expensive. Reaching out to people to engage in collective action is onerous and awkward.

governments really don’t want people to understand they have that nuclear option and will do anything to prevent people from organizing for it.

Government administrators keep a short lease on their direct reports and underlings. Private sector administrators do, too. Organizing the people with their hands closest to the levers of power is incredibly difficult, while administrative replacement of these higher ranking bureaucrats is trivially easy.

At some level, what the Trump Admin is currently doing cuts so deep that he may actually sever his ability to impose his will on remote offices and local bureaucracies. If enough high ranking FBI admins or DOJ lawyers walk off the job, it just becomes impossible to command branches in far-flung states and territories.

But when he's got guys like Peter Thiel and Jamie Damion in his back pocket, it may not matter. The ability to instantly fire, bankrupt, or imprison people anywhere in the country has a powerful chilling effect. The only people it doesn't immediately threaten are the folks who have already lost too much and the folks who have managed to remove themselves from the domestic system entirely.

None of this is to say we shouldn't organize and oppose this shit. But go in with eyes wide open. Don't naively assume raw numbers matter in the face of a heavily automated administrative state.

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[-] lurklurk@lemmy.world 16 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Back when the US was fighting against fascists in europe, CIA wrote this Simple Sabotage manual, which has some similar ideas

https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/26184

It's a pretty interesting read, as a historical document.

[-] hark@lemmy.world 16 points 2 months ago

They cannot be everywhere, but they're certainly trying with ever-increasing surveillance and AI to go through all that data.

[-] jonne@infosec.pub 13 points 2 months ago

Good thing Democrats voted for that every step of the way, despite people telling them what this was going to lead to.

[-] JusticeForPorygon 14 points 2 months ago

AoC says strap up

[-] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 14 points 2 months ago

That’s pretty much how the talibangelicals operate. They disobey subpoenas and refuse to comply in various other ways, both petty and legal.

It’s effective at showing how powerless and spineless our authorities are, so fair enough to turn the tables.

[-] AlecSadler@sh.itjust.works 10 points 2 months ago

I can't even fight back in self-defense because I'm not white and typically the other person is.

The system is stacked against me and the only possible approach is secret vigilante justice.

[-] Treczoks@lemmy.world 9 points 2 months ago

Good luck with that attitude in 1930/40s Germany or similar states. Fascist states have always dealt with this kind of people.

[-] DreamlandLividity@lemmy.world 15 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

That always depend on how many (and to some extent which) people have that attitude.

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[-] TangoNoir@lemm.ee 9 points 2 months ago

This is the time for Americans to really start acting like old fashioned stereotypical Americans.

No kings. We the people. My freedoms. The constitution. Etc.

The moment we roll over they will steam roll us all.

[-] victorz@lemmy.world 7 points 2 months ago

Make me do what, exactly

[-] Dadifer@lemmy.world 7 points 2 months ago
[-] allidoislietomyself@lemmy.world 17 points 2 months ago

I disagree. Pretending to comply is just as good to them as compliance. They don't actually care about someone getting an abortion, but they do care about the message it sends to the masses. By saying no and leaving them with no option but to use physical force we are showing the cracks in that agenda/message. Those cracks will grow and encourage others to stand up and say no. Once that happens the entire foundation of it falls apart because people aren't afraid anymore. Sure a few of us will be beaten, killed, jailed, even publicly executed. But as OP said they can't stop us all.

[-] lurklurk@lemmy.world 8 points 2 months ago

The movie Schindler's List is about how Schindler pretended to comply

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[-] Philharmonic3@lemmy.world 6 points 2 months ago

Fight back.

[-] Shardikprime@lemmy.world 5 points 2 months ago

"vote for Biden"

"No, make me"

Yeah, this, THIS will work perfectly

[-] Walk_blesseD 14 points 2 months ago

What are you even trying to say? Like yeah, your comment parses grammatically, but I haven't the foggiest about what it's supposed to mean in context 🤷‍♀️

And voting discourse? What's the point of that??? The election was two and a half months ago, and Biden wasn't even running 🤦‍♀️

Quick question to make sure this isn't a bot account: how many times does the letter "m" occur in the word "remembered"?

[-] TheBat@lemmy.world 11 points 2 months ago

Don't feed trolls. Block them.

[-] Walk_blesseD 9 points 2 months ago

What if I think they're funny tho

[-] TheBat@lemmy.world 7 points 2 months ago
[-] Walk_blesseD 9 points 2 months ago

Nevermind, you were right, their comment history is pretty rancid.

[-] Stalinwolf@lemmy.ca 6 points 2 months ago

Could you please explain what this means? This is on par with that inbred on every Facebook post who comments "LOOKS LIKE BIDEN N KAMALER", and it'll be an ad for a Volkswagen.

[-] LustyArgonianMana@lemmy.world 5 points 2 months ago

Please read my comment from months ago: https://lemmy.world/comment/13431373

[-] tetris11@lemmy.ml 4 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Chaos A.D.
Disorder unleashed
Silence means death
Stand on your feet
Inner fear
Your worst enemy

[-] Free_Opinions@feddit.uk 3 points 2 months ago
[-] GreenKnight23@lemmy.world 4 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

deleted by creator

[-] Shardikprime@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

So, the maga crowd was right all this time? Uncanny

[-] Xanthobilly@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

Hey bud, in scrolling through your previous posts it seems like you’re having a hard time being accepted. Perhaps pause before posting, take a step back from the keyboard, and consider putting yourself in other’s shoes. You might find more in common with us if you try it.

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[-] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 months ago

I think the point is to refuse fascism, not embrace it.

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this post was submitted on 23 Jan 2025
1104 points (100.0% liked)

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