I realised a while ago that it's way cheaper to hunt for second-hand intel NUCs, and the resulting machine is way more powerful... And the RAM and storage is upgradeable, if the NUC didn't come with plenty of storage or RAM already...
Basically the only benefit the Pi has is GPIO pins for embedded projects.
Which a $3 ESP32 can handle instead.
Yup. If you really need GPIO + any real power, either go with an ARM board from AliExpress or do NUC + ESP32 with a serial connection between them.
Where do you get your ESP32s from? They're $10 each on Amazon
AliExpress. I only use Amazon for stuff like this if I need it within a day or two.
https://a.aliexpress.com/_msfObvf
Bear in mind these are probably not production grade. So if you have a real use case that needs to last don't use these. But for messing around and doing hobby projects these are fine.
Digikey has the official espressif dev boards, if you want decent quality ones.
I've been enjoying tinkering with the Pico. In my experience it's easier to flash than an esp chip.
Pi is also a fraction of the power consumption (meaning also heat dissipation requirements) and physical size.
Low power draw but ridiculous power supply requirements of 5V5A (depending on the model) with a USB-C connector which isnt a thing outside of this specific application meaning they're going to be expensive and hard to source. They should have just done a barrel plug or put an effing voltage regulator on board like Arduinos.
It really needs USB-PD support with an onboard regulator, but of course that would be way too crazy to implement.
Pi's were cool up until the 3b and everything after has just not been good for the form factor. Conveniently, the 3B was about the time they started prioritizing selling volume to commercial customers.
Low power draw but ridiculous power supply requirements of 5V5A (depending on the model) with a USB-C connector which isnt a thing outside of this specific application meaning they’re going to be expensive and hard to source.
That's only for the Pi 5 (the highest end unit), and I'll agree that at that level its hard to justify a Pi over a larger computer. Even for the Pi 5 its not that hard to find those Power Supplies. Most laptops today use power supplies that meet or exceed those specs. You're right that those are more expensive than Pi 4 and below Power Supplies.
They should have just done a barrel plug or put an effing voltage regulator on board like Arduinos.
Again, no defense of Pi 5 from me. However, for everything below Pi 5, HARD PASS on a voltage regulator. I don't want that heat in the tiny Pi case. At the lower power requirements of Pi4 and below USB power is fine.
Most laptops today use power supplies that meet or exceed those specs.
Non those are USB-PD power supplies that increase voltage up to 20V in order to deliver more power. No USB standard that I'm aware of offers 5A at 5V.
As far as heat goes, these devices already need heatsinks and case fans, so the difference seems negligible.
Also, good luck using a Pi5 any further than 3ft from a wall outlet unless you want to rig up your own power supply using some 14/2 Romex with a USB C connector soldered to the end.
As far as heat goes, these devices already need heatsinks and case fans, so the difference seems negligible.
Pi 4 and below don't require active cooling. I want to keep it that way.
Also, good luck using a Pi5
Again, I offer no defense of Pi5. I don't use it and don't recommend it.
I'm not sure why you're referring to the Pi4 since it doesn't require this entirely non-standard power supply and isn't their current flagship model. Nobody is asking for old models to be retrofitted with voltage regulators so that they don't have to use a power supply that they already don't need to use.
You say you don't use or recommend the Pi5 and yet you're seemingly arguing that its power supply requirements aren't a big deal and that improvements should absolutely not be made to it.
First, I think we both don't like the Pi5. So we are in agreement on that. If you want we can stop right there on the same page.
I’m not sure why you’re referring to the Pi4
My first post in this thread was talking about Pi low power and small physical size. I was talking about all Raspberry Pis in general. I never put forth the Pi5. You did when you raised the 5V5A requirement. That exists only on the Pi5. You'll also see in that first post of mine is where I disavowed any recommendation of Pi5.
You then went on in your next post about Raspberry Pis needing active cooling and heat sinks. Again, that is only the Pi5, which again, I said I don't support.
So if you're wondering why I keep talking about Pi4 and below is because those are the ones I like. In this thread you keep posting facts about Pi5 (without pointing out that those only apply to Pi5), and so that's why I keep referring to Pi4 (and below).
You say you don’t use or recommend the Pi5 and yet you’re seemingly arguing that its power supply requirements aren’t a big deal and that improvements should absolutely not be made to it.
I'm arguing power supply requirements shouldn't be made to Pi4 (or below). I don't use Pi5.
Yeah a voltage regulator would be a bad idea, however a well designed DC-DC buck converter can be in the 95%+ efficiency range and produce very little heat.
The 5V5A supply is optional, the Pi 5 alone works perfectly fine using a standard 5V3A USB-PD supply, it just limits the maximum combined USB port current to 600mA.
But technically they are still in USB-PD spec: it's apparently okay for a charger to support 5V5A, and a device to "prefer" to use that if it's available. It can't be required, but as said, the Pi 5 works with 5V3A, so it isn't.
It's still dumb, and they should have just used 9V3A instead and paid the dollar for the stepdown circuitry like everyone else.
My thinkcentre draws power but not that much power. Also, just combine it with an ESP and you get the best of two worlds.
The Pi can actually be higher in some cases in my experience.
I have a pair of passively cooled PCs with i3-7100u CPUs, RAM, and a single NVMe drive each, and they draw around 1-2W when idle.
I think the ecosystem has some more benefits besides that. Ready to use case, cooler, camera, display options and lots of resources for putting these things together compared to NUCs/minipcs. I do like how the compute modules are even more flexible with the ability to choose from various carrier boards. Really depends on your use case which makes the most sense.
and you can replicate that nowadays with an RP2040. Hell, the newer Pi models already kinda do that with the RP1 handling GPIO (among other things)
Plus x86 compatibility
I’m hoping this is just April Fools
It would be an April Fools joke if it were a price drop instead.
You know it's not :(
Jesus who is spending $200+ on a raspberry pi?
You can get an entire kick ass 2/3 year old mini PC with everything included for the price of a single RPi4, let alone 5. And you don't have to buy any kits or expansions to get full functionality.
Oh and that mini PC will have at least 2 - 3 times the specs of the RPi. It's just not worth it anymore to buy Pis.
Which machines are people getting these days? I have a Dell Optiplex 3070 I’ve added a WiFi antenna to. It’s pretty small.
HP elitedesk here. Medical offices around me seem to can't get rid of them fast enough. Got a neat little i5 7500T with 16GB of RAM for $80 :p I did swap the HDD for a SSD I had lying around but still.
I almost bought a RPi and realized I'd get better value at a Dell mini PC. Sure it's significantly bigger than a Pi, but it's still small enough for my use case. I just don't see a good reason to get a Pi anymore. It used to be a cheap hobbyist board. Now it's...something else.
I wanted to upgrade my kids from Pi 4s to Pi 5s, but ended up just getting NUCs instead.
The only thing I can think of is GPIO compatibility these days.
I would have been in the market for one, but they were already a terrible value proposition.
Meanwhile, Mac Mini prices have held stable at an already good price/performance ratio...
From my understanding Apple has memory contracts locked in for years ahead. This is a benefit they have for being an enormous player in the consumer electronics world. They can keep their memory prices "low" (or at least what Apple normally considers low) because of that.
Other smaller manufacturers don't have that luxury. When their current contracts run out they have to negotiate new ones, and they will be negotiated at the current market rate.
The poor will only get poorer, and the rich will only get richer...
Remembered I had an unopened Pi5-8GB on the shelf.
That really sucks I wanted to build a magic mirror with a Pi.
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