And that's why Kamala's stance on Palestine never bothered me.
I knew that as bad as it was, Trump would be worse.
I was right.
Gaza was fucked under either presidential option and we all knew that. Now we also get to enjoy getting fucked by Trump at home and hand the right the country. Other countries get to get bullied like Canada, Colombia, Greenland, Panama, and who knows who else and to what insane degree. Plus, Gaza will get to deal with a president that doesn’t bend to protest pressures at all and gives 0 fucks about humanitarian issues. We sure showed Biden for being an AIPAC puppet like the rest of the government. This is why the right has taken our government over. We constantly in fight and ignore realities for ideological purity while the right unites under the broad strokes of their agenda. When no option has the desired outcome, sometimes you have to pick the lesser evil.
Nope, under the Democrats, there are many Representatives who would listen and put pressure on a Dem president to do the right thing. Thanks to people with a smooth brain who think BOTH SIDES SAME, they are going to find out what everyone else already knew.. they were never the same.
Hey but while Im being lead into a camp a bunch leftists here can feel good knowing they did the "right" thing by not opposing fascists
Indeed, this is what I keep telling people.
There's no happy-feel-good everyone walks away with their faerie tale sitcom ending.
The world situation is fucked, when your options are crawl through broken glass or swim across a river of piss, well it might not smell good, but at least I'm a strong swimmer and urine is allegedly sterile.
Okay I double checked, urine isn't sterile, but it has low amounts of bacteria and isn't going to lead to me bleeding out or needing immediate medical attention.
Reeeeeeeeeally hard to stop my self from screaming “I fucking told you so” to all the idiots who insisted Trump would be better for the situation right now
This is literally the exact thing I’ve been trying to point out for months
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/israel-gaza-palestinians-concept-paper-1.7015576
The plan was always their. They would get away with it even if it was biden or harris would won
It was Israel’s plan yes, not official us policy like now.
What would you make think biden or harris would have blocked such a plan?
Nobody I know thought Trump would be better for Gaza. Just that Genocide is the worst situation and it was already being ignored.
But now we get more death! Immigrants, trans people, FEMA, it’s like a Gatcha game of who else gets to suffer. We really taught them a lesson
The dem leadership knew the whole time exactly how to win the election but werent willing to pay the price in thwarting AIPAC to secure that win. All they had to do was recognize the genocide a few days before the election and follow existing laws on it, and acknowledge that many Americans are struggling. They chose to roll the dice instead.
I pointed this out to a dem apologist on bluesky and their response was that ending the genocide on its own wouldn't have won the election.
Motherfucker, what?! Quite apart from the fact that ending a genocide shouldn't be evaluated on how likely it is to win an election, it is the right thing to do and it would have helped.
But the dems decided that continuing the genocide was more important than improving their chances of beating Trump. Assuming they believe what we were told that Trump would be worse at the genocide, that means the dems decided to continue the genocide and also risk worse genocide. So they just chose genocide.
And now people are still trying to get up on their high horses about this shit.
Maybe geopolitics is more complicated than the anti-Kamala protest voters have been lead to believe...
Few people argued for Trump being better. Biden bombed Gaza to rubble. Trump comes in and does the paperwork. Biden is not absolved.
Biden didn't bomb Gaza genius.
I must have imagined those American bombs dropped by American made planes being sent by Biden.
He asked Netanyahu nicely to not carpet bomb Gaza with them. That absolves him of it all.
Protest voters looking more and more stupid by the day. And will continue to do so every day for the next 4 years minimum.
Wonderful. Nothing like the US backing state sponsored terrorism. Not that it's anything new...
Here are my thoughts:
I'm pretty disillusioned with the Democrats between the imperialism and almost completely giving in to the fascist takeover, but I wouldn't be looking to get out of the country if Harris had won, so thanks for that if you could have voted and didn't.
edit: I voted Uncommitted in the primary, helped out at my local Gaza camp, and have gone to rallies and distributed books about Palestine, so I'm not just sitting here at my computer saying all this
"Clean out", what a wording. So they no longer have any problem saying they support genocide.
Just some light ethnic cleaning.
I guess it's time for all the "protest voters" to either admit they never gave a shit about Palestine or admit they fell for Russian propaganda.
Of course that's if they remember about Palestine. A shiny red ball might have rolled past and distracted them.
@generalemergency,
Dnc centrists who wouldnt let any possible supporters of Palestinians into the democratic party convention are the real unsung heros here, right?
Do your posts like this one make you feel better about yourself? Thats why you're posting isnt it. You told yourself you 'held your nose' while voting but you didnt really hold your nose at all. You were happy to drop every semblence of basic human morality and dignity in order to win-- and then you lost anyway.. Now you're angry at those on your own side who didnt shit their own bed and roll around in it like you did.
To win at all in the future and reclaim the demographic losses, the dems need to admit that what was done in Plaestine was wrong. They need to admit Biden and Harris both were not doing their job and not representing the working class, but were simply chasing corporate and special interest campaign dollars. If the party can do that it might survive. Otherwise its probably dead, becuase No one thinks the democrats stand for anything, and the rage evident at the elites related to Luigi's prosecution is increasingly the response toward out of touch dem leaders. No one supports corporatists so get your shit together.
It's funny you think there will be legitimate elections in 4 years. I mean Republicans are already pushing ways to give Trump a third term. So like, congrats on having Gaza screwed even harder while simultaneously throwing away any semblance of democracy?
At least the corporate corrupt Dems gave a small window for changing things democratically while not screwing over Trans people in the USA as well.
By abstaining you allowed the greater evil to prevail, not prevented any evil from occuring.
By abstaining you allowed the greater evil to prevail
I'm heartened to hear that you at least understand that Biden/Harris was evil. Its a good start.
Actual leftists KNEW that already. Kamala, Biden, the majority of the DNC - they're all corrupt corporatists.
But the situation the USA was in was one of minimizing overall damage. And with the corporatists, there was still a small chance of gaining some control from them peacefully via elections, if simply because more left leaning people can at least run under the Democrat moniker.
With the fascists, that opportunity is gone. By allowing them to win, not only do you worsen the genocide occuring in Israel (if not ensured Israel from achieving it entirely), but also just got killed a bunch of other people and hurt a huge amount of minorities in the USA as well.
Not voting didn't stop the genocide and never would have, but it did guarantee that it gets worse while hurting other innocents outside of Palestine as well. If you didn't vote for Kamala (which literally means "horrible" in Finnish), you're a dumbass, because you allowed a greater evil to prevail. Especially since I know many of y'all abstainers are still paying taxes anyway and funding the genocides either way.
But the situation the USA was in was one of minimizing overall damage
thats logical in a narrow scoping, but I think its reasonable to also consider the longer term effects of the 'left' party in the US continuing a track of far right wing actions over time and how that changes the Democratic party and likely destroys it. No one will vote for republican-lite or fascist lite-- those platforms always lose. The DNC doesn't understand that. Maybe occasionally a Dem leader goes off the rails and can be disavowed later, sure, but if the party stays evil for long enough, that option of disavowing the evildoers' mistakes goes away and sticks to all dems. The voter losses across all demographics in the last elections show we are at the point of losing the voters and with that our ability to win in the future. For now its still an option to disavow and explicitly reject Biden/Harris's actions, if we find the stones to throw the old pro-evil anti-lower and anti-middle class leadership out on their ass and admit they were wrong.
Sure the war crimes were destined to happen with either party after the election-- and I'd argue with similar severity. Both parties will let the zionists do whatever they want, whenever they want, to whomever they want. Both parties will also fund the zionists with weapons and money, and will run interference in the UN. But I'd rather they be done by the US republicans which gives us at least a chance to rescue the US Dems, which was badly in need of rescue. Rescue means disempowering the bad actors, which is now completed. Without a dethroning of centrism that evil direction was immutable due to the way funding steers political action in the US. So the dems had to lose the election to pure evil or face political dissolution as evil lite in the short-middle time frame. Yes, the cost is dire in terms of Trump being much worse with internal policy. The prognosis for the US is possibly fatal.. We are on life support as a country of laws and as an entity on the world stage with global reserve currency dominance.
Before the election, both parties seemed inevitably doomed-- it was simply of whether it was in the very short term or in the short-medium term. Now the Dems might conceivably disavow their mistakes and correct themselves, after a trip to the woodshed for what we all should agree is a beating of the neolibs that needs to occur if we are to move forward.
Either way we have a lot to answer for as a people who perpetuate this political reality, which affects the world quite a bit. The concept of collective responsibility exists, even if Americans seldom talk about it or understand it.
Your argument doesn't follow logic.
you say voting for Dems would destroy it, but letting literal fascists get absolute power would also destroy it, permanently, while also destroying why change for actual leftists to gain power.
for some reason you think it's better to let the fascists win to destroy the center right, but not destroy the fascists by not allowing them to gain power continuously???
you stated it's not ethical to allow the Democrats to continue existing as they are because they're not as a whole left wing and are also causing harm, but it's ethical to have many more suffer? That's just hypocrisy.
you assume the DNC is dumb rather than corrupt
you assume you'll still have a legitimate democracy after Trump.
you say voting for Dems would destroy it, but letting literal fascists get absolute power would also destroy it, permanently,
"it" the first time being the democratic party. We cant prop up a far right dem party. correct.
Your second use of "it" is the republic itself.
Call me names all you want, or disagree all you want, thats fine with me.
But you're literally propping up a much farther right republican party, and the dissolution of any democracy.
That is, by definition, hypocrisy. That's not me calling you a name, that's pointing out a fact in your actions.
Your actions and stated desired ultimate outcome simply don't match.
Great fucking job, bothsiders. Now you get Genocide++.
I really hope you’re happy that your conscience is clean now the guy who’s main spokesman said Gaza’s ‘waterfront property could be very valuable’ and who himself declared it ‘could be better than Monaco’, clearly with an eye towards beachfront real estate, has the power to make that happen for his own gain.
This was entirely predictable, and we told you this would happen. Trump told you so himself. The dems weren’t perfect by any stretch, but Kamala absolutely wasn’t looking at the situation as to how she could personally profit through real estate development if the Palestinians were just wiped off the map as quickly as possible. Trump likely had the choicest property mapped out, with property developers already submitting proposals.
If you abstained because of both-sides re Israel, fuck you. You at best were played and at worst helped to play others, and now we ALL get to suffer.
The dems weren’t perfect by any stretch
Totally.
Enthusiastically helping Israel stack bodies for four years was definitely imperfect.
Of everything I said, that’s the part you decided to focus on?
e: not that trump had said he’d glass the region to build hotels?
Native Americans suggest Americans should leave, “Just clean out “ the whole country, allow it to be rewilded and return to how it should be.
Oh so an actual genocide. Curious.
Do you believe what was happening up until now was not genocide? Because if you don’t then calling this an actual genocide makes it seem like you do.
Nonono, it's only genocide if it comes from Republicans. Otherwise, it's just sparkling ethnic cleansing.
Congrats leftists! You solved Palestine! We just won't have one!
The number of people trying to argue that not voting was legitmate is baffling.
Seems odd to blame leftists instead of the people supporting, supplying, and carrying out the genocide.
Read THE SHOCK DOCTRINE. It was always gonna be this.
It's like those fairy tales Zionists try to convince you about that every belief system should seek their own nation. It's easy to come up with free land when you have zero value for the people living on it.
Oh, now this asshole is all for other countries taking in displaced migrants.
Where do you send illegal immigrants if their country of origin no longer exists?
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