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Technically it’s for any printer capable of printing a firearm or the components of a firearm, which is…. every printer. What a bafflingly stupid proposal. If you’re in NY, please call your reps and tell them to oppose this bill.

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[-] NineMileTower@lemmy.world 183 points 3 months ago

Luigi would have passed a background check.

[-] jonne@infosec.pub 73 points 3 months ago

And didn't even use his own printer (according to his confession/manifesto)..

[-] HubertManne@moist.catsweat.com 44 points 3 months ago

was it even printed in new york? I mean im sure someone would never bring one in from jersey.

[-] Tolookah@discuss.tchncs.de 39 points 3 months ago

Everything is legal in New Jersey.

[-] AliasVortex@lemmy.world 19 points 3 months ago

Why do you print like you're running out of time?

[-] P1nkman@lemmy.world 8 points 3 months ago

Unexpected Hamilton ❤️

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[-] azdle@news.idlestate.org 124 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)
  1. FOR PURPOSES OF THIS SECTION, "THREE-DIMENSIONAL PRINTER" MEANS A COMPUTER OR COMPUTER-DRIVEN MACHINE OR DEVICE CAPABLE OF PRODUCING A THREE-DIMENSIONAL OBJECT FROM A DIGITAL MODEL

Well, that's a broad definition. I guess to whomever wrote that, a CNC mill is also a 3d printer.

[-] _stranger_@lemmy.world 105 points 3 months ago

It's not like inkjets produce 2 dimensional ink. I'd love to see someone argue in court that it's technically impossible to create a non 3d printer

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[-] RobotZap10000@feddit.nl 50 points 3 months ago

A CNC mill seems much more capable of manufacturing firearms than some 300 buck printer.

[-] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 26 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Not really.

There are gun parts that just can't be printed in plastic (reliably. There are proof of concept "all plastic except the firing pin" guns). But... because of how lobbyists tainted what few gun control laws we have, most of what makes a gun a gun CAN be printed and the rest can be bought as after market parts. That is why an incredibly common "ghost gun" is basically "print this and then go buy this replacement barrel and this baggy of parts to repair a glock".

Whereas a mill is great for those metal parts and you can theoretically mill an entire gun, it isn't going to be a gun you "want" to use and, odds are, you are going to need a lot more technical skills. And for stuff like "ghost guns" and the bootleg mods used in stuff like The Troubles? A 3d printer is MUCH more accessible and MUCH easier to make.

The reality is that neither is going to be effective in the case of a militia/uprising scenario (yes, you can print an AR-15 and it isn't THAT hard to reinforce the plastic to handle intermediate rounds. No, you can't print a hellfire missile or a predator drone or a tank). And for the purposes of a school shooting? Why print a gun when you can just grab daddy's glock out of his nightstand or junk drawer?


I'll also add on the reason why additive manufacturing is so loved by Industry. Milling is subtractive. You get a piece of stock and you cut it until it is the part you want. If you can guarantee said piece of stock is approximately the same dimensions every time, you can automate that. But getting a piece to those dimensions has a significant cost. 3d printing? As long as you clear out the build plate and sort of control the environment, it is the same operations every single time.

So to 3d print a glock? You go to one of the naughty sites, get the STL, make a few tweaks to your slicer, and start it (old Vice actually did a really good video on this). After that you wait until it is done, remove the supports, file the ever loving hell out of it, and you are ready to go blasting.

To mill a glock? You go to one of the naught sites and get the gcode. You then adjust that gcode to fit the dimensions of your piece of stock (or put in the time to make your piece of stock the dimensions the gcode is expecting...). You then do one process, stop it, move and remount the part precisely to expose the correct surfaces, and do the next process. And so forth.

[-] ikidd@lemmy.world 20 points 3 months ago

"Not really"

Yes, really. If you print something out of plastic and have to go out and buy a barrel and other hardware to put in it, you might as well just mold it out of paper mache.

A CNC can make a gun from start to finish that you wouldn't be worried about blowing your fingers off when you pulled the trigger, without adding outside hardware to.

[-] NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip 20 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

You clearly didn't read anything I said after that first line but this is just too fun:

A CNC can make a gun from start to finish that you wouldn’t be worried about blowing your fingers off when you pulled the trigger, without adding outside hardware to.

Mostly tells me you have no idea what is inside of a firearm outside of "magic".

Over simplifying, but modern firearms generally consist of

  1. A frame: This is usually a mix of plastic and metal for comfort, weight, and heat dissipation reasons. But there is nothing saying you can't have an all metal frame. Some parts will receive load, some parts are purely cosmetic/ergonomic. This is demonstrably not a problem for either 3d printer or mill.
  2. Lots of pins and levers: These are the mechanisms that actually make the gun go bang when you pull the trigger. And, depending on how spicy you want to get, continue to go bang while you hold down the trigger. Again, some parts are stressed, some aren't. There are ways to do all plastic that should last at least a few hundred rounds. The issue is more one of tolerances. Getting a 3d printer to be able to print with that level of precision is more work than people want to put in. Similarly, getting a mill capable of that level of precision is also a mother (Adam Savage of Will Smith's Tested fame has a lot of videos where he is basically tackling this challenge for different projects). But also? These are the parts that "wear out" and are completely uncontrolled and can be bought online trivially. So why manufacture this yourself in the first place?
  3. Springs. Good fricking luck milling your own springs with the required properties. Also good fricking luck printing your own springs. That said, I actually watched a REALLY cool video where someone proof of concept made a gun out of 3d printable leaf springs and while the guy doing it was a complete and utter dipshit, it was a work of engineering beauty that you couldn't pay me enough to hold in my hand... But, again, these are trivially easy to buy online so why bother?
  4. The last major part in this oversimplified breakdown is the barrel (and how you seal it but I am just going to include that here). These are the parts that experience the most forces and heat when the gun is fired since that is the part where the bang happens. Everything else you can probably get away with some cheap mild steel. That? You need some good stuff otherwise you are going to learn just how weak that cheap stock was. You CAN mill chrome moly and the like but that is a much bigger challenge than cutting through cheap steel like it is butter and amplifies all of the above tolerance issues. I will outright say that you can't print this in plastic even though I have seen in person demonstrations of proof of concepts of that.

And the cheap steel problem? Go look up pictures of the "custom" guns used in conflicts like The Troubles. A lot have cracked or split barrels and the like because of that exact issue.

Which, like I said in the comment you refused to read, is why you just buy the hard parts online or in cash at your local gun store (... might need to go to a specialty shop instead of a Walmart). Because they are not controlled since they generally need to get replaced eventually anyway.

At which point? Mills and Printers both work great. It is just that the former needs a lot more machinist skill to be done. Whereas the latter is just downloading an STL.


Just because this topic really intrigues the engineer in me:

Even if you are REALLY anti-gun (moreso in the sense of absolutely zero meaningful gun control laws that don't predominantly target minorities and lower income folk) but can still appreciate an engineering problem:

Vice, back before it was a shithole content farm that talks about how right wing chuds are sticking it to the man, had a REALLY good video where a reporter went to a gathering of 3d printed firearms enthusiasts and even printed their own gun with the help of one of them. There are a lot of uncomfortable parts that kind of felt like fallon tussling the dipshit's hair back in the day, but it is also one of the very few (easily reached on youtube) videos that show what 3d printing a gun actually is.

inRange TV has a video that doesn't get too into the making of a 3d printed gun but does show some of the recent advances (and I believe one of the models shown is quite similar to a certain mario brother's favorite toy...) which is useful from the perspective of how 3d printed parts are coupled to off the shelf parts and so forth.

And while the owner of the channel is a real dipshit and it is explicitly NOT about 3d printed guns (because that would hurt his monetization), Forgotten Weapons did a sponsored video where he turned a common handgun into basically a PDW using a kit. And, in the process of doing that, it really highlights what part of a firearm is the legal and controlled part and what parts can be easily replaced... or purchased in a discount bin. And Forgotten Weapons, in general, is really good at actually disassembling/field stripping firearms to show the inner workings and the engineering. And it is a fun thought process to think through what processes were used to make those parts and what processes could be used to make those parts instead.

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[-] InEnduringGrowStrong@sh.itjust.works 72 points 3 months ago

You can also technically make a gun with generic plumbing supplies or you could finagle one with random garbage and a drill bit.

[-] seathru@lemmy.sdf.org 54 points 3 months ago

Home Depot background checks are next.

[-] werefreeatlast@lemmy.world 7 points 3 months ago

You can fuck someone up real good with a 2X4 ( pronounced two be fore ). Yet I haven't had to pay for a 2x4 ownership license.

You can also really fuck someone up with a big bag of shit...be it actual shit or rocks or concrete or just a bunch of shit from Good will (which could included actual shit). Where do we apply for big bags of shit at the DMB?

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[-] einkorn@feddit.org 18 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

May I introduce you to TM 31-210?

[-] atzanteol@sh.itjust.works 8 points 3 months ago

Background checks for plumbers wrenches next.

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[-] dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world 57 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Anything to avoid having to actually address the systemic poverty and bigotry ingrained in the system that leads to violence...

From what I understand the "problem" as it's being framed in terms of ghost guns and inner city crime or whatever the buzzword is this year is not hobbyists running off a lower or frame for themselves. None of those guys in the hood and their switches are buying Bambus or building Vorons and suddenly turning into 3D printing gurus -- Someone, or several someones more likely, are deliberately mass manufacturing these things for sale to the criminals which is already thoroughly illegal. Find the gun runners and stomp on them. I thought you guys were supposed to have this big scary police force and surveillance apparatus?

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[-] CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org 46 points 3 months ago

Awful. Literally banning science, because it can be misused.

[-] dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world 16 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

We'd better go the full mile. Here's my list of things to be banned, For Our Safety^TM^:

  • 3/4" and 1" galvanized steel pipe and endcaps
  • Cases of matches
  • Acetone
  • Stump killer
  • Milling machines
  • Lathes
  • Drill presses
  • Hydrogen peroxide
  • Salt, Sodium Chloride
  • Stainless steel bolts
  • Benchtop power supplies
  • Sulfur
  • Carbon
  • Water
  • Aluminum foil

I'm sure I can think of others if you give me a minute or two.

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[-] ashley0_0 40 points 3 months ago

new york will do anything but fix actual problems lmao

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[-] A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 37 points 3 months ago

Gonna require background checks to get plumbing supplies or to go to the hardware store? Cause I can make a gun a hell of a lot easier and quicker with that shit, than I can with a 3d fuckin printer.

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[-] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 32 points 3 months ago

Luigi had no background to check.

This is pure flail.

[-] spitfire@lemmy.world 28 points 3 months ago

Some actual gun control laws would be better, not to mention universal health care. What’s next on the list? Kitchen knives? Pans, pots? ;)

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[-] CeeBee_Eh@lemmy.world 28 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Are they going to require background checks for purchasing metal working equipment? Or maybe just make it illegal to bring any metal to melting point without a license.

Because you can make guns with metal.

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[-] tht@social.pwned.page 27 points 3 months ago

This is braindead, are they gonna require background checks for the hardware store next?

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[-] ClydapusGotwald@lemmy.world 26 points 3 months ago

This is second time they trying to pass this bullshit. 2023 https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/bills/2023/A8132

[-] SloppyPuppy@lemmy.world 24 points 3 months ago

What about a bunch of stepper motor and some plastic. Do I need a background check for that?

[-] fluxx@lemmy.world 10 points 3 months ago

Well, everyone knows only main boards have a serial number, so you need a permit for that. But the rest is a spare part, you can get it freely.

/s

[-] Cool_Name@lemm.ee 24 points 3 months ago

Someone go ahead and trademark the term "ghost printer."

[-] Valmond@lemmy.world 9 points 3 months ago

I built my own, so I guess stepper motors and heating elements should also be under the law.

[-] megopie 20 points 3 months ago

Oh boy can’t wait for them to ban two pipes that fit inside each other and a nail.

[-] demizerone@lemmy.world 20 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Any engineer worth their salt can do this without a 3d printer. Idiots.

[-] IphtashuFitz@lemmy.world 11 points 3 months ago

Next up, you’re going to have to register your drill press, lathe, etc.

[-] spitfire@lemmy.world 15 points 3 months ago

How much harder would it be than getting an actual gun?

[-] Disaster@sh.itjust.works 11 points 3 months ago

Road trip to Georgia and back, basically.

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[-] TomMasz@lemmy.world 14 points 3 months ago

Shoot one CEO in NYC and the entire state goes nuts.

[-] Bronzebeard@lemm.ee 10 points 3 months ago

This was in the works before that happened

[-] riskable@programming.dev 8 points 3 months ago

All state legislatures have people that are nuts. Remember: Someone needs to represent the ignorant and stupid and also live there.

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[-] BrazenSigilos@ttrpg.network 13 points 3 months ago

Again. This bill was introduced last year, by the same person, and it died at the time because of some grassroots actions. Now, the wording is slightly different (so it can be introduced again as a "different" bill), and it's being tried again.

[-] Blackmist@feddit.uk 13 points 3 months ago

Surely it would be much easier to require checks to buy ammunition.

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[-] ThermonuclearCactus 12 points 3 months ago

Oh my god it's back? I was hoping we'd seen the last of it back in 2023.

[-] Marvelicious@fedia.io 12 points 3 months ago

Politicians are such profoundly unserious people.

[-] Steamymoomilk@sh.itjust.works 10 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABpc_oPToQQ

This video shows the stupidity of new york

"Printed guns" by " tipsy duck"

[-] enbyecho@lemmy.world 9 points 3 months ago

WTF?

What's next a background check for breathing? Because, you know breathing is a clear and obvious pre-cursor to criming of all kinds.

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[-] werefreeatlast@lemmy.world 7 points 3 months ago

How about one regarding healthcare affordability? We can deal with 3D printed stuff later?

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this post was submitted on 16 Jan 2025
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