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submitted 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) by GrumpyCat@leminal.space to c/piracy@lemmy.dbzer0.com

I know this is a dumb question... But i cant really aford a vpn like at all, is it possible to torrent without using a vpn in the USA or will i get in some trouble and go to jail if i torrent without a vpn?

The reason i cant get a vpn is because im just broke and im young enough to live with family so i cant really get a job.

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[-] Banzai51@midwest.social 20 points 6 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

Do your ISP a favor and use a VPN when torrenting. They will know you're torrenting based on traffic patterns, but they won't know what you're torrenting. That way they don't have to serve you a notice or kick you off their service at the behest of movie or music studios. Your ISP may not care what you're doing, but those businesses do, and the law is on their side.

VPN makes it extremely difficult for your ISP to spy on you, which is the whole point.

[-] ScoffingLizard@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 days ago

Let's just get a VSP from Ethiopia and stop worrying about it.

[-] sun@slrpnk.net 4 points 5 days ago

Unless you use a VPN that supports traffic pattern obfuscation. Mullvad VPN does this https://mullvad.net/en/blog/introducing-defense-against-ai-guided-traffic-analysis-daita.

[-] ftbd@feddit.org 6 points 6 days ago

How will they know you're torrenting if all they see is a lot of wireguard traffic? You could be uploading backups to a remote location for all they know

[-] irelephant@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 6 days ago

Just gettin' a few linux ISOs

[-] Scrollone@feddit.it 4 points 5 days ago

I've been collecting over 10 TB of Linux ISOs this year.

[-] Banzai51@midwest.social 2 points 5 days ago

The nature of uploads/downloads happening with torrents coming and going from disparate sources. Apparently it has a certain network signature that can be identified fairly reliably. ISPs don't really give a shit about WHAT you torrent, but they will try to traffic shape it so it doesn't affect other users on the ISP much.

[-] rumba@lemmy.zip 23 points 6 days ago

What you were doing online is being watched. It is being recorded. Right now, some ISPs will will protect your identity and send warnings to you, to a point. Some ISPs will just give up your information.

They are currently working on legislation to force ISPs just shut you off If piracy is reported.

Right now, for every ISP that I'm aware of in the US, No action is actually taken against you for reports of piracy. But that doesn't mean that this will stay the same, or, that they won't retroactively go on a witch hunt.

You can find VPNs for a couple bucks a month. Make it a birthday request.

[-] Lettuceeatlettuce@lemmy.ml 20 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Don't subject your family to nasty letters in their mail from your ISP. You won't go to jail, but you might risk your internet service getting canceled, which won't be a fun conversation with your parents.

If you're 18 and healthy, go donate plasma at a local clinic. In the USA depending on where you are, you can make $40-$80 per week, sometimes even more if they have a big shortage. Takes about 90 minutes a session, and you just chill with a needle in your arm and browse on your phone, super easy.

Proton VPN's most expensive plan is $108 for 2 years, you can afford that. Go to your friends or neighbors and offer to do some yard work for cash. Mow their lawn, shovel bark, dig up dead shrubs, whatever. That's the main way I made money when I was in my teens. People will pay 20-30 bucks an hour in most places for that kind of work, so a few hours of that in a week or two and you've got your $108 for Proton VPN, or whatever other VPN you want to use.

Sell some crap on eBay, FB marketplace, Craig's List, etc. Old clothes, computer parts, consoles, weights, people will buy anything. You'd be surprised how fast I've gotten rid of junk buy posting it online for 10 bucks.

[-] Lyra_Lycan 8 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Proton smells bad for me, too much of a walled-garden and corporate restriction aesthetic with their services. I would recommend Mullvad or NordVPN

[-] Lettuceeatlettuce@lemmy.ml 11 points 6 days ago

I only mentioned it because it's what I've been using for a while and it's been a good experience so far. Cheap, runs well on Linux, and is one of the few that still allows you to port forward.

There are several good ones to pick from, defs would stay away from Nord because of their advertising practices, but Mullvad is solid. I think they removed port forwarding though.

[-] Dreaming_Novaling@lemmy.zip 2 points 6 days ago

Mullvad did remove port forwarding, and it's the only thing stopping me from cancelling my Proton subscription early. I don't torrent often, but I wonder about getting a seedbox one day, and I'd need Proton.

I honestly don't love them after the idiot board member's Trump praise.

[-] realitista@lemmus.org 6 points 6 days ago

I got one threatening letter (they are uncommon where I live in Czechia but they will write you after a while). I got a VPN and no more letters.

[-] FundMECFS@quokk.au 8 points 6 days ago

Use the Windscribe 10gb per month free. It works well. And if you need more use RiseUpVPN. But note it is slow. And that its completely free and volunteer run. It’s the kind of thing that if you get an income you should probably donate to if you used a lot. It’s mainly used by activists in authoritarian countries.

[-] Kissaki@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 5 days ago

Adding another free alternative; The free Cloudflare Warp for a semi-VPN. You can't choose your output node, but your traffic gets routed through their network.

It can run in proxy mode as well if you prefer only your torrent traffic being routed through it.

[-] Megaman_EXE@beehaw.org 7 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

No idea what happens nowadays also probably depends on your location too, but a friend of mine downloaded fallout 4 when it released and his isp disabled their houses internet until he went to a web page and checked off a box saying "i have deleted the following file(s) from my machine" lol

It was a tame outcome relatively speaking, but it could have been worse.

[-] brainwashed@feddit.org 5 points 6 days ago

I think that depends very much on your jurisdiction and the type of content you download. In Germany when I did things without VPN I most of the time downloaded english content and not the latest blockbusters. Copyright enforcment companies, at least back then, were hired for specific newer movies. Now I have things more automated so I'd rather not risk tripping any wires.

[-] black0ut@pawb.social 2 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Ask people from your country, or look online to see if torrenting is prosecuted there. If people don't get letters from the ISP, you can just enable encryption in your torrent software and forget about it.

I've been torrenting without VPN for a decade (Spain), and never had any issues, not even traffic slowdowns.

Edit: You're probably gonna see a lot of advice to always use a VPN. Most of this advice is from US users, who are not used to torrenting without VPNs. The truth is, as with everything, it really depends. I'm not a fan of generalized answers to questions, and the same advice isn't as good for every situation. VPNs are a barrier of entry, and they also come with a slowdown. If you're starting to torrent and VPNs are not necessary in your country, don't be afraid to torrent without one. But of course, if you're from the US, you'll have to use one!

[-] Rabbit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 51 points 1 week ago

Save your lunch money for however long it takes to be able to buy a year of VPN like Mullvad in your country.

You aren't paying for your internet so you'd be an asshole to put the account holder under scrutiny for torrenting without protection. Especially when they are also covering your rent, elecricity, gas, food, clothing, etc. Don't be a selfish asshole.

If you can't get VPN don't be entitled and go off torrenting because other people say it is fine. You aren't paying for internet so you don't get the privilege to decide if it is fine or not.

[-] SnotFlickerman 15 points 1 week ago

Mullvad stopped allowing port forwarding, sadly, which complicates torrenting. They had valid reasons for dropping support, but it makes it much harder to complete a solid connection via Mullvad.

[-] nfreak@lemmy.ml 8 points 1 week ago

Still sad about this. Mullvad feels like the best privacy-centric choice and I've been using them for a year, but once I set up my media server I realized how vital port forwarding is. Ended up switching to Proton, who I'm still uncomfortable with due to their CEO's political comments earlier this year, but they're arguably the best choice right now.

[-] steal_your_face@lemmy.ml 2 points 6 days ago

Airvpn is supposed to be as private as mullvad but def not as user friendly in my experience.

[-] ShankShill@sh.itjust.works 3 points 6 days ago

It can't be as private as mullvad, it has usernames and they log traffic amounts.

I use them though.

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[-] SnotFlickerman 33 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Private trackers.

In the USA when you are caught torrenting copyrighted material it is because a firm hired by copyright owners sits in the public swarm logging IPs. They then send a warning to your ISP, who in turn sends you a warning.

Private trackers are by their nature a club that tries their damnedest to prevent people working for those kind of companies from joining the site to begin with.

It is still smart to use a VPN but your ISP isn't generally targeting your data in transit itself. It's usually a third party company hired out who cannot see your data streams directly. Thus a private tracker reduces the need for such measures since you are less likely to run into a hired hand logging your IP from a private tracker swarm.

[-] tenchiken@lemmy.dbzer0.com 15 points 1 week ago

This guy torments.

Seriously though, if you are cautious and stick to actual communities instead of just public or private trackers run for glam, you will usually be fine. Communities clamp down really fast if there's a report of virus etc.

The quality of releases typically is far better, since uploading crap like virus or video covered in ads is a dick move™️

[-] emeralddawn45@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 1 week ago

It would be incredibly stupid to still not use a vpn in the states. If a kid who has never tormented before can get an invite to a private tracker, so can a consultant with an antipiracy group. And with a corporate fiber connection and limitless storage budget they could easily sit on thousands of torrents from private sites without having to worry about ratio. The site moderator would never know anything is up until all their users start getting piracy notices, and even then itd be hard to track down the one doing the logging.

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[-] sp3ctr4l@lemmy.dbzer0.com 26 points 1 week ago

If you are broke and cannot afford a VPN, I suggest you use I2P.

https://geti2p.net/en/

I2P is basically an internet protocol that treats all kinds of internet activity in the manner a torrent works.

Basically, you run a local node.

Traffic is routed around in a bunch of anonymized, encrypted chunks, from many different users, which are then bunched up together into packets and encrypted again.

As a client, you can only decrypt the parts of a packet that pertain to you...

But as a node, you help move packets along to every other person who is running a node, in a sort of meshnet like fashion.

The result is a free, but very slow, but also pretty well anonymized way of passing net traffic around...

...and it is also arguably more private/secure than a VPN, which can simply hand over its server logs if legally asked to...

...and it is also arguably more private/secure than TOR, which can have de-anonymization attacks run on it if enough onion nodes, or your entry/exit nodes, are either comprimised or just outright run as honey pots, which is a thing various law enforcement agencies do.

However, another downside to I2P is that it is... considerably more technically complex for most users to actually set up and use properly, than just a basic VPN for switching your geoip to watch Brazillian netflix or w/e.

But, it does allow torrenting and portforwarding, and is totally free.

Don't expect to be able to stream any media with it though, it is again very slow.

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[-] MystikIncarnate@lemmy.ca 17 points 1 week ago

All I'm going to say is that my ISP used to send me notices from the MPAA about what I was downloading and that I should:

  1. Cease and desist
  2. Remove the content I downloaded.

Since I setup a VPN, I do not get those notices.

Do I need to say more?

[-] Kissaki@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 5 days ago

Do I need to say more?

Yes. Did the notices cost you anything, or did you ignore them without consequences?

[-] MystikIncarnate@lemmy.ca 2 points 4 days ago

They were mostly threatening. For me the peace of mind of knowing that they can't really track what's being downloaded to my ISP/my account/me, is enough.

I don't know if the MPAA is going to lose its mind like the RIAA did with the whole Napster thing. I don't want to get caught up in it if they do.

For that peace of mind, I pay for my VPN.

If that's not valuable to you, then you'll make different choices. I'm not here to tell anyone what to do, I'm just giving my experience and opinion.

Good luck out there.

And no, I wasn't charged either for the notice, nor legally charged as the result of a notice.

[-] Enkers@sh.itjust.works 14 points 1 week ago

I'm in a country where there's no legal precedent against torrenting, so it's somewhat safe, but it's still better to use one anyways. You never know when the laws might change, and it's best if there's no record of your IP/timestamp torrenting.

Either way, there's a risk-reward tradeoff of not using one, but the risk is much higher in the US, and if you're made an example of, it could be life ruining. You'll have to decide for yourself if it's worth paying to mitigate the risk.

[-] supervent@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 points 1 week ago
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[-] truxnell@aussie.zone 10 points 1 week ago

Stick to private trackers, the risk of being caught is dramatically lower (harder to get it, smaller user base, companies target the big public ones)

Private tracker security is, at best, security theater. You (a random nobody) can get an invite with nearly no effort. You really think a billion dollar industry can’t manage to get in and spoof as a legit user? There are entire companies that specialize in corporate espionage. Use a VPN (or seed box) even on private trackers.

[-] truxnell@aussie.zone 1 points 6 days ago

They absolutely can of course. However, its easier for them to go after the easier fish that are public and advertise/make profit off work, much the same way a theif will levitate toward the least secure/most attractive house to rob. That said, country makes a huge difference - risk profile between a US citizen and say a Romanian is very different.

Yes and no. They’re going after uploaders, and the vast majority of uploaders post on private trackers. Some may also crosspost to public trackers, but that’s usually after a delay, or a third-party reposting it.

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[-] TheFogan@programming.dev 9 points 1 week ago

Jail probably not... however you will probably get a sternly worded letter from your ISP saying "We know you were torrenting (name of one show or movie you torrented"), This is your first warning.

In short, you won't go to jail, but your ISPs will usually give a few warnings, and then cut off your internet.

[-] Mordikan@kbin.earth 9 points 1 week ago

Its not zero-effort, but you can safely torrent without a VPN using I2P. You'd have to have an I2P router running on the backend and use something like i2psnark to connect. Out of the box, I2P won't work, you have to adjust the config, but after that you could go VPN-less. Two things to consider though: 1. Torrents will run slower. 2. Only trackers inside the I2P network would be reachable.

[-] gravitywell@sh.itjust.works 7 points 1 week ago

If you use only private trackers you can skip the VPN. If you use public ones, your ISP might take issue

[-] Chewy7324@discuss.tchncs.de 7 points 1 week ago

The reason i cant get a vpn is because im just broke and im young enough to live with family so i cant really get a job.

I don't know your situation (and age) but small jobs like delivering newspapers can usually be taken up at relatively you age. They should easily cover a VPN subscription.

E.g. I was delivering newspaper biweekly for a few hours at the age of 13. Even today, the monthly pay would've been enough to pay for a year of my current VPN. Your guardians will have to approve the job but legally it shouldn't be an issue.

If you torrent without a VPN the conversation about a warning by the internet provider on behalf of some rights holder will be way worse than asking about ideas for a small (summer) job.

[-] rami@ani.social 7 points 1 week ago

does anyone still gets a newspaper?

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[-] TachyonTele@piefed.social 6 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

I've never used a vpn while torrenting in the US. Unless utorrent has one built in. Been doing it for 25 years and never had a problem.

People probably won't like that answer, but whatever. It's true.

[-] EpicFailGuy@fedia.io 6 points 1 week ago

Same ... except I recently got my first strike from xfinity ... for downloading minecraft for a friend .... turns out my blacklists don't catch all the honeypots fast enough

Ever since I paid for a years worth of PIA and set up a media box to share with my friends and family cause .... FUCK EM! If buying isn't owning, then piracy isn't theft.

[-] NaibofTabr@infosec.pub 6 points 1 week ago

OK, so what is a VPN?

A Virtual Private Network is a virtual network that lives on top of a physical network. In the case of the Internet, basically what happens is that your network traffic goes into the VPN on one side and comes out of the VPN provider's network somewhere else, rather than out of your ISP's network. All this really does is move any privacy concerns from your ISP to your VPN, which may or may not protect you from any legal inquiries.

For a more thorough explanation look here: https://www.howtogeek.com/133680/htg-explains-what-is-a-vpn/

Is it possible to use torrent without a VPN?

Certainly, however your torrent traffic will be visible to and inspectable by your ISP. If a copyright holder chooses to, they may sue your ISP for the personal information of the person whose IP address matches the illegal traffic that they found. After they have your personal information they can prosecute you directly. A VPN might shield against this by changing the apparent IP address associated with your torrent traffic, but then you are at the mercy of the VPN provider and the government of whichever country they operate in.

It should be noted that if you are not paying the bill for the Internet, and you use it for illegal activity, then the person you are putting at risk is the person who pays the bill. It's their name attached to the ISP records.

If you are caught, or if they just don't like torrent traffic on their network, the ISP may decide that you are simply too much trouble and it's not worth keeping you as a customer, and just cut off your service (for your whole house).

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this post was submitted on 20 Jul 2025
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