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Mitochondria (lemmy.world)
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[-] underwire212@lemm.ee 59 points 1 week ago

Ok. So. Here’s my take.

No high schooler is EVER gonna pay even the slightest bit of attention if we incorporate a “taxes and accounting” class. No shot.

We learn certain general subjects like this in science mainly to learn critical thinking, analytical/logical reasoning skills, how to apply the scientific method (which, yes, can come in handy in many areas of life besides science).

[-] Fredthefishlord 16 points 1 week ago

No high schooler is EVER gonna pay even the slightest bit of attention if we incorporate a “taxes and accounting” class. No shot.

Ask any teacher who's taught it and they'll confirm. People just like to bullshit. They lie about not being taught things they were taught too. I'll bet many had a lesson that went over tax brackets etc and they just ignored it

[-] Doxatek@mander.xyz 7 points 1 week ago

Most of the people I know that complain about not being taught "real life skills" are absolute dumbasses that would have refused to pay attention anyway.

I had also been told this about something before where the guy had poured water on a flat top grill. As it was boiling off be was like "man this is real life right here, if school taught things like this I'd have paid attention" and I was like they did idiot you just didn't pay attention that's literally just water boiling smh lol

[-] Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 6 points 1 week ago

We learn certain general subjects like this in science mainly to learn critical thinking, analytical/logical reasoning skills, how to apply the scientific method (which, yes, can come in handy in many areas of life besides science).

Given your previous claim:

No high schooler is EVER gonna pay even the slightest bit of attention if we incorporate a “taxes and accounting” class. No shot.

What makes you think that they'd be any more likely to pay attention to any other subject matter?

[-] Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 week ago

[…] No high schooler is EVER gonna pay even the slightest bit of attention if we incorporate a “taxes and accounting” class. No shot. […]

Assuming that some high schoolers aren't going to pay attention to the lesson, wouldn't it still be better to at least try to teach something that has real life practical use rather than something that doesn't? At least the people who do pay attention will gain something useful — it doesn't make much sense to me to reduce the overall usefulness of what's taught simply because some may not pay attention.

[-] JordanZ@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago

We had a class like that but it was an elective. It had things like how to balance a checkbook. While I don’t use checks very often I do understand how to manage it. Think I’ve had the same checkbook for 15-20 years. Went over basic tax stuff and interest for loans and whatnot.

I attended public school in a town my parents specifically chose for the schools though. City taxes are crazy because of it but I didn’t realize how much that mattered until I got into college.

Having to peer grade anything in college was excruciating. Even simple stuff like the standard five paragraph essay was a nightmare. The start was something that kinda introduced the topic. Then the conclusion was next followed by a wall of text ramblings that was supposed to be the body?…ugh. So the five paragraph essay was now three and incoherent. The spelling was usually awful as well and It was typed. Like how is that even possible? The computers totally had spell check back then.

[-] biggerbogboy@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 week ago

Well, I am unsure if I agree with that, as my business management class, which had pretty ordinary coursework about it without really anything 'exciting', had a vast majority of students paying tons of attention and actually learning, and half of the class was the stereotypical lazy bum students who acted macho and popular even though everyone hated them.

Although, the people who failed that class failed to the most catastrophic degree, as everyone else was well above passing, certain students got an overall score from 10 to 30% in total for all assessments.

I'm not too sure how standard this type of class is, so the success rate of accounting or other classes could be highly varied

[-] anton 59 points 2 weeks ago

Because the last five years have shown, that we have spend way to much time teaching people biology.

[-] m4xie 8 points 1 week ago

That's exactly what I always say when people repeat this.

[-] Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 week ago

Imo, it's more an erosion of critical thinking rather than a lacking of specific biology facts.

[-] rumschlumpel@feddit.org 49 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

It would probably make more sense to ask the bio teacher for sex ed than economics.

[-] trucy@lemmy.dbzer0.com 37 points 2 weeks ago

It has been taught, you weren't listening during math/economy classes dipshit

[-] Maggoty@lemmy.world 8 points 2 weeks ago

I have never heard of an economy class in high school. And our math teacher did a tiny thing on compound interest in general when we finished a quiz early.

So I don't know what school you went to but it wasn't the normal one.

[-] Prunebutt@slrpnk.net 18 points 2 weeks ago

the normal one.

Apparently, not being American (I'm guessing) is considered "not being normal".

[-] DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social 9 points 1 week ago

I went to an American public school that taught economics. We also had a project for building a household budget.

The county I grew up in was a little bougie, which rather explains it all.

[-] Maggoty@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago

Well no. I freely admit I'm posting about the absolute slop that is American public education.

[-] Bronzebeard@lemm.ee 7 points 2 weeks ago

This is what used to be taught in home economics class. Now it's just sewing and baking.

Knowing math isn't always enough to navigate the oft poorly written tax forms.

[-] ryedaft@sh.itjust.works 8 points 1 week ago

Tax forms change. And some little shit complaining "why do we have to learn percentages? Teach us something useful like how to do our taxes." would make for a better joke. And it would be more accurate.

[-] Prunebutt@slrpnk.net 36 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Lol. Mainstream economics is nothing but ideologically charged excuses for the status quo. And you wouldn't learn heterodox econ in high school anyways.

At least we do know how mitochondria works.

[-] Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 week ago

Mainstream economics is nothing but ideologically charged excuses for the status quo.

Would you mind defining exactly what you mean by "mainstream economics"?

[-] Prunebutt@slrpnk.net 3 points 1 week ago

Anything that's not heterodox. Neoclassicists, Chicago school, etc.

[-] FindME@lemmy.myserv.one 26 points 1 week ago

Frankly, we should move on from the mitochondria and start talking about the immune system. I want pre-schoolers to know about the interleukins, goddamnit! Let the children in first grade recite a list of adjuvants! And somebody ~~shoot~~shoo away vaccine deniers!

[-] ICastFist@programming.dev 10 points 1 week ago

We need to train more medics in the Team Fortress 2 university, so they can shoo AND shoot vaccines at vaxx deniers

[-] Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Instead of focusing on specific facts, what about focusing on honing the skills required to acquire and understand information?

But mitochondria is cool, it has its own dna because it used to be a separate organism. It fused with us, only to be made into a joke by us.

[-] theneverfox@pawb.social 8 points 1 week ago

It also separates raw protons from hydrogen atoms and somehow turns it into spinny-motion, which it then turns into chemical energy with incredible efficiency. It’s a wild piece of biological machinery

If we're going to scrap something from high school to add a tax lesson, let's ditch some literature. Over four years my graduating class studied 5 shakespeare plays and a handful of sonnets. Surely we could have cut out Much Ado About Nothing and The Tempest if we still have Romeo & Juliet, Hamlet and Henry V.

[-] Fredthefishlord 22 points 1 week ago

Reading comprehension is more important than ever ... And you want to cut the classes that teach it? Why?

I'm unconvinced that Shakespeare is a particularly good exercise in reading comprehension given the vocabulary, phraseology, spelling and grammar is 500 years out of date.

I remember reading Hamlet out loud in class, and that was the last of the plays we studied so we had read some Shakespeare before, and every other thing you're running into a sentence that doesn't work or a word that is NEVER said except in Hamlet like 'contumely" or 'orisons' and you just get a room full of teenagers saying words one by one taking none of it on board.

[-] Fredthefishlord 9 points 1 week ago

If anything, learning to understand words from a text without knowing their definition makes it better for that

[-] Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 6 points 1 week ago

I’m unconvinced that Shakespeare is a particularly good exercise in reading comprehension given the vocabulary, phraseology, spelling and grammar is 500 years out of date.

Hrm I'd argue that regardless of the parlance used in the work, it's still an exercise of reading comprehension, as one is still comprehending the work while reading it.

as one is still comprehending the work while reading it.

Especially in something like Shakespeare's case I don't think that's necessarily true, because 1. a lot of the vocabulary is just...not English anymore. Let me ask you: what part of speech is the word "contumely"? Is it a noun? An adverb? An adjective? 2. Not all of the information is there. Shakespeare only ever wrote down the dialog not the stage directions because he told that stuff to his actors in person. Comprehending the play by reading the dialog alone is difficult because the context is missing.

The gravedigger in Hamlet is in the habit of saying "argal." Because he heard someone literate say "ergo" and he uses it right, as a synonym of "therefore" but he doesn't pronounce it right. It's an interesting bit of characterization because it shows the gravedigger maybe should have had a chance at some school. I realized this watching the Kenneth Branaugh production years later when I found it in an old stack of VHS tapes, not in 12th grade listening to my classmate Jeremy try to read it without having it explained to him first. He kept pronouncing it "ARgul" rather than "arGALL" so he never heard himself say the joke.

Perhaps my English teacher could have done a better job conducting this lesson but was this really a useful exercise in reading comprehension?

[-] Don_alForno@feddit.org 4 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

not in 12th grade listening to my classmate Jeremy try to read it without having it explained to him first. He kept pronouncing it "ARgul" rather than "arGALL" so he never heard himself say the joke.

Perhaps my English teacher could have done a better job conducting this lesson but was this really a useful exercise in reading comprehension?

My money is on "your teacher didn't know the joke either".

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[-] fsxylo@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 week ago

I'd argue it does the opposite for literacy. You tell some teenager with a third grade reading level to read "thou prithy foresooth bout thy they thou thumb" and they are going to completely check out.

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[-] Kalcifer@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

What exactly would you want to remove, and what would you propose in its stead, and why?

Surely we could have cut out Much Ado About Nothing and The Tempest

The only subject that was required for all four years when I was in high school was English, and senior year English was all British literature, so we got Chaucer, Shakespeare, the Bronte's, shit like that.

Honestly I think later high school English classes do more to beat any love of reading teenagers have out of them by force feeding them dire dour old ugly hateful and just plain obsolete shit written by damaged people who lived in a world before the invention of epidemiology so sometimes your neighborhood would die of cholera because someone's pit toilet leaked into the ground water.

Make English 4 if not English 3 electives rather than required. Replace them with a semester of driver's ed, taxes, fire safety, how to safely refrigerate chicken, I can think of a lot of shit that would benefit the world more than having teenagers read a Skakespeare play they don't get aloud.

[-] GiveMemes@jlai.lu 7 points 1 week ago

When Americans already can't read, you're seriously suggesting doing away with requiring English for all 4 years? I understand wanting to change the material, but that just seems really heavy-handed and counterproductive.

[-] Microplasticbrain@lemm.ee 5 points 1 week ago

If they can't read by junior year of highschool I very much adoubt fucking Shakespeare is going to be the aha moment

[-] GiveMemes@jlai.lu 3 points 1 week ago

Again, material choice is not the issue at hand.

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[-] Yeller_king@reddthat.com 14 points 2 weeks ago

People seem to be conflating economics and personal finance.

[-] smeg@feddit.uk 14 points 1 week ago

Do you guys call your teachers at school (i.e. not university) "professor"?

[-] shottymcb@lemm.ee 8 points 1 week ago

Not in the US. Professor is for college teachers.

[-] Bronzebeard@lemm.ee 13 points 2 weeks ago

Bio is like a freshman/sophomore course. If you're taking it senior year, you're already behind in life

[-] Maggoty@lemmy.world 11 points 2 weeks ago

It's different in different regions and it's certainly moved around over the years.

And the point remains, we graduate students who know what the powerhouse of a cell is but not how to do their taxes, work a 401k, put together a realistic budget, plan for major purchases, make a work schedule, or have any saleable skills other than being able bodied.

We aren't preparing people for life, we're warehousing them until college and if they don't go to college we just shove them into the cracks.

[-] Bronzebeard@lemm.ee 5 points 2 weeks ago

I understood the point, I agree with that. I wasn't commenting on that part

[-] ftbd@feddit.org 9 points 1 week ago

You only have one year of bio in high school?

[-] Bronzebeard@lemm.ee 6 points 1 week ago

Unless you take AP, where they wouldn't be harping on this particular line about mitochondria, yes. One year of bio.

[-] jol@discuss.tchncs.de 5 points 1 week ago

God forbid anyone taking a different path in life than you...

[-] Bronzebeard@lemm.ee 7 points 1 week ago

School systems set the path, and it's pretty standardized when these subjects get taught. They wait until kids get more math skills for physics classes to take place, meaning the less math heavy subjects go first, like bio and earth science.

[-] MajorMajormajormajor@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 weeks ago

Hey! I resemble that remark!

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this post was submitted on 08 Dec 2024
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