Good to know they've responded to the people's critiques of policing by doubling down on the problem. I hope more people start taking seriously the idea that we don't need the police, and in fact any value they may offer society is simply not worth the violence. We could legitimately make our society function better by disbanding the police entirely
I think the main argument against disbanding the police is that we'd have no mechanism to prevent violence from former cops. I have no expectation that their behavior will improve if we just stop paying them.
Also if we get rid of the police we might as well get rid of a good chunk of the government while we're at it. One of their core functions is to pass laws and with no enforcement arm there's no point having those.
I usually couldn't care less about electoralism, but if any politician has get rid of police and government as their platform, I will vote for them and campaign SO HARD.
Great news is that would be the last time you'd ever have to vote, too. I wonder what kinds of benevolent folks would step into that power vacuum, fun to think about.
This. The actual job of cops is to protect rich b*stards and their stuff from ordinary taxpayers. And making us pay for our own abuse with our own tax dollars.
If that goes away, they'll just hire mercenaries, instead. They won't give up that protection.
"The answer is not to defund the police! It's to fund them! Fund them!!" - Joe Biden
And then he proceeded to give them money to buy more tear gas canisters and armored vehicles and liberals are surprise Pikachu face-ing when statistics like this come out.
In 100 years (if the earth lasts that long) I hope people look back at police abolition the way we look back at the abolition of slavery: as an obvious step towards a more equitable society.
Any examples of thriving modern societies without a law enforcement arm?
Easy. The US does not have "law enforcement."
The police have no duty to protect the law and they do not. They protect capital and only respond to crime after the fact.
and if you're not a member of the favored class they won't respond even then. In fact, they might make your situation worse just to do it. I got pickpocketed in Louisville and the police basically told me that not having my wallet anymore was a problem I'd have to navigate on my own. Later that day they busted me for driving without a license and vagrancy because I was trying to leave Louisville to return home to VA.
I cannot emphasize enough that when people ask questions to me when I say we should dissolve the police and start anew with some new mechanism for handling crime such as "who will you call when you're the victim of a crime" my answer is almost never the police because its very rare for them to do anything useful
My issue with this is the notion that there are thriving modern societies. Our modern world is a complex web of torture and exploitation. The police in my country (the USA) act far more as maintainers of the status quo of torture than they do protectors of the populace from violent crime
In fact, the Courts ruled they don't actually have to protect you at all! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia
EDIT: District Court
Contact the police and tell them that you think that the US police departments are sliding into fascism.
I did that to the local police chief and gave examples when they have acted fascist to me.
They sent "mental health professionals" to interview me. Because one must have mental health problems to see police as fascist ?
Anyways if you do start down that path with the police, then expect their family and friends, and the other agencies with access to your locale will begin to show you what fascism looks like in full force.
Fucking worth it.
The psych part is key too - if they can claim you are mentally ill, not only can they ignore your concerns but they also have a convenient way to dump you in a psych word if you get to annoying.
Friendly reminder that 988 = 911!
I did that to the local police chief and gave examples when they have acted fascist to me.
They sent “mental health professionals” to interview me. Because one must have mental health problems to see police as fascist ?
And now you know why red flag laws are a bad idea
So is this what the MAGAs mean when they say crime is going up, or…?
Imma unpopular opinion
They do dive a little bit into the details, but I think a lot of the details either undercut the headline narrative or are misleadingly presented. E.g.:
despite widespread protests against police brutality following the murder of George Floyd in 2020, overall use of force has remained steady since then – and in many jurisdictions, has increased.
Half of the agencies reported increases in overall force in the two-year period following Floyd’s murder, the report said.
So, basically, it hasn’t changed. And it went up in half and down in half. I mean it is fine if you want to present that result as an indictment of the claims of reform, but the way they wrote the “everything’s getting worse” headline out of that data is weird.
The most common use of force was stun guns, which are considered “less-lethal” but can also have deadly consequences; the organization tracked more than 20,000 stun gun deployments.
In 2022, the group also cataloged more than 8,000 incidents of chemicals being sprayed; more than 4,700 cases of people hit by weapons like batons and beanbags; and more than 2,100 cases of contacts with K9 dogs.
Sounds like, if those are the numbers out of 300,000, then by far the most common use of force (the remaining 264,200) was tackling / wrestling with a suspect. And then they decided to lead with the descriptions of more lurid uses of force that make up 1%-7% of the times that things happened. No?
Then at the very end the whole tone changes:
of the 757 agencies that disclosed types of force used over time, there were 973 neck restraint uses in 2019. By 2021, there were 112 of those cases, a nearly 90% drop.
Jurisdictions with DoJ reform agreements reported a 22% reduction in overall reported use of force, Mapping Police Violence found. And 13 out of 18 agencies that adopted state or federal reforms reported reductions in use of force.
Policies that reduce overall police encounters can be most effective at reducing injuries and killings by police, such as alternative responder programs dispatching mental health professionals to people in crisis, Sinyangwe said. He said he hoped his database would help officials, including a potential Kamala Harris administration, identify agencies in need of urgent intervention. And he hoped to see an expansion of initiatives shown to work.
See this sounds great. It’s like, some reforms are working and some are not (or just aren’t even being attempted in some places), let’s strategize how we can fix the existing and continuing problems. Let’s get a clear eye on what is happening and try to make things better.
If they had led with this, I would have no griping, but the whole headline and 2/3ds of the article is just feeding into the “OH MA GAWD THE POLICE ARE KILLING EVERYONE WON’T SOMEBODY STOP THEM”.
Bring on the downvotes 😃
How many uses of force are justified
Almost none.
It could have been 300,000 armed rapists trying to carjack a mother of 3 to get away
It could also have been Thanos robbing the mayor of Gotham 🙄
Is it possible they’re tracking things better now
Possible, but extremely unlikely. Several jurisdictions have cracked down on reporting police violence and expanded police immunity.
The few progressive prosecutors that got elected promising to do something about police brutality have almost all been run out by cops, Republicans, and conservative Democrats colluding to oust them.
How many uses of force are justified
Almost none.
How do you know this?
Simple: force is very rarely justified in general and cops are trained specifically to react violently to most situations.
Okay so you have no idea what the actual number is; you just kinda have your way that you look at it and that's all you want to know
Got it
This you?
Hey, that's new! Usually people just call me a centrist or do some strawmans. Kudos.
Bring on the downvotes 😃
If you insist...
They kill over 1000 people per year. That number has been rising. That number should be the same each year and it should be zero.
I think this is what the kids call "critical reading abilities"
Thanks for providing a strong counterpoint to the click bait narrative, here's a prize 🏆
Da Police State Enjoyer has logged on
Aw c’mon, what is the point of being all ACAB people together if you don’t have a “yay police” person to all gather around and yell at
I did a quick dig because I wanted to see if the rise in police homicide would trend with population growth and violent crime rates. It did not.
Violent crime has been pretty stable for the past decade. Growth in police homicide exceeded the population growth rate by about 7%, if I did my math right.
I'd like to investigate more when I have the time.
I am europe based. Can I ask why this is such an issue in the US?
Police aren't legally accountable for their actions so long as they're acting in the performance of their duties, and lots of departments knowingly have illegal policies on the books to maintain that immunity for their officers.
People try to sue over it, but the cases are thrown out by the local judge because there's no standing to sue unless the illegal policy had impacted you, so a cop basically has to kill someone before the policies are modified in the smallest way possible, but the killer cop still gets off.
Additionally, police are allowed to lie in most of their interactions with the public. They have created a culture that encourages dishonesty, so perjury isn't an ethical problem in their eyes.
Ignoring problems tends to make them rot faster. Hollywood is superficial, it's all we got. None of the basics are taken care of, it's why I left (e.g. wealth before health). No safety nets, desperation is easy to find. Limited opportunities if you can't afford to do anything. It's an unsustainable way to live, if you call that living. It's more like surviving.
ACAB includes European cops, by the way. Just because they're especially bad in the USA doesn't mean yours aren't also trash.
Not sure which country you're in, but how have your cops been handling environmental or climate protests? or protests in support of Palestinians?
The prisons are for profit and the state gets to keep anything it seizes.
I wonder if we’ll ever connect the dots. The FBI released a report more than 10 years ago that white supremacists have infiltrated law enforcement agencies throughout the country. Sauce: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Supremacist_Infiltration_of_Law_Enforcement
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