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All you do is take!
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this post was submitted on 01 Jul 2026
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My opinion also, but in a slightly darker radical tone that I never share otherwise: bringing someone into this world of suffering is a misguided act of unconscious selfishness and whoever does so owes all available effort to reduce that suffering. In practice, no one is able to acquit themselves of this debt, which is why I hope I never have kids...
that just sounds like anti-natalism and those people kinda weird me out
I think it's exactly that, although that's a name I've only learned of recently... Sorry about the weirding out. I can understand how it sounds when it's not a conclusion you've reached on your own already.
Having your own kids is literally the most selfish thing you can do. You want to spread your genes.
Now before you dogpile, understand this doesn't imply its morally wrong, or bad, or anything of they sort. But it is selfish.
That's a very nihilistic view that implies existence is not worth anything. Personally, I believe that existing is actually beautiful and worth experiencing, even if it sucks sometimes and has inherit suffering. Otherwise we might as well all lie down, stop eating or drinking, and wait for death. Kids don't see the world as suffering and pain — they enjoy every moment with unjaded, curious eyes.
Well, you know, ideally
Nah, this is fake news. I hated being a kid and was passively suicidal. Once I was an adult, I got to trans My gender and be happy.
I have no idea where you get the idea that having kids is selfish. I spend so much of my time, attention, money and love on them. We share their pain, success and all their ups and downs. My wife gave up her career as an architect to spend more time with them.
We take care of them now, and they will take care of us later. That’s not selfish, it’s human. And this might be news for you, but this world was always a rough place to be if you’re not born rich.
And if you’re hinting that your kid's CO2 footprint and consumption potentially contribute to climate change, you’re also forfeiting their chance to contribute to positive changes.
You're the meme. Did they asked to be there? Yes you're "giving" them a lot of your energy, but they are owed that. That's not generosity, that's responsibility.
Having kids is inherently selfish. Prove me wrong! Name a single reason to have them that doesn't involve you.
By that logic taking care of a pet or senile relatives is also selfish. Or working as a missionary, or emergency worker. It boils down to the question if being selfless is in itself a selfish decision.
Were we just stupid? Naive? Following our biological program? I don’t know. But I know that I love my children above all else and would throw myself under a bus to save them.
I guess it can be hard to imagine loving someone without expecting anything in return, if you haven’t received that kind of love yourself.
The big difference here is that these individual already exist. You're not creating a life for your own amusement.
I think it’s more that the act itself, of having the child, is a choice that is made without the consent of the life being brought into the world. Every child is forced into existence through decisions that are not their own.
Of course, it’s impossible to get consent from the violated party, but it’s still a decision parents take for their own reasons, not the child’s reasons.
The kid didn't need to exist, you made them do so because you wanted something from them for you or those around you, things like love, something to care about, a helping hand etc. That is selfish by definition.
That is selfish AND human. Although something being human isn't very relevant, considering things like greed or ill will are also human.
Wanting future generations to fix climate change is also pretty selfish, so it's a bad example. They're also likely to be powerless just like us.
Of course, not having kids in order to not make them suffer is also selfish, but It causes the least ammount of pain, well, except for the part where you will have to take care of yourself when older, but thats our problem.
There are indeed misanthropes, but they're also a very small minority.
I agree with you. I often challenge people to give one selfless reason to have a child, just one.... to this day, no one has been able to give one reason. When you look at it, having a child is a selfish action
There are plenty of reasons that aren't selfish. You can do it for humanity, for justice, for style points, for Narnia... If you want to logick those into being selfish, that's your own moral framework talking. Every action is a subjective choice from a subjective perspective in the end, but people can still have non-selfish intentions, however misguided you may judge them.
For humanity? We are over 8 billion people in this world, you think humanity needs another one to share resources ? Let me guess your's will be special of course, better than all the rest. For justice ? I don't even understand your logic here. It's not subjective it's just selfish, you are not having a kid for the good of others, you having one because you want one, consequences be damn
I think you're missing the point. Having a child for Narnia is not selfish, it is literally for the good of Narnia to have another strong Narnian. But you're operating under a moral framework where even the good of Narnia is ultimately good for the Narnian, therefore it is selfish to want Narnia to be strong.
Do you have to agree with the idea of a strong Narnia? Of course not. But it's a very narrow way of thinking to explain every human motivation through selfishness.
Ura Narnia!
To give someone a chance to experience the pleasure of living.
To contribute to the world an additional person of quality and integrity.
You probably just haven't been asking very thoughtful or articulate people.
God bless your heart if you are this naive 🦄🌈. In the real world pleasure is the exception, pain and death are a warranty in this world. I'm sure you can warranty you'r Kid will be 100% healthy, live a life free of trouble and pain 🫅🏻
@thepig in my experience these folks think everyone is either rich or has zero disabilities of any kind when thats actually about .00000001% of humans. Or theyre really young and have no idea how much life sucks (but make the best of it anyway if youre here)
True. I am not religious or even spiritual, but I gotta admit that the budists got it right when they say "suffering is a fundamental constant in life". Thinking everything will be sunshine and rainbows is not optimism, it's just being naive.
Might not be selfless as such, and I'm not in any position to speak for women in general, but when that biological drive kicks in, it can do so pretty damn hard.
That's still satisfying your own need, but perhaps more subconsciously so than people having children without thought or care.
Me and my wife agreed on not having children when we were young, but we've never regretted the son we got after a pretty radical twist in our mid 20's. I could go on, but it's complicated.
In today's world, if I were young again, I'd never even give it serious thought, though. Different times, although it doesn't feel that long ago.
In all honesty, lots of people have children not even because they especially want to, but because they feel obligated to by their role in society. That's not a reason many people are likely to give, but it's not a selfish reason.
It is selfish, you have a kid because you don't want to handle other people's opinions about you, giving in to the pressure is easier that standing your ground, more comfortable to. So because you don't want to argue with your parents and deal with the backlash, you decide to bring another human being into existence. That's pretty selfish
Meeting your obligations is the most unselfish thing you can possibly do. Doing things out of obligation to others is the fundamental unit of unselfishness.
Not really, standing up to what you know is right, even when it gets you criticism, that is not selfish. Doing things cause people tell you to do and you don't want to bother going against the flow cause it's uncomfortable is pretty selfish. What obligation ? Our planet is over 8 billion people, do you think the human race is going extinct? It might very well go extinct if people keep pumping up children like there is no tomorrow, consequences and lack of resources be damn, I want a kid.
@thepig oh man, sooooo many people fit this mold. "Because I have to. Because its what you do". No. Its not. You dont have to do ANYTHING.
Indeed, I do not want to shame people who decide to have a bunch of kids if they truly want to, but they should really think about their choices and the consequences, because at the end of the day, those people that pressured you into having a kid will not help you if things go wrong, I'm talking about mental and physical illness, I am talking about financial destitution, I'm talking about accidents, and 1001 other things that can happen
Are all selfish actions bad?
If you truly believe what you say, don’t just hope you don’t have kids. Either get fixed or don’t have sex.
And I already put my money where my mouth is, I got fixed to ensure I will never get pregnant.
Edit: Sorry if I come off rude in a comment like this. As the daughter of a man who didn’t want his kids and blamed my mom for getting pregnant, I get really frustrated when I see guys “hope” they don’t have kids or when guys whine about taking care of the kids they didn’t want. Don’t want kids? Get fixed or don’t have sex.
The dude I replied to understood that and started the process. It’s sexy when guys take control of their fertility like that. More men should be like this guy.
You're totally right. I really should, and I will.
EDIT: I actually started scheduling a vasectomy right now. I had wanted to do one before but things were a little more complicated then and it had slipped my mind in the meantime / did not seem as relevant. Now is a perfect time however.
Thank you for getting me moving again.
Honestly dude, good for you! And I promise I’m not being facetious here. I’m super happy you got motivated to get a vasectomy. I had my fallopian tubes removed a few years ago and it was a massive weight lifted off my shoulders to know I will never again be pregnant.
I’m really fucking proud of you for taking that step!
@NoSpotOfGround yeah simply put youre totally right. Sure, there's good in this world (if youre rich) but lets face it, life is mostly bad and we would all rather be having an eternal slumber instead. We are just here making the most of it because we have to. Say this in public IRL and youll be utterly crucified though. To me its just logic. If you have a kid either by accident or choice, I dont care. But dont make me feel like its required.
The more selfish you are, the harder it is to be a good parent.
That being said, not everyone should have children, and: "I was a perfect parent too before I had kids."
Not all parents are like what you think.
Existing is more pleasurable than not existing, and you can always choose to stop existing if you want. On balance, it is better to be born than not to be.