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Unfathomably based
(lemmy.world)
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this post was submitted on 28 Jun 2025
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capitalism wouldn't be so bad without the corrupt bloated shitheel scumbag fucking christofascligarchs
Capitalism grantees they rise to power.
systematic removal of regulations and consequences has enabled greedy corporate dickbacks to sieze power.
systems are made of people. To make a better system, you need better people.
You're wrong. Capitalism is, by definition, a "winner takes it all" system. The logical endpoint of competition between private entities is the consolidation of one of those entities, and once economy of scale plays a role, reversing that is almost impossible. And once a private entity has significantly more economic power than the others, it can manipulate regulations and consequences. Capitalism explicitly rewards by design being greedy
Yes, and that's capitalism. The regulations are antithetical to capitalism, but they're also the only thing keeping us slightly safe from it. Yes, making capitalism less capitalist makes it a lot better. We can have a better system that's just better, with the people that exist.
I think a lot of people misunderstand capitalism in the same way other people misunderstand communism.
What you said is absolutely wrong, regulations are not antiethical in capitalism, they are necessary for the free market to remain free.
The system we see today is a corruption of capitalism the same way Stalinism is a corruption of Communism
A regulated market is by definition not a free market.
The Supreme Court specifically, they gave US citizens united, and then unlimited executive power. Now we’re fucked being most hope.
They always do, regardless of the economic system.
I would not describe any communist or socialist leader as a Christian Fascist Oligarch.
it sure does with small government.
remember there are countries that enjoy capitalism without the 5 ring circus shitshow we have going on in the states
So far, but corruption is always the end result.
i'm not trying to simp for capitalism, but corruption can and does happen under any system
Give Europe a bit more time. They'll get there.
Those countries are headed towards that circus at varying paces, so that argument doesn't work anymore. I mean Germany? France? Sweden? Britain? Italy?
The problem with capitalism in a representative democracy is that is almost impossible to maintain a perfectly sized government. If the government asks for too many taxes (on an extreme level) etc the market doesn’t function anymore. The “free market” needs some level of class difference to make profit attractive and keep people committed to their jobs. Because of these differences class conflict is created and through privately owned newspapers, corruption and short term economic gains regulation’s get liberalized. This results in wealth accumulation, the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. This then leads to the social and economic conditions that allow for the rise of the populist right.
As a European I can currently see this happening in all countries to which I pay attention (namely Germany, Netherlands and Britain).
Capitalism ultimately rots into authoritarianism through wealth accumulation.
Capitalism is always bad, because capitalism is where an ownership class who does no work leeches from a working class who owns nothing.
Don’t confuse free markets with capitalism, they’re different.
Genuine question. How do you have free markets without the existence of capital and the pursuit of its accumulation?
The definition of capitalism per the dictionary is:
How do you have free trade without people who own things trading them?
Capital has existed far longer than capitalism has.
I mean, this feels semantic. The word capitalism is obviously of the modern era, but there are governments and economic systems going back to antiquity that I think meet all of the definitional requirements of "capitalistic."
Really, I just lack a vision of what "free trade but not capitalism" could possibly mean. Could you describe that system for me?
When I try to do so, the result always meets the literal, dictionary definition of capitalism, as listed above.
It's definitely semantic, but semantics is the reason we use different words for different things.
Anyway, "free trade but not capitalism" would just be anything where you can buy and sell stuff, but without the individual owner class. It can be part of anything. Let's say workers own their workplace. They still get paid, and they can use that money to buy what they want. That isn't capitalism, but it still has free trade. Free trade is one component that is required in capitalism, but it isn't exclusive to it.
Edit: Also, something can be capitalistic without being capitalism. It can have characters related to capitalism, but not meet all the requirements.
This is the huge problem with the wider debate; hardcore leftists have a very specific well-defined meaning in mind when they use the word "Capitalism", whereas the majority of the general public think "Capitalism" just means "you can start a business if you want".
"Neoliberalism" doesn't work in most rhetoric either because it's got the word "liberal" in it. We need a new word that's unambiguously understood to refer to the specific components of capitalism that are objectionable.
Which "specific components of capitalism" would you say are not objectionable? It's essence is the private ownership of the productive forces of society and the derivation of profit by selling the product. The core of it is objectionable from the view of democracy or egalitarianism.
Well you have mercantilism, which was the predecessor of capitalism
Basically, the difference is the role of government. Think of it in feudal terms - a noble owns a mine, owns an expedition, uses their soldiers for both security of their land and their monetary interests. As far as raw resources/resource producing land, you couldn't buy that without buying a title first
But it's a line that blurred as time went on. If you're a leather worker, that leather came from an animal owned by the king or by livestock owned by a noble. So you're paying taxes on the inputs, but you can probably sell stuff freely - although imports and exports might be taxed. And if you're a merchant, you might buy spices from one noble and sell it to others
But the means of production were owned by a noble - they owned the land and the serfs that work it, they own the animals and the mines.
As time went on, it kinda faded... Maybe you sell the rights to mine a site, maybe you partner with a merchant to go on an expedition for spices, maybe you just require a permit to hunt on the land, and so on
But then as supply chains gets more complicated, you kind of naturally evolve into capitalism
That’s what capitalism is.
Anarchists still believe in trade.
Corruption is an inherent part of capitalism
Capitalism is the accumulation and hoarding of wealth at all costs. Exploitation and abuse are foundational concepts. There is no ethical or moral version of such a system, and so no version of it that “wouldn’t be so bad.” It is immorality and evil distilled into a code of conduct.
There's a reason capitalism is essentially counter to the teachings of all major world religions, many of which are extremely authoritarian in their own way.
One aspect of modern capitalism is predatory loans, which every Abrahamic religion has writings against.
It's pretty telling most religions would not go as far as "poor people can go fuck themselves" despite being used to control people through fear over millenia but the end game of unchecked capitalism is truly as simple as "poor people can go fuck themselves"
AKA the inventors and vanguard of capitalism.
Capitalism only works when heavily regulated, because human greed is a cancer to everything it touches.
It's the basic idea behind ordoliberalism – companies get free reign until their actions start harming the common good, at which point the government imposes fair rules to even the playing field. It's... reasonably functional as far as political theories go. Still wildly suboptimal, though, and not long-term stable against the influence of hyper-wealthy entities.
That regulation is antithetical to capitalism. Yes, it's the only thing that keeps it functioning in a reasonable manner, but that's just an indication capitalism is bad.
Yes, less capitalist capitalism is better than more capitalist capitalism. Maybe we should just have none.
That's the problem. The system prioritizes wealth accumulation above all else. When you build a society that views wealth as the highest state of being then those regulatory systems will eventually be bought out.
There may well be no such thing as a sustainable regulated capitalism, especially when we've normalized the monetization of everything.
capitalism is amazing as long as it not allowed to run rampant. stricter regulations and safety nets (usa) would make the whole risk/reward game of capitalism more palatable imo
Salt and pepper make dog shit more palatable too. Instead of seeking to make bad things palatable, can we try something different instead?
Please tell me, when exactly has capitalism been amazing?
They're confusing free market with capitalism most likely.
Yup. Most things go bad if not fixed and out of control. Moderation is key. The problem is the people in charge don't want a good system. They want a system they can control.
They will do anything but a fair system because then they would lose control.
That's saying a grilled cheese wouldn't be so bad if it didn't have cheese. At that point it ain't a grilled cheese anymore so why even try to defend it in the first place? Just eat some god damn bread
I used to believe this...
Uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuh
Gee I wonder why a system that rewards people for being corrupt … oligarchs keeps producing corrupt … oligarchs?