This is anti-American legislation. And as the Supreme Court established, its unconstitutional. If these territories are US soil, then the people born there are US citizens. If this bill isn’t rescinding US sovereignty it’s just more illegal, racist bullshit.
Republicans who support this are just racists. No more. No less. Whether these Republicans are insane, incompetent, or evil, they are simply wrong. Stop discriminating against American babies!
Republicans ~~who support this~~ are just racists.
At this point, if you're still hanging around with the fascists, you've become a fascist.
This is a fair criticism. We are deep into a second Trump Presidency so there's no more excuses to being ignorant of the complicit fascism. We live in the information age of the 21st Century. It's past time to be ignorant or ill-informed of softly supporting evil.
Immigration law in the US is and has always has been racist. The first federal immigration law was called the Chinese Exclusion act for fucks sake.
Oh look, the fascists are doing racist shit. Must be a day that ends with a “y”.
And yet I'm sure these great thinkers don't want to admit any of these territories as states, and they don't want to relinquish their claims over them, so... What? They want to create an underclass of people on US soil who aren't a part of any nation?
Disgusting.
I mean, yes, they want to create an underclass of people in US soil by any metric possible.
That's, like, literally the entire point of conservatism.
It would end up probably like American Samoa, which its people are U.S. Nationals, not citizens.
John McCain wouldn't have been a citizen if this law had been in place at the time of his birth.
Not that they give a shit.
isn't it the opposite? They want to end the automatic citizenship by being born in the territory not when parents are citizens
The Republican party now recognizes that McCain was a loser, because winners don't get caught. If Trump wanted to revoke McCain's citizenship post-mortem, some scumsucker in the House would draft a bill.
Okay but anyone born in DC doesn’t get to be a citizen either.
These people are so hateful.
Most people in DC are pretty progressive, actually
I meant kids born to politicians working in DC would not be citizens.
I don’t actually want any of this. I was just making a point.
Politicians are rich. For every rich family, you have like a dozen families supporting their existence.
So the vast majority of the DC population is not rich, and they're mostly progressive.
That isn’t relevant to my point.
This is about politicians causing harm to other families in a way they would be upset about if it happened to them.
My point was that if DC was treated the same they wouldn’t do it. And, if they wouldn’t allow it to happen in DC they should not be doing it to other people either.
They just want to hurt brown people.
Again, I am not actually advocating for people in DC to not be US citizens. I was just pointing out their hypocrisy.
So they got shot down in court (by their own hand-picked court, no less!) for trying to do this nationwide, and now they think they can do it in US territories, like that's a special case where the US Constitution doesn't apply?
They can do it in the territories. The ones that grant citizenship by birth were giving that through Congress passing laws for it. American Somoa does not grant citizenship by birth, instead its people are U.S. Nationals, but not citizens.
All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States
Are US territories not in the United States? The language of the 14th amendment seems quite clear on this.
They are, but they are treated differently. Through a bunch of racist decisions the supreme court allows them to be treated differently. They felt that the people of the territories weren't civilized enough to participate in our democracy. They're called the Insular Cases and very racist.
Congress eventually passed laws granting citizenship to people in the territories, except American Samoa.
The 14th applying to the territories has been ignored repeatedly by the courts.
Make it retroactive, then kick everyone out back to their country of origin.
Let the natives take back their land and govern in their ancestral way.
Problem solved.
Republicans: Yes, I support this, because I am from America and obviously it means they'll kick out everyone but us.
Not that they care, probably, but doesn't this run against UN conventions because these people would essentially be stateless?
Birthright citizenship is by no means the standard. It's not rare, but most of the world does not use it. Most of them are in the Americas, but that whole thing gets complicated.
Most countries grant citizenship to the children of their citizens. IOW, the child inherits citizenship from its parents. If nothing else, the mother is going to be known by nature of the birth, and the child would have at least her citizenship.
(Exceptions exist, but they exist for Jus Soli as well)
This is true. I was thinking of some worst-case scenarios as to implementation where they decide that those people who gave birth to those children weren't really American or whatnot. I would not put it past the administration to deny applications for any and every reason they think they can get away with.
UN conventions because these people would essentially be stateless?
You think the cult cares?
Trump doesn’t care about the UN or international law.
Or any laws, really, unless he’s using them to oppress people he doesn’t like.
Twofold thoughts on this. First, it's the same thing they do everywhere: if they can't get the big win, they start chipping away at the edges, the fringe cases that let them establish precedents they can use later.
And secondly, it's a defensive move, to further differentiate the territories from the states, so that future efforts to give statehood to these areas will fail. In a really cynical viewpoint, it establishes subservient status for territories, including future "acquisitions" like they keep referring to
Wouldn't that be unconstitutional unless those territories are removed from US jurisdiction?
Colonies*
Is this news? They have stated they want to and attempted to end birthright citizenship more then once.
I think that when it comes to immigration and birthright citizenship, I feel that the process should be formalized and designed to prevent anchor babies.
At the time of birth, the baby receives the remaining time the mother has to possessing her own citizenship. If she has a year left to receive hers, the baby gets their own within a year. If the immigrant mother already has citizenship, so does the kid.
All adopted children and immigrants automatically begin incrementing their citizenship automatically while staying on US soil, the ticker to eligibility pausing if they don't reside within the nation. Once the amount of required time has passed, the immigrant/child can decide whether to accept citizenship. The nation can't refuse granting citizenship.
Citizenship offers full Universal Income while jobless and the ability to vote for political elections, but immigrants can still vote on their workplace policies and leadership. Criminals can still earn citizenship automatically, and any task they do within prison, still counts as a full fledged job.
000000
This is part of my Universal Living concept, which has Universal Income, Universal Services, and Universal Ranked Income. Citizenship is 20 years automatically, the time reduced by a ranked job held by the immigrant. The highest ranked job like being an astronaut earns citizenship within 4 years, while an entry level job like McDonald's worker gets their citizenship within 8 years. Immigrant students are grade based, needing 10 to 20 years. Each day within a job rank or student grade contributes towards shortening the automatic citizenship.
The express terms on the document as of now is ALL PERSONS. It doesn't matter for times or what have you. All persons at the moment of birth. Don't like it? Then pass an Amendment that says otherwise. But, the reason for the wording as is now was the bullshit games that the conservatives and the South played after the Civil War.
Personally, I am arguing that the United States need a complete overhaul. The founding documents were not designed for a modern nation that spans from coast to coast, in a globalized world. The founding fathers were intelligent and capable, but they are still just people of their time.
Thus, I write about possible systems for a rekindled nation.
I am arguing that the United States need a complete overhaul.
Honestly? I'd support just a breakup. The blue states could do so much more if we weren't carrying the dead weight of the red states. They can fester and die in their shit holes all they want!
It is certainly one of many paths we can have with the United States. Maybe the union continues, perhaps we end up in Thiel's techno-feudalistic hellhole. The only thing that seems certain, is that there will be a lot of pain in the future. 😔
there will be a lot of pain in the future. 😔
Conservatives need to start suffering the consequences of their actions and stop mooching off the hard-working states.
Hell yeah let's make children responsible for their parents actions!!! Let's make even more stateless people!!!
As I mentioned in other threads, there is a Universal Services concept that allows EVERYBODY to have basic shelter, food, utilities, transport, and so on. Money is for luxuries, and the Universal Income is for citizens. While it would suck for immigrants and children without full citizenship to not receive a full basic income, it also prevents weird mechanics. For example, someone marrying dozens of girls, just to tap into the UBI of their children.
Policies are tradeoffs between prosperity, security, anti-corruption, and so on. There is no such thing as a perfect solution, just mitigations of the worst outcomes.
However, we can try to design the mitigations and tradeoffs to be optimal for their intent. For example, as someone accrues citizenship while living within the nation, they unlock increasing levels of Universal Income. So someone who has lived in the nation for 3 years, gets $3,000* UBI each year.
0000
*Because the concepts of Universal Living is based on a completely different economic approach, inflation of currency isn't recognizable by current standards of US cash. Especially if there are wealth and asset caps, paired with fixed job incomes.
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