The end goal of debates is not to change your opponent's mind, but to present your ideas and reasoning to the people watching in a convincing way.
I stop when it is clear the other person is arguing in bad faith.
The block button is your strongest weapon against trolls.
It also helps teach you about your own opinions, and helps you learn new things even if the person you're taking to is a moron (because you have to research stuff to debunk their bs)
Sometimes in public forums my goal is to show the neutral third parties who might stumble upon that thread to see for themselves which view is more reasonable. Bad faith arguments that are common sometimes need to be knocked down whenever and wherever it persists.
Mostly I just like thinking about interesting things and putting those thoughts to paper. But sometimes people online seem to take that as a direct challenge and argue about literally anything. From the definition of a word, to my anecdotal experiences being incorrect (lol). Luckily I've only had to block a few people so far, but they've been the type where their entire comment history reads like a 4Chan thread.
No u
when a bunch of nerds (complementary) hate misinformation, lies, and ignorance on the internet enough, they all get together and make a wiki. its a beautiful, natural process. not all nerds will contribute to a wiki, but all of us will have some feelings about it.
Mostly, yes a lot!
Writing about my thoughts, opinions and positions has helped me understand them even better!
You're rarely going to change anyone's position online, as sadly most aren't arguing in good faith. BUT responding to rebuttals from others and questions (good faith or bad faith) leads to a very cool intellectual exercise where you get to probe your positions from so many different angles.
If things become toxic or brain-rotty, then you can just disengage without explanation! Kinda cool actually!!!
There's a weird dynamic to arguing online, particularly when it comes to political topics. Most of the time, you won't convince your counterpart. Maybe some point sticks with them later and you'll never know, but either way they're not really the target of the arguments. It's the (potential) audience that the argument is supposed to be for: People less emotionally invested in the conflict may take away something useful from the arguments, people on the fence about an issue might come around to your point, and people sharing your opinion will see that they're not alone and feel affirmed.
Essentially, it's a performance on an public stage for the sake of discourse. Phrased strongly, you don't want "the other side" to dominate the public opinion, so you engage them. In the process, you may hone your own arguments, or you may find them wanting, perhaps even see them start to crack.
I used to enjoy it a while back, now not so much. As long as people understand this is not how you change the world, you are doing this for yourself.
I don't want to be on my death bed wishing I had argued more, so I'm doing what I can while I'm young and ornery
I don’t have any friends still alive to argue with so I gotta fuss at sonsabitches I don’t know!
Laughs in does not read replies
Same. If they're dumb it's not worth the effort.
It is fun arguing with people you disagree with as long as both argues in good faith and has uses good etiquette. Both needs to be open minded to a certain degree.
The goal of a conversation is not to convince, but rather to explore your own and their mind. To grow together. A conversation is not a competition, we should not aim to "win" a conversation.
No it isn't. I win!
Of course it was.
They were wrong. How are they going to know they are wrong if no one tells them?
To be fair, when you try it in person, they're all "Who are you? How did you get in my house? I'm calling the cops!", then it's no fun at all.
I can answer with confidence: sometimes!
Generally speaking, I don't argue with strangers on the internet with the goal of changing their minds or "educating" them. I mean, I do start with that intention...who doesn't? But by the time I am finished, I realize that I'm just clarifying my own thoughts and positions in my mind.
Absolutely. There’s way too many blithering idiots online. We made the web way too accessible to them back in the ‘90’s.
And if idiots don’t get challenged, you run the risk of them thinking they’re actually right. And that’s very, very dangerous.
I will admit the only reason I attempt to verbally correct them is because I don’t have access to a Reaper drone to shove a Flying Ginsu missile up their ass.
Ask the Russian military industrial complex. They turned a world super power into clown world.
Apparently it is worth it when you automate it and put it on steroids. You can see lost souls everyday repeating their bullshit
Everyone should have a bot army, maybe we can destroy the Internet together 😊
Before I realized there was no point 99% of the time, I didn't think it was a waste of time. Now if I'm feeling generous I think, at least on a platform like Lemmy, best you can hope is like 10% of the time you plant a seed for the person with a wrong idea or opinion that will eventually lead them to a better understanding. I certainly know that's happened to me before when I was wrong. So often, people make the online exchange feel awful though. There's a prominent attitude in many extremist/wrong viewpoints that not only are they right, everyone who thinks differently is an evil asshole.
It's not just for the person you reply to, but also for anyone else who may come across this thread. That's how I see it anyway.
yes.
Other people in this thread have already said it better than I could but in brief: Yes
This is one of the core principles of modern social media platforms.
Was it worth it?
Well, we're clearly sitting on a picturesque beach on the Spanish Med, so... yeah? Sure, getting SWATted was no fun, and the bogus restraining orders were a real hassle, but ever since we had no choice but to leave the US things got a lot better.
Now, how about some sunscreen babe? You're gonna burn like that.
Its my crack I can't stop coming back to all while hating every second of it
Us not pushing back on the bullshit and rightwing conspiracy theories is part why we're in this mess!
It was the arguing that taught me when not to argue.
If you think you can get beyond pleasure without going through it, we are definitely on different trips. - Zen Without Zen Masters
well, it's not like i have something better to do, lacking an ocean and a nice rock to sit on in the sun.
Oh, I'm about to argue with one right now you little dumbass
It’s my favorite hobby.
At this point, every comment on Lemmy is greeted with angry responses who are willfully choosing to ignore the point I was making and try to fight me.
If I say “I like dogs” someone is going to come along and tell me I’m a jerk for not liking cats even though I didn’t say I don’t like cats. That or someone mansplaining dogs to me.
Calm down Lemmy. Take a breather.
Nope. Even at the time I know its a bad idea. Theres a certain allure to it though. I cant always resist the bait.
What is the Venn diagram of "People who can't stop arguing in online forums" and "People who have become addicted to obsequious, flattering LLM chats?"
Is there any overlap? Is it perfect overlap? Is it some boring in-between answer?
I feel like there's little overlap. The rush you get from arguing is very different than the feeling of getting your ass kissed.
I made hella dorks melt down on the Dorf fortress message board back in the day so yes
If only I could know that the ones I am arguing are actual humans not just bots. In the former my arguing could be fruitful and turn them to not vote any longer for the right extremist party in my country.
God no. In retrospect, it's hundreds to thousands of hours of my time I could have just blocked them and been helpful to others or enriched myself. If someone really wants to argue bullshit on the internet, they're doing nothing but wasting what time humanit has left here.
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A collection of some classic Lemmy memes for your enjoyment
