Yes, but, if you can’t produce plausible bullshit on your own you’re not going to get very far.
if 90% of jobs can be replaced by AI bullshit, why tf do we even need to work? Why shape society so you must do shitty non existent jobs to survive?
May I introduce you to the work of David Graeber on this exact subject? Bullshit Jobs
I forgot that he also wrote that. I read “the dawn of everything” which is one of the most mind-blowing revisions of history I've ever seen. (In a good way, for once)
Automation should enable UBI, in a decent society. But since our current leaders will never implement UBI, automation is a crime against the working class who need jobs to survive.
Correct answer, we are already in the UBI realm of not needing enough workers. The question is where the world goes from here. I'm currently betting on some dystopian societal structure we're 90% of people are fucked. So glad I'm older without kids.
if 90% of jobs can be replaced by AI bullshit
Well, to start, they can't.
At least not by these LLMs that keep getting touted as AI.
The thing that this person seems to have either forgotten, or not understood in the first place, is that homework, and your education in general, is not for the teacher, it's for you. If you choose to cheat your way through you will gain less than if you actually put the work in yourself. This gets more important the further through education you go.
Probably the best outcome for an essay question is if you discuss it with your friends, all share your understanding of the subject, then write it up individually, incorporating anything new you learned from your discussions.
This does come with the issue that those who cheat could end up getting good grades if there is no 'live' check of their understanding, either through closed book exams, class tests, group discussions, or similar.
Indeed, it's not that LLM is totally uncorrelated to factual basis, it is correlated well enough for most educational fodder that is supremely well trodden and doesn't seek surprises. It's practice with backgrounds the teachers can actually already know and credibly provide feedback on. It's so well known that any teacher knows, so it's correlated with AI output that has been trained on verbatim prompts and essays that are on the exact same topic, and so the narrative correlated with the prompt is just very likely to also correlate to the facts of relevance.
Just like a pocket calculator can make short work of elementary school math. It's not that we expect those kids to do some crazy novel stuff that calculators can't do, it's just that they need to operate in a context to actually illustrate they have the foundational understanding.
You were so close. Right up until you mentioned closed book exams. How many times in your job have you ever not been allowed to look something up? The reality is that closed book exams only test your memorization capabilities and some of us don’t memorize shit very well. The best teachers allow open book exams because if you know where the information is then you can find it in time but if you don’t know where the information is you’re not gonna be able to take the test in the time given.
How many times in your job have you ever not been allowed to look something up?
It's rare, but not unheard of, that I can't look things up, but the point of closed book exams is is to demonstrate that you know the subject well enough that you don't need to look things up. Obviously, exactly what this entails is going to vary depending on the level if the exam. If it's testing foundational knowledge, then it should all be in your head, if it's more advanced, a crib sheet with key facts (say certain more complex, but necessary, equations for a non maths subject, or similar support prompts).
If you're working, you can't be stopping every few minutes to look up basic information. A computer programmer who has to keep looking up the syntax of their language, or basic algorithms, for example, won't get very far.
The algorithms one in particular is a bugbear of mine, because if you don’t already know the computational complexities of the operations on the common basic data structures then no way are you taking the time to look them all up each and every time you declare one. And yet one of the bitchwhiniest complaints I frequently see online about coding interviews is how dare hiring managers ask you to prove you understood CS201 Data Structures & Algorithms…
I’m a language teacher. It happens all the time that I want to say something and can’t look it up. Think about the last time you were in a group of six or more people: the conversation doesn’t stay on one topic long enough to look up a word before responding to someone’s comment. I also wouldn’t want to take a moment to double check a word and hold up the whole line when the cashier at the grocery store asks me a question.
Homework is not to measure anything is to force you to make the work so your brain develops new connections.
Using AI for homework or study is like bringing a forklift to the gym.
Being able to use exercise equipment with a forklift would be pretty cool tho
That sounds way more fun
Going to a gym to pose as doing exercise while not doing it? Yeah fun.
Bringing a forklift to the gym and trying to pick up all the different shapped weights.
I just spent the afternoon driving 79" helical Piles with a dingo for a solar array, the n grated the land, and since I had an extra hour with the machine , helped landscaping crew on site dig out a trench to plant hedges.
Easily the most fun ive had at work in a month.
Sure, but within the simile that's sitting at the back of the class and laughing with your friends instead of engaging with the lesson. Fun but you didn't gain anything and got in the way of people actually trying.
I suspect a large part of the problem is that, at least in my experience, this is not at all explained to students and often the teachers themselves do it as "something that everybody does" rather than with the understanding that there is an underlying purposed that homework is meant to serve (which sould inform the when, what, how and how much of homework).
If see a similar kind of problem in my area (Software Development) all the time - people doing certain things because "they're good practices", "it's what you're supposed to do" or even "that's what everybody does" without at all understanding the underlying reasons for doing it (and, more importantly, when to do it, when not to do it and how best to do it), which is why for example nowadays you have countless of "Agile" teams that are doing wrong or unecessary (in their context) parts of it whilst not doing the parts that the should do just doing things they think they're supposed to do it but doing them incorrectly since they don't get what those things are supposed to achieve and how.
Mind you, some people are just lazy, so some students will just "optimize away" homework with whatever tools they have to do so, even when knowing the purpose of homework and when being given the most learning-enhancing homework possible.
I mean this is exactly what all the kids who told me they loooved essay questions always said they liked about them.
same, they all love cheating, before AI they would mostly just copy paste eachother's work
and me the alone kid who actually wanted and cared about learning would be drown out in busy work to be done, get bad grades even though I did well in tests and exercises, simply because I failed to do the annoying boring homeowrk of writting an essay that we all know the teacher is not reading, that they just made thjs assigment to give students free grade points because they know that if they didn't half of the students would fail the class, they would go lenghts about how they were being nice by doing this, and yet screwing over me would never be mentioned, one of the few students that ever displayed any form of curiosity in class
It's too bad, now we'll have to replace them with speaking in front of the class without notes.
I would love that!
I wouldn't mind. Some would struggle.
I taught a class of eight students who liked each other and got along well (but weren’t dating each other) for twenty hours a week for six weeks. They were all still terrified to give presentations at the end, even though it was a language course and they all already spoke a lot in class. I don’t know how I could make it easier for them, because that’s just about the lowest stress scenario I can set up. I’m not judging them for it, because I had a couple moments of panic in front of them as well, sometimes it happens, but I’d like to make it less stressful. I could just have them do it every day to make it routine, but if some of them are really affected by it, that might just make them dread the class.
Public speaking is a dying art, with the potential to change the world. People just aren't given enough exposure in the right circumstances anymore. All we need is a place where it's safe to fail, and all that nervous energy becomes a vibrant excitement with no comparison.
Yeah but for real proof of understanding has always been a problem. One of the reasons generated text is so pernicious is because even in everyday life, it outwardly mimics all the signals of care and cognition.
To the main point: much smaller class sizes is how you solve this problem.
Though this doesn't seem like a valid application of TAS, I'll bite.
A calculator can do your math homework for you, but that doesn't mean the homework is useless. It means that if you don't follow the rules the work is useless. Just because something with no understanding can complete a task doesn't mean a human with no understanding can. It is built to test a human, not a computer, and it generally does so well enough provided the human is the one doing the work.
Yeah it's built to serve as practice and to leave you with the questions you need to ask the next day.
I get it. I hated homework in school and generally didn't do it. And a fair bit of it was busywork. But when I got to college I learned the hard way that if I didn't do my homework, I wouldn't really have the skills. It's easy to sit through classes daydreaming or even listening, and just not really understand how to do a thing.
Always has been...
I had Latin in school, and the teacher was a bit senile already. He started making the rounds to check our homework - which I had not done. So I just hastily scribbled some lines of gibberish into my notebook. He came to my place, looked at my notes, and scolded me for my bad writing. And signed it off as done...
exams ... can be fooled by plausible-sounding bullshit
Maybe in the soft sciences, but try passing organic chem. 3 or chemical reactor design with plausible-sounding bullshit.
And even that doesn't matter: ChatGPT can pass a university-level physics exam.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBtfwa-Fexc
Non scholae sed vitae discimus - a student who does their homework with LLMs has learned nothing.
i can tell you from experience that teachers are using it too lol, to create the homework
one of my university professors admitted that he used copilot to create some questions for our exams of that class 🙃
I tried it for my class, and the questions they come up with is boring, repetitive, and generic.
I feel very sorry for you that you need to endure that.
Would this be better than recycling the same 5yrs worth of material?
What's wrong with recycling material? If it's decent, it's still gonna be useful for a new class...
My students can use a translator for every interaction they have forever, or they can do the homework and try to learn the language. Three guesses as to what’s actually easier in the end. Just because it can be done by a computer doesn’t mean there’s no reason for a human to learn it.
Is this meant to be pro-AI? Because people can be fooled by plagiarism?
I read it as anti-homework.
The idea with homework is to have the knowledge stick.
Homework 100% helped reinforce key parts of my education. By college i got better at deciding which stuff to do and which i could skip. The more i dreaded the class and the homework, the more important doing it tended to be. On the flip side, my math course that was more of a refresher of high school math, i could skip 90% of the homework.
The idea of homework is to condition us to accept poor work-life balance.
By all means make stuff available for students who want it, but if students need extra work that can't fit in class, then the school day should be longer.
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