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[-] Gullible@sh.itjust.works 101 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Is this helldivers? The game where half of a planet’s population is forcibly turned into bug fuel every few years?

[-] Sanctus@anarchist.nexus 102 points 2 weeks ago

Theres a reoccuring problem with bigly brained thinkers where they omit all the terrible shit and look at only what the propaganda wants them to. Even in a game this remains true.

[-] tomenzgg@midwest.social 23 points 2 weeks ago

Most clips from Starship Troopers on YouTube have filled comments' sections with people waxing about how based the society is and it's actually a utopia (to your point).

[-] Sanctus@anarchist.nexus 8 points 2 weeks ago

Well the movie elimanted the entire opening sequence of the book where they are just being terrorists in their super space suits (which the movie also did not include). I think that was necessary to drive the point home.

[-] Deme@sopuli.xyz 12 points 2 weeks ago

I've heard that the book was sincere jingoism, which the director of the movie didn't like one bit and turned it into clever satire of fascism instead? Haven't read it, but the movie is great, even if there's a bunch if idiots on both sides (fascist and antifascists) thinking that it's sincere.

[-] Mirshe@lemmy.world 13 points 1 week ago

Heinlein was...rather directionless on his politics. I think it was Clarke that once remarked that Heinlein's politics depended on who he was sleeping with - which is why you get weird whiplash from the anti-governance free-love (and incest and racism) in Methuselah's Children and Farnham's Freehold to a full throated defense of utopian fascism in Starship Troopers.

[-] Sanctus@anarchist.nexus 4 points 1 week ago

Its bad, dude sounded like he wanted this the entire time and it really would be better. But that scene in the beginning stuck with me through the entire reading and I came out with nearly the same interpretation as the movie.

[-] jaycifer@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago

I have a lot of thoughts and feelings related to the book because, while there is a lot of garbage in it, the core thesis spelled out at one point in the last third I think is very worthwhile and came at a time in my life (just turned 21 when I first read it) that it helped shape my political views. As another commenter said Heinlein was never very consistent in the politics portrayed in his stories, which I’ve understood as him exploring various views more than wholeheartedly endorsing any one of them.

First, the garbage. It’s pretty clearly pro military, as the in-book government was established by veterans seizing power and the primary path to having political power (being a voting citizen as opposed to a civilian) is through military service. There’s lip service paid that it’s any kind of civil service (Neil Patrick Harris’s character goes off to a research lab for experimenting in the book), but it’s only a sentence or two. No source on this, but my gut says Heinlein probably wanted to explore the idea more but was hampered by the fact he was writing a space military adventure and needed to focus on that. There’s also a lot of 50’s values espoused for separating genders into different groups and that spanking your kids is good no matter what the “bleeding hearts” might say.

The biggest difference that bothers me between the book and movie is how soldier lives are valued, best displayed through the tactics humanity uses. In the movie humanity uses almost the same strategy as the bugs. Get a lot of troops, equip them about as cheaply as possible, then send swarms of them to deal with bugs. Mass casualties are a given. The book is one of if not the first example of power armor turning a soldier into almost a one man army. It’s stated at one point that a single soldier is about as effective as 1000 bug drones in combat. This, along with statements from multiple officers throughout the book, shows me that individual soldier lives are actually valued in the book, and that while they are spent they are not wasted the way they are in the movie.

But for me, the most important takeaway from the book is a lecture given to Johnny Rico during officer school where the instructor lays out why service is required for citizenship. Essentially the goal is to ensure that the only people making decisions on behalf of society (ie politicians and the people that vote them in) are putting the good of that society over their own personal wellbeing. The service citizens go through is meant to weed out selfish people by putting them through difficult experiences where it would be in their best interest to quit rather than continue. While I doubt the book’s system would actually achieve that, I do think that the value of society-serving rather than self-serving voters and politicians is correct and probably the most important thing that a society could achieve (not that I know how to achieve that). It’s the first thing I ask myself when deciding who to vote for now, “does this person actually care about the people they’ll be representing or are they just interested in having power?”

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[-] Signtist@bookwyr.me 10 points 1 week ago

A lot of people I've met would honestly happily take a 50% chance to be sacrificed to ensure that those who aren't chosen live a happy life. I have no doubt that they'd think that right up until they're actually chosen, then they'd scream bloody murder about how unfair it is.

[-] carpelbridgesyndrome@sh.itjust.works 98 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

They started an unprovoked three front war, prioritize citizens differently based on a state defined class system, got the earth blown up on at least one occasion, use their soldiers as disposable cannon fodder, and send everyone who disagree with them to reeducation camps. Other than that its a swell place.

Its tiring how bad general media literacy is that I can't tell if the 4chan post above is a joke.

[-] RamenJunkie@midwest.social 24 points 1 week ago

The 4chan post probably is a joke.

The problem is, with a lot of their jokes, other users can't tell, so it becomes reality. See also, basically everything wrong with the US and MAGA idiots today.

[-] Papierkorb@feddit.org 7 points 1 week ago

Voting Trump for President started as a joke on 4chan, and later on Reddit with r/The_Donald. And look where it got us, the butterfly effect in full force.

[-] SlurpingPus@lemmy.world 17 points 1 week ago

I've seen one Lemmy bigbrain recently argue that even when artists are showing mafia or army to be terrible for people in them, they romanticize the mafia and army nonetheless, and that in general media glorifies its subject matter regardless of the author's intent. This schmuck would probably say with a straight face that ‘Helldivers’, or whatever this post is about, actually advocates for its model of utopia even if it pretends not to.

[-] Sunsofold@lemmings.world 12 points 1 week ago

The idea of there being no anti-war films is older than Lemmy. The problem is Poe's Law related. You can make a movie or a game that shows the horror of war or the tyranny of distopian totalitarian regimes, but regardless of the intended message, your creation is filtered through your audience's lenses of perception, and some of that audience has been raised to be white supremacists, some have been through schooling that acts more as indoctrination than education, and some of that audience are just seriously fucking stupid.

[-] SlurpingPus@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Yeah, I think I've heard of the 'no anti-war films' sentiment before, and vaguely heard that army recruiting increased after 'Full Metal Jacket', of all films. However, I don't agree that idiocy of some part of the public is a reason to write off army, mafia, or any such quasi-satire media wholesale, as the aforementioned commenter did. That position essentially says that it's not allowed to do critique of institutions and practices as part of 'entertainment' art (unless one hams it up to eleven, I guess).

[-] Sunsofold@lemmings.world 5 points 1 week ago

The whole point of Poe's Law is that you can't get away from it even if you ham it to eleven, or even 38.7 gigahams/second. Unless you explicitly state 'This is satire. That stuff is bad,' there is little to no way to tell if it's satire or extremism, and even if you do make it explicit, there are always the idiots who won't notice that part and assume it's sincere, (see naive interpretations of Starship Troopers) and those who willfully block out that part because they sincerely hold an opposing view. (See white nationalists opinions on American History X)

No one is saying it's 'not allowed' for people to make those things. They're saying it's literally impossible because of how the media work. The kind of people who are saying 'you can't' would love it to be possible. If we could movie our way to a utopia, it'd be awesome, but it seems we can't.

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[-] papalonian@lemmy.world 5 points 1 week ago

Why are you talking as if their argument is completely nonsensical or novel? It's kind of a known thing that even if you portray something as "bad" as possible, there will be a number of people that look past/ don't see the criticism of the subject and take the creation of work as a sign that the subject is to be praised. Look at the music industry with gang violence, misogyny and drug use; lots of more modern artists make music that shows how these things harm society, yet casual listeners will put on a song about alcohol abuse to get drunk at a party.

It isn't necessarily that the artist is advocating for it, so much as they've produced a work that can be misinterpreted (unintentionally or otherwise) to do so.

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[-] affenlehrer@feddit.org 6 points 2 weeks ago

Where does this lore come from? I've never heard of super earth

[-] Psaldorn@lemmy.world 15 points 2 weeks ago

Helldivers games

[-] Alpha71@lemmy.world 6 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

People forget that r/thedonald started out as a meme space. And then eventually people started taking it seriously.

Because people are stupid.

[-] bountygiver@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 week ago

Basically flat earth society again huh?

[-] new_world_odor@lemmy.world 66 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

no racism

white af family is the only visible race

Yeahhhh no fucking thanks.

The helldiver's two launch cutscene does show an interracial couple in a state propaganda video. Racism is one of the few ways the game doesn't to my knowledge show the government being fucked up. Everything else is horrible though

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[-] Lauchmelder@feddit.org 13 points 1 week ago

I mean TBF we have a sample size of one family here, but also idk what this post is about so idk idk

[-] brown567@sh.itjust.works 9 points 1 week ago

Can't be racism if there's only one race

[-] vodka@feddit.org 6 points 1 week ago

If there is only one race, racism can't exist? 🤔

[-] Complexicate@lemmy.world 18 points 1 week ago

There is only one human race, and racism still exists.

[-] FerretyFever0@fedia.io 5 points 1 week ago

If everyone had the exact same skin tone, people would still find something else to use as fuel for discrimination.

[-] Alpha71@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago

reminds me of a skit a saw once where an old man explains after world war 3 everybody just turned grey.

...

Specifically light grey and dark grey.

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[-] InternetCitizen2@lemmy.world 47 points 2 weeks ago

This post is approved by the ministry of truth

[-] Zozano@aussie.zone 34 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

no racism (no blacks, Asians, jews)

[-] vaultdweller013@sh.itjust.works 9 points 2 weeks ago

Isn't the one character who greets you when you return from a mission black? Or am I misremembering.

[-] Zozano@aussie.zone 11 points 1 week ago

Oh, this is from a game?

I thought it was some random channers wet dream

[-] SkaveRat@discuss.tchncs.de 18 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Here's the game's intro

It perfectly captures the parody vibes in the game.

Over the top propaganda is oozing out of every hole of this game. It's great

Haven't played in about a year, and the intro really makes me want to fire it up again

[-] RamenJunkie@midwest.social 5 points 1 week ago

Its Helldivers 2 apparrntly, if people don't want a link.

Coincidentally, that is the cure for Racism that racists prescribe too. Huh, neat.

[-] RamenJunkie@midwest.social 8 points 1 week ago

Can't have racism if there is only one race.

Rollsafe.gif

[-] plyth@feddit.org 3 points 1 week ago

The wife in the intro below is black.

[-] traxex@lemmy.dbzer0.com 26 points 2 weeks ago

Big “The Imperium of Man are actually the good guys” energy.

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[-] Tollana1234567@lemmy.today 8 points 2 weeks ago

wouldnt a superearth have a much higher gravity, which humans cant survive anyways,

[-] X@piefed.world 24 points 2 weeks ago

they’re talking about Super Earth, a fictional polity, and not a super-Earth, a type of exoplanet

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[-] 5ibelius9insterberg@feddit.org 4 points 2 weeks ago

Nonononono, it just produces superstrong superhumans…

[-] Turret3857@infosec.pub 6 points 1 week ago

why are they wearing the Orville uniforms

[-] org@lemmy.org 4 points 2 weeks ago
[-] wuphysics87@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 week ago

They even have a pet son

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this post was submitted on 22 Mar 2026
269 points (100.0% liked)

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