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I'm starting to think Israel aren't the good guys...

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[-] Fit_Series_573@lemmy.world 21 points 1 day ago

They are the evil they claim to be fighting

[-] kadaverin0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 13 points 1 day ago

Israel is a terrorist state.

[-] glitchdx@lemmy.world 13 points 1 day ago

Regardless of what your opinions on Palestine might be, Israel really isn't beating the allegations right now.

I remember what I learned in school about this, it was described as a territory dispute between two equal belligerents. Maybe that was true 30 years ago, I don't know, but it really doesn't describe what's going on right now.

The war is over. Israel won, Palestine barely even exists anymore. This is the part where you're supposed to facilitate aid and win over the losers to your side. dafuq flavor of genocide you dune Israel?

of course, nobody who needs to read this will ever see it. I'm just upset that this kind of thing can even happen in current year.

Of course the second, I'm looking at current events like it's still 2015. not sure why I'm doing that, but fuck does current events make me miss 2015.

[-] phutatorius@lemmy.zip 3 points 20 hours ago

it was described as a territory dispute between two equal belligerents. Maybe that was true 30 years ago

It was never true. Israel has had the upper hand since it was founded. Colonialist oppressors always hold their positions through overwhelming force. Israel is no exception.

[-] QueenHawlSera@sh.itjust.works 12 points 1 day ago

Israel is evil

[-] HugeNerd@lemmy.ca 51 points 2 days ago

Wow, Israel really is the only democracy in the Middle East!

[-] Mrkawfee@lemmy.world 6 points 1 day ago

With the most moral army in the world no less

Zionist gaslighting is second to none.

[-] hcf@sh.itjust.works 160 points 2 days ago

For those of you doubting the claims for lack of evidence, stating that you'll "wait for the facts" or evidence before allowing yourslf to be outraged—

Where is your outrage for the countless other people who were there who personally testified to being beaten, abused, and paraded around like trophies?

There are already multiple interviews with Chris Smalls, a black American labor organizer, who directly confirmed that he had been beaten, choked, packed like a sardine into a small cell, sleep deprived, strip searched, and completely brutalized by the Israeli navy and prison system.

Ask yourself—why does this need to have happened to the appropriately aged, white, European female on a 4k, live streamed or recorded feed with corroborating testimony by the Israelis and the national newspapers of the country of origin of the supposed victim—why is that the bar you've set for credulity?

What does that say about you or your reaction to the situation?

Wake. Up.

Fuck the details, fuck the squabbling over what constitutes "roughness" versus physical assault. Fuck the inclination to want to hear "the other side" of the story. Things are going horribly wrong in Israel/Palestine—in a place that we've all been told over and over is supposed to be demonstrably above reproach. If even half these claims are true—if even a single one of them is true—what GOOD is it preserving the supposed beacon of democracy in the middle east when they treat foreigners this way?

Even if you think these activists are mentally unwell, or menaces, or being performative, or just doing this for "selfies"—so what? We all know these activists are obviously not terrorists and at least some of them genuinely believe what they are doing. None of this justifies their treatment. Nothing justifies the richest and proudest countries on earth—however much you might agree with that claim—what GOOD is that if our prisons condemn people to absolute squalor and abandonment to the whims of their guards?

HOW is this any different from the indignity camps? These peoples possessions were seized as trophies , their clothes taken, their bodies crammed together like chattel. Do there need to be ovens for there to be discernable lines? Must you feel the radiant heat on your own brows before you'll indulge the sensation that something isn't right here?

Wake. Up.

[-] RaivoKulli@sopuli.xyz 64 points 2 days ago

Waiting for the facts is a pretty sensible move in most situations.

[-] phutatorius@lemmy.zip 1 points 20 hours ago

You'll never act when you need to if that's your bar to action.

[-] RaivoKulli@sopuli.xyz 1 points 18 hours ago

Requiring some evidence isn't a high bar. I think most shouldn't act on unverified claims.

[-] grrgyle@slrpnk.net 9 points 1 day ago

Well yeah, but we've got plenty of facts already. Decades of facts, in fact.

It's like climate change. Yes, we're constantly learning new things, but the fact that we are in crisis is not disputable.

We have more than enough facts to condemn and convict Israel and Netanyahu of crimes against humanity.

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[-] HellsBelle@sh.itjust.works 53 points 2 days ago

At this point in time everything Israel and Netanyahu do is sus, so 'waiting for the facts' is just an excuse to do nothing.

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[-] IndustryStandard@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago

Not if Israel is not allowing in journalists. Every testimony against Israel is 100% true because they refuse to let people check.

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[-] TheDannysaur@lemmy.world 11 points 2 days ago

I'm never going to say don't wait for facts.

But the issue is that "the facts" can take years to assertain... Sometimes there's a lot of damage that can be done.

It's a delicate balance. People weaponize "wait for the facts" to just delay and dull the impact. Like most things, it's not black and white.

I don't think saying "most" is the best application here.

[-] Paragone@lemmy.world 20 points 2 days ago

This is OLD news, their genociding has been going-on for years, now.

https://euromedmonitor.org/en/article/6669/Euro-Med-Monitor:-Israel%E2%80%99s-brutality-in-Gaza-surpasses-all-recent-forms-of-terrorism

"comically", the Jewish book of Jeremiah, & the Jewish book of Isaiah, both speak of Israel turning anti-God, & then getting G-D's wrath torching it..

IF that biblical-rule still holds, THEN Netanyahu's "Israel" is getting torched, soon.

Simply wait & see: if that torching does happen, then their God made it happen, according to their scripture, right?

Here's facts, for the ideological to ignore/deny: https://www.statista.com/statistics/1422308/palestinian-territories-israel-number-fatalities-and-injuries-caused-by-the-israel-and-hamas-war/


Israeli identity is rooted on genociding/exterminating multiple-nations, thousands of years ago:

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Deuteronomy+20%3A17&version=CJB orders the EXTERMINATION of 6 nations, & another of their books identifies that it was 7 exterminations, not 6, they were to enforce.

Genociding/exterminating/holocausting isn't a new behavior for Israel.

Doing it in the name of "zionism" is new, but genociding isn't new.

I'd never have guessed this, having grown-up in 2 religions: medical-science & Catholicism,

but the book "The Alphabet Versus the Goddess" by Leonard Shlain identified that the original holocausting was done by the Jews, & I went & checked in the bible, & yep.. there it was..

what Shlain didn't notice, probably because of being Jewish, was that the Catholic Inquisitors were Latin-educated, which also corroborates his point that getting populations to be left-hemisphere-dominant forces ideological-rabies..


What is the root-cause, though? Want experience-induced-undersanding which vastens one's mind?

Work-through, not-merely-read, it is the DOing which produces the experience-of-sentience-transformation, Betty Edwards' "Drawing on the Right Side of the Brain, the 4th, Definitive Edition", but use charcoals, which makes it much easier to experience the hemisphere-dominance-shift..

See this gallery?

https://www.drawright.com/before-after

That SHOWS the difference-in-MIND of hemisphere-dominance-shift: it is EVIDENCE.

Being an autistic blockhead, it took me 3y, not 5d, to experience that shift, because fighting the woodenness-of-my-brain made me want to scream..

Anyways, all who pretend that "there is no evidence for hemisphere-dominance-shift", are people who won't do the experiment, so .. they can shove their ideology .. wherever their egos are, to keep their egos company.

: p

Ideology, specifically symbol-anchored ideology, is prone to rabies/genociding, exactly as Shlain identified, throughout human history.

R-Mind isn't prone to rabies/genociding.

Exactly as Marshall McLuhan, the ultra-genius who forsaw telework around 1953, it isn't possible for people who grew-up literate to understand what illiterate-culture's story-river sentience is, or means..

His stupendous insight is embodied in "The Medium Is The mAssage", strange-capitalization is mine, but the spelling is his!

The medium of electric-technology, as he called it, is modular, & it forms minds into modularity!

The medium of story-river isn't modular, & forms minds into holding-onto eternal story-river, because that's their greatest treasure: it is who they are that they are holding-onto!

There's no way to imagine being in sooo-different a kind of sentience.

Precisely the same impossibility-of-understanding-the-difference is true, with hemisphere-dominance-shift: it isn't possible to imagine within-1-sentience-kind, what any other-sentience-kind means/is/feels-like!

Hofstadter's "Godel Escher Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid" was also on this single point, from a totally-different angle:

Formal-systems, ideologies, prejudices, & "religions", all are AXIOM-BASED knowing: and evidence is powerless to falsify them!

One has to choose between 2 mutually exclusive knowing-paradigms: self-consistency/axiom-based, .. XOR .. completeness/universe-centered.

Godel's Theorem of Incompleteness mathematically proved that self-consistency CANNOT be complete-knowing of universe!


Anyways, back to sentiences:

IF one never even experiences one's own brain's hemisphere-dominance-shift, THEN one dies ignorant of AN ENTIRE DIMENSION of one's own sentience!

The fact that alphabetic-language/left-hemisphere-polarization also consistently produces more genociding, builds on that as evidence that limiting ourselves to a specific-subset-of-our-potential creates distorted-psyche.. & distorted-behavior/society.

I ask everyone, as Betty Edwards asked everyone, please DO THE EXPERIMENT, & EXPERIENCE the resultant sentience-shift, your own self, & KNOW what that sentience-shift feels-like,

& when one does, THEN Shlain's book turns into fluorescent, & screaming, warning, about the consequences of blocking-out the other-half of our brains.

People who experience both kinds of sentience, regularly, don't do what the ideologues are doing with our world!

That the mode-of-mind that the polarized-in-symbols people are demonstrating, with its ideological-genociding, is a distortion.

It is a mind-distortion that WE have been educated into!

Cut the root of the distortion, by directly-experiencing it oneself!

Here: I'll give you the links to the books, themselves.. ( none of these are "affiliate" links: machiavellianism-narcissism can go eat rocks : )

https://www.drawright.com/bettys-books
https://www.drawright.com/try-an-exercise
https://www.kobo.com/us/en/ebook/drawing-on-the-right-side-of-the-brain

https://www.kobo.com/us/en/ebook/the-alphabet-versus-the-goddess-the-conflict-between-word-and-image

No ebook version for McLuhan's stunningly-important insight, so here's the paperback: https://www.amazon.com/s?k=marshall+mcluhan+medium+massage

ditto for GEB: https://www.amazon.com/G%C3%B6del-Escher-Bach-Eternal-Golden/dp/0465026567/

( for both the paperbacks, I read the original edition, decades ago, so I hope that you're getting a version that hasn't pruned-out any of the important stuff! GEB, the 2nd edition adds an explanatory preface, so that's the only change, but for McLuhan's, I've no idea what changed between editions )

Anyways, genociders gaslighting about what they're doing, as Russia has been demonstrating, & Israel has been demonstrating, & as the US of A will shortly be more-completely-demonstrating, once Trump stops vascillating in his nature/unconscious-mind, & becomes like Putin & Netanyahu completely ( might take only weeks/months, now, for that transformation to complete ) is well-established and normal among our world's left-hemisphere-polarized minds,

AND evidence showing what's actuality, is abundant, including before-after video of Palestinian cities.

Reject evidence if you want, & pretend that no evidence counts unless it is .. authorized by the gaslighters who're doing the genociding, if that's what "standard" you hold to be true:

I've encountered enough people who do that that now I know it's a real thing..

I've also encountered the ones who insist that unless Israel authorizes Palestinian-deaths to be actual, they they're only lies/delusions made-up to falsely-accuse Israel.

Sorry, but the photographic & video-evidence has been falsifying that gaslighting all along, & I'm not obedient to such evil-machiavellianism, anymore: age has benefits, including spine-produced-by-cynicism.

_ /\ _

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[-] Lushed_Lungfish@lemmy.ca 51 points 2 days ago

Israel to Nazis: When I left you I was but the learner now I am the master.

[-] SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca 5 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

"They dragged little Greta (Thunberg) by her hair in front of our eyes, beat her, and forced her to kiss the Israeli flag. They did everything imaginable to her as a warning to others.

She’s still a little kid. They made her suffer"

I seriously doubt this is true.

and

Greta Thunberg is 22.

[-] ripcord@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago

Why do you doubt this is true?

Other than the kid part

[-] Greddan@feddit.org 49 points 2 days ago

Israel is a rogue terrorist state.

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[-] andrewrgross@slrpnk.net 491 points 3 days ago

While I wouldn't wish this on anyone, it's amazing how self-destructive this is. Greta is an internationally famous activist. Flagrantly violating and abusing a person with world renown - along with dozens of other activists - is a radically stupid way to hasten international isolation.

It is well known by most in Israel that the country simply cannot function in isolation. It will lead to collapse. In this, they are giving the flotilla far more power to eventually overthrow the ruling regime.

[-] plz1@lemmy.world 214 points 3 days ago

They just assume Uncle Sam will bail them out, no matter what. They are not wrong, much to the frustration of a large portion of the US population.

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[-] Ottoman@lemmy.world 17 points 2 days ago

Fuck israehell ! Free Palestine 🕊

[-] SleafordMod@feddit.uk 75 points 2 days ago
[-] 100_kg_90_de_belin@feddit.it 60 points 2 days ago

Because they don't see civilians in Gaza as people.

[-] Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com 25 points 2 days ago

They literally call Palestinians (not Hamas, Palestinians) "human animals" and "vermin", just like the NAZIs used to literally say that Jews and Roma were "subhuman" and "vermin".

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[-] scala@lemmy.ml 28 points 2 days ago

Religion is an excuse for violence. Prove me wrong.

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[-] boonhet@sopuli.xyz 302 points 3 days ago

She’s still a little kid. They made her suffer.

I think that's needlessly infantilizing her. She's 22. She's not a "little kid". I think she's old enough for her opinions to carry weight, so how is she a "little kid"?

[-] fossilesque@mander.xyz 114 points 3 days ago

The youth should have their opinions respected too.

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[-] Resonosity@lemmy.dbzer0.com 27 points 2 days ago

Fuck Israel. Free Palestine.

[-] LadyAutumn 125 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

Idk why this is treated as though its so inconceivable. Greta is hated by conservatives around the world. Most countries have already condemned Israel. They only care what Trump's regime thinks. Their prisons are notorious centers of physical emotional and sexual torture. This is relatively mild treatment in comparison to many of the accounts I've read. It's still awful, but if they were going to invent a story about how vile the Israeli prison guards were, this wouldnt be noteworthy in any way. Barely even scratches the surface of the things that happen in those prisons.

[-] Lumisal@lemmy.world 51 points 3 days ago

English really needs to stop calling the right wing "conservatives". We don't call them that in other languages, and they literally don't try to conserve things, but instead always seek to destroy.

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[-] Gammelfisch@lemmy.world 20 points 2 days ago

Right wing religious nutters are well known for treating people like shit. The modern violence, on those dried rocks, originates from around 1917. Albert Einstein is 100% correct.

[-] DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works 53 points 2 days ago

Bruh, reminds me of the stories I heard about ww2 when the imperial japanese army invaded my homeland China, they would force people to kneel and sing the japanese national anthem under the threat of execution if people didn't comply. Its so evil disgusting villainy.

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[-] Wispy2891@lemmy.world 94 points 3 days ago

Breaking: terrorists behave like terrorists

[-] MrSulu@lemmy.ml 78 points 3 days ago

This is another pivotal moment. WE can speak out and make our elected officials (wherever we are in the world) KNOW that their political careers and their parties future depends upon their actions.

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[-] itisileclerk@lemmy.world 165 points 3 days ago

Israel is a fucking terrorist country. IDF is a new SS. They are new Nazi.

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[-] Goodmorningsunshine@lemmy.world 12 points 2 days ago

Fuck Israel completely. No one cares about you anymore or anything that has ever happened to you. Fuck you

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this post was submitted on 04 Oct 2025
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