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That's the best way I can describe it. Just neverending. Which sounds obvious but the actual experience of always having to parent, phew...

I'm not having the best day today. He's on summer break and hanging with me all day. We did okay yesterday but today it was just a domino of me feeling disappointed in myself that the house is always a mess and probably a level beyond that, like there's too much stuff to fit. But my own level of non-cleanliness has rubbed off on my kid cause there's no proper place to put his stuff. So I started cleaning then asked him to do some small tasks but I was feeling resentful for how he seems to just drop things wherever. I get it, you also got to teach them how to clean up and implement chores etc. and thus adds to the relentless grind of having to have these long term parenting plans but also try to be present in the moment and enjoy things and somehow have endless stores of patience. Today I definitely haven't. I've lost my shit and yelled and just let things domino out of control into a terrible grouchiness. I know some days suck and we get up and try again. Just wanted to get it out I guess. No advice needed. Just ranting to rant.

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[-] MudMan@fedia.io 36 points 2 days ago

It's not meant to be, man.

I remember being a kid, back when people had kids early and grandparents were both still around and healthy enough to help. I used to spend full weekends at my grandma's, or at friends' places or with aunts and uncles and other relatives. And a bit later kids would get together and roam the streets in packs.

We made it so kids only get to hang out with their parents and must be under constant supervision and it's an entirely absurd proposition.

[-] macncheese@lemmy.world 8 points 2 days ago

Yea, my mom was the most hands-on grandparent but she passed a couple years ago. The rest...very hands off. She was great when he was little but the funny thing is I don't ever remember her playing with me when I was a kid. When did we switch our mentality to just being so actively parenting all the time?

[-] MudMan@fedia.io 12 points 2 days ago

It's been a single generation, as I remember it. At least if you were born in the 80s/early 90s.

The average age to have a first child has skyrocketed and, particularly in some parts of the world, the idea of an extended family is no longer a thing. The support network has frayed a TON and the level of demand on parents has gone up at the same time.

And nobody seems to acknowledge it, honestly. At least outside bad faith fascistoid tradwife peddlers. But this isn't about traditional gender roles, it's about telling all parents that they need to constantly monitor their kids for two decades and simultaneously cutting them off from any source of help during that period (unless they're filthy rich and can pay for dedicated labor to replace that support).

It's not practical at all.

[-] fluffykittycat@slrpnk.net 4 points 2 days ago

No wonder no one's having kids

[-] Mac@mander.xyz 2 points 2 days ago

It's to do with isolation. Those in power want us isolated and afraid.

[-] P00ptart@lemmy.world 2 points 2 days ago

Bruh, my mom actively made sure I was home, but wouldn't play with me. She and her subhuman husband at the time drank and smoked cigarettes in the house while listening to music and I was expected to play with my toys alone. The only time I got to hang out with my friends was during rigid playdates and before they got home. And that was only because they were absent.

But with my kid, she'll play pretend endlessly. However, I won't allow her to be alone with my son because of the subtle propaganda I remember as a kid. "you wouldnt want someone to make a living without doing anything for it, would you?" This is why Grammy isn't allowed around my child by herself. I honestly wish she would die already so I don't have to explain these complex things with him.

[-] thegr8goldfish@startrek.website 11 points 2 days ago

Years from now you'll remember the good times and the shitty days won't be rembered often. Kids idolize their parents whether we're worthy or not. My house is a mess too. We are all just getting by some days. Don't beat yourself up. Try to make tomorrow a little better.

[-] macncheese@lemmy.world 7 points 2 days ago

Thanks. Yea I fall into these cycles of telling myself not to get frustrated and then I do even though there's a voice telling me this isn't helping, by being short with my kid etc. I know they're resilient, but man it doesn't feel good when you react to your buttons getting pushed and the filters come off. Sigh. yea tomorrow's another day.

[-] moakley@lemmy.world 10 points 2 days ago

I'm feeling the same way today. Between my ADHD and my wife's handicap, we just don't keep up on the house or many of the important things we need to do. And I totally feel you on things not having a place. We were finally, finally about to get rid of a box of stuff, baby toys, but now we're expecting our third child (gratefully), so we have to keep it all again.

This week my wife is out of town, so I feel all the weight of the mess on me, like I need to have it clean, even though I can't make myself go through the steps.

Tonight I'm going to get a big box and fill it up with all the stuff that doesn't have a place. Then, someday soon or months from now, we'll go through the box. But tonight it won't feel so bad.

Not trying to offer advice, but that's what I'm hoping to do.

[-] macncheese@lemmy.world 4 points 2 days ago

Sounds like a good plan. Yea part of it is...my mom was a hoarder (not like TV show levels but definitely a hoarder) and I rub up against the fact that I have the same tendencies. It's livable but I realized my livable is at a level that's probably kind of embarrassing to the average person. Been doing some purges but it's never enough. I have to face the fact that I have tendencies to want to hold onto things beyond what is reasonable. Reasonable would be a proper place in the house for what we have. If there isn't space, it's too much stuff and I can never seem to get down to that level. I have stopped a lot of discretionary spending though at least, used to do weekly Target runs but haven't been since about February.

[-] moakley@lemmy.world 3 points 2 days ago

That's the kind of progress I wish I could make. Everyone tells me I need to get rid of things, then when I'm ready to throw something away, those same people are like, "Well don't throw that away. It's in good condition."

But it's more complicated with my kids' stuff. I was very attached to things when I was little, and my parents would throw things away without telling me. I promised I'd never do that with my kids, but my daughter is so attached to everything that the end result is that nothing gets thrown out ever.

Being able to identify things that could be thrown away, then throwing them away? Difficult as it is, it sounds like a blessing.

I feel the same on the "livable" thing. I know that the condition my house is in might be unacceptable to a lot of people, but I try to accept that I have limited capacity and that I focus on the things that matter. Like I prioritize quality time and healthy meals for my kids.

I mentioned this to my therapist who agreed that it was a healthy attitude. Then I was like, "As long as my kids are healthy and happy, who cares if the floor hasn't been mopped in six months?" and her eyes widened like she hadn't thought it was that bad.

[-] macncheese@lemmy.world 3 points 2 days ago

Yea that's tough. Honestly what has helped with the mindset, my mom has since passed and of course I wish she was still here, but it has given me permission to let go of a lot of things. I am slowly trying to help my dad go through their house and it's....a lot. But in the end it's as you say what matters is your health, times with loved ones etc. Towards the end, I told her it was just stuff and don't worry about it anymore. But now when I purge at their house...she isn't telling me she can use this or that and I can just get on with it. My dad has a bit of it too so I just don't even let him look at the bags of stuff I donate or trash now. Oh yea check out Freecycle, trash Nothing or buy nothing. A bit of a double edged sword cause you can use those services to get things. But I have given away a lot of things on there and it feels good.

[-] JakenVeina@midwest.social 4 points 2 days ago

I was feeling resentful for how he seems to just drop things wherever

Yo, I feel this a ton. I can never get him to clean consistently, cause he'll get distracted by... well, basically anything. We had success with scheduling "clean up time" 1 hour before bedtime, for a while, but even we could never get it to stick. Best I've learned to do is remember it's not malicious, "focus" is just something he doesn't have mastered, yet. I'll also point out, he's gotten a LOT better in the past couple years. Hell, he voluntarily wanted to clean his room tonight, after having his friend over all day, he said they left the room a mess.

[-] macncheese@lemmy.world 2 points 2 days ago

Yea, I often have to remind myself that it took me decades to get to where I am and I still don't have it together ha. Someone told me in your head or even start a sentence aloud by saying your age and then their age and you realize how absurd some of your expectations are.

[-] TempermentalAnomaly@lemmy.world 4 points 2 days ago

Embrace some type B parenting. Having a 10 year old, I know it's tough to get them on board. But then, out of nowhere, he'll clean the table because something inside him sparked ... Or now he's trying to exercise because of makes him feel strong.

Its okay for you to yell occasionally. Children need to see a range of emotions at certain ages. It reminds them that we are people too.

I wish you well on the parenting journey!

[-] macncheese@lemmy.world 1 points 2 days ago

Ooh that's something to look forward to. Yea my kid's only 5. He can do so much more than he could a year ago. There was this podcast called One Bad Mother that ran for a long time and it just ended. But it was fun to listen to occasionally cause they would just share the bs they were dealing with or things they would F up and the host would always remind everyone we're all doing a great job. Sometimes just solidarity helps. I used to listen to other parenting podcasts and realize it was doing more harm than good.

[-] Petter1@discuss.tchncs.de 6 points 2 days ago

I think, children need more than two people looking after them.

I am so sad that religion forced society to normally live in groups with only two adults to rise kids.

At least Christians did.

[-] victorz@lemmy.world 6 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Christians did this? Even religion at all? Surely it's the industrial revolution?

But yeah, I agree fully that kids need more than just two people looking after them. This isn't how it was meant to be. No wonder there's more stress on each new generation. More to learn, more to do, less means to do it with, housing is fucked, economy is fucked, world peace is fucked, abroad is fucked, home is fucked. And having kids on top of all that? There's a reason that birth rates have plummeted worldwide. It's not a good world to have kids in.

[-] fluffykittycat@slrpnk.net 1 points 2 days ago

Christians enforce their desired family forms on us

[-] victorz@lemmy.world 1 points 2 days ago

And what family form is that? And why does family form have anything to do with how many people help out in raising a child?

[-] Petter1@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

😃
chatGPT agrees, guess I interpreted history wrong and it was Industrial Revolution that changed society in that way and was then adapted in religions
🫢
I know what I will research more tomorrow

But now I have to sleep

Gpt:

[-] victorz@lemmy.world 5 points 2 days ago

I still can't imagine what it has to do with religion but please post whatever you find in that regard, I'm very curious.

Side note, I'm kind of proud my hunch wasn't too far off with the industrial revolution. I never read that anywhere, it just felt logical. 😄 I don't have anyone interested enough for me to brag this to so I'll just shout it into the void lol.

[-] Petter1@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 2 days ago

I just read the complete answer generated by gpt again, and think it hit the nail exactly..

Main reason: Cities were designed for 2 adult families, because people (or better said men, as this whole idea is masculine thinking (women can do parenting alone and male get money ideology)) in power thought that is the most efficient way.

The whole framework was designed for such way of living: Small houses for such style of families, laws designed for such families etc.

I now switch to blame patriarchy for us being in this situation we are now. Like, ignorant men, which don’t see how the women in such families do like 200% of work compared to what males do in the “traditional family” setup as conservative people would say.
I bet most women rising kids and do housework are burnt out but just continue anyway and have no one helping them.

Here the full generated answer of GPT:

The normalization of raising children in small nuclear families—typically two adults with their own children—emerged through a complex mix of historical, economic, and cultural developments. Here’s a breakdown of how we got here:

  1. Historical Shifts in Family Structures • Pre-industrial societies often relied on extended families or even whole communities to raise children. This was practical: labor was shared, knowledge was passed down, and child-rearing was distributed. • With the industrial revolution (18th–19th century), people moved from rural areas to cities for work. Extended families were often left behind, and the nuclear family—parents and their children—became the norm in urban settings.

  1. Economic Forces • Wage labor and housing costs in industrialized societies made smaller households more economically viable. • Mobility—people began to move more for jobs, education, or opportunity, further separating families from their kin networks.

  1. Cultural Ideals and Western Individualism • In many Western societies, values like independence, privacy, and self-reliance became dominant. • The nuclear family became associated with progress, modernity, and even moral virtue. • Media and government policy in the 20th century (especially post-WWII) idealized the two-parent, stay-at-home-mom family unit—often ignoring other models.

  1. Government and Policy Influences • Housing, tax, and social welfare systems were designed with the nuclear family in mind (e.g., tax breaks for married couples, single-family homes). • In contrast, communal or extended family living was sometimes discouraged or seen as backward or inefficient.

  1. Decline of Traditional Community Structures • Secularization and urbanization often reduced reliance on religious or community institutions for child-rearing support. • The loss of “the village” that once helped raise a child created an isolating environment for many parents.

  1. Modern Consequences • This model can be overwhelming and isolating for parents and insufficient for kids, especially when both parents work. • In response, some are rethinking this setup: forming co-housing communities, reconnecting with extended families, or relying more on childcare networks.

TL;DR:

We ended up here largely due to industrialization, urban migration, economic shifts, and cultural values that promoted independence and privacy. But this model isn’t universal or necessarily optimal—many are now questioning and challenging it.

Would you like to explore alternative family or child-rearing models from around the world or history?

[-] victorz@lemmy.world 2 points 2 days ago

Cities were designed for 2 adult families

women can do parenting alone and male get money ideology

The combination here is what "worked" for a while I guess, but as women started working full-time and men started also caring for the kids, you then have two adults now working full-time while at the same time raising kids, and that's stressful as hell. I know, I have two kids and work full-time. It's stressful as hell.

It definitely, definitely was not meant to be this way. That was your main point I think from the start, and that is 1 million percent true.

[-] Petter1@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 2 days ago

❤️ I agree 100%

My girlfriend is stressed out all the time, especially when our son has holiday from school/kindergarten (right in transition from kindergarten to school right now) and I do all I can to support her, and got burned out as well 3 months ago

Next month, I will reduce to 70% and she starts to stop working for a organisation that more and more turns to shit as they did a restructuring and have now a management only caring about numbers.

It should work out financially as, from kindergarten to school, we have to pay less for child caring institutions, that made it possible to continue her profession (she is gold smith teacher)

Luckily she can work now again for the person where she did the apprenticeship (she had a very good time there) and can possibly take over the buisness when her mentor retires ☺️

I know that we are lucky having such Options, and it make me sad thinking about all the other people not having such options

🫶🏻you do a great job 👏 Keep on it, it is hard, and way to less people see that

❤️you can do it 💪🏻

(I and my son are neurodivergent, so that complicates stuff even more 🤣)

[-] Petter1@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 2 days ago

🙏🏻❤️

[-] Whirling_Ashandarei@lemmy.world 1 points 2 days ago
[-] Petter1@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 2 days ago

I just used gpt to verify my wrongness because it was after midnight and I didn’t want to go down the rabbit whole just yet, how is this so hard to understand?!

[-] pinball_wizard@lemmy.zip 1 points 2 days ago

I hear you. It is relentless.

I gave myself permission to toss stuff the kids leave out into boxes that I put out in the garage.

I give away whatever they don't miss for a few months (or years - I get busy.)

I also give them age appropriate help to bring stuff back in - within the bounds of protecting our shared sanity. They're not allowed to just cart it all back in and dump it all back on the floor. But anything they care about, I'll help them make shelf space for and bring in.

this post was submitted on 29 Jul 2025
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