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submitted 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) by DandomRude@lemmy.world to c/asklemmy@lemmy.ml
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[-] kava@lemmy.world 10 points 6 hours ago

A superpower by definition cannot really be a rogue state. A "rogue state" is a political label applied by dominant powers to states that defy the international order. For example Iran or North Korea are considered rogue states because they defy the international order. What is "the international order"?

Well, it's the combination post-WW2 institutions created by none other than the US. The UN, IMF, NATO, etc. They set the norms of "legitimate" behavior. When the US participates in military interventions, economic sanctions, and other aggressive actions it's framed as upholding "rules-based order" whereas identical actions by weaker states get them condemned with the label as "rogue states".

To call the US a rogue state is to misunderstand power. Hegemony is the ability to define reality, not just defy it. In this way, the US has always been a rogue state in the sense that it does whatever it wants regardless of the international norms. I mean, just look at the mid 1900s and its actions in Latin America. It was involved in about a dozen states toppling governments and supporting military dictatorships- including sponsoring the genocide of natives in Guatemala.

[-] DandomRude@lemmy.world 4 points 6 hours ago* (last edited 5 hours ago)

Yes, that's true. I'm more concerned with whether US citizens, whose past administrations more or less invented the term, can now recognize for themselves that they are no longer on the side of the "good guys" with this administration at all, but are now the "terrorists" themselves - the very thing that past US administrations denounced (at the time, of course, already completely speciously).

Edit: Trump himself has even brought the term back to a certain extent - and he is not only the personification of evil for the governments of other countries. I just want to make it clear that it's the same here as with almost everything he does: it's projection - whatever he accuses others of, he and his corrupt gang are the ones doing it.

Edit 2: Please don't get me wrong. I'm not saying this because I believe that Europe, for example, would be much better - I'm saying it because I'm from Germany and we have the history that you all know. It's not too late to put a stop to Trump and his Nazi colleagues, but it will take civil resistance. If there is no vehement resistance, I fear that history will repeat itself. Nobody in their right mind can want that.

[-] allonzy@lemmy.world 1 points 25 minutes ago

Myself and and a good number of people I know are very aware and horrified. Unfortunately this isn't necessarily the case outside of my social bubble. Since major media outlets aren't doing a great job, a lot of people are trying to spread the real news in a grassroots style.

[-] Fingolfinz@lemmy.world 11 points 7 hours ago

I own guns now. I never did or even considered it until the election results in November.

[-] silentjohn@lemmy.ml 9 points 8 hours ago

Leftists, of course. Liberals will continue to be in denial for the foreseeable future. Conservatives just dgaf.

[-] Liberal_Ghost@lemmy.zip 1 points 1 hour ago

Not all liberals. But yeah most. Or maybe I'm more leftist than I thought I was....

[-] ipkpjersi@lemmy.ml 4 points 7 hours ago

It's covered up yeah, most of the republicans are too dumb to realize it.

[-] RymrgandsDaughter 13 points 17 hours ago

Many Americans are unaware of the problems due to media censorship.

However they're creating so many problems that even those with blinders on are seeing this shit.

[-] Snowclone@lemmy.world 6 points 14 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago)

To some 20%-30% of the country 'patriot' means 'whites only'. Honestly, if your so dedicated to being a patriotic American you can't stand up to a government doing everything it can to destroy America, you're just an idiot.

[-] CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org 41 points 21 hours ago* (last edited 21 hours ago)

Americans for the most part are only dimly aware there's an outside world in the first place. The amount of covering up that needs to be done is minimal.

[-] merc@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 hour ago

It figures it takes someone calling themselves "CanadaPlus" to actually see the actual question and answer it.

Everyone else is answering about how aware Americans are about what's happening, but the question was about whether Americans were aware of how the world perceived the US. The answer, of course, is "no, Americans have no idea because Americans consume almost no non-American media".

[-] CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 1 hour ago

This kind of question coming up a lot is why I chose the name, haha.

[-] peteyestee@feddit.org 9 points 20 hours ago* (last edited 20 hours ago)

I had a friend that that looked like they were offended when they found out Australian Idol was a thing and it wasn't just in America.

[-] CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org 3 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago)

Yep. The concept that there's a symmetry between countries is a few degrees of separation away from many Americans, I guess. It's not weirder to have an Australian Idol than an American one. I've also had conversation where they assume people in other countries are patriotic for America. Like, even in the first world we all sit around wishing we were American.

Famously, many (most?) of them can't even identify the continents on a map. I'd be interested to see Chinese tested the same way, since I've heard they're on the same level of insularity, being another massive superpower.

[-] shinratdr@lemmy.ca 7 points 19 hours ago

It wasn’t even originally an American thing, it’s from the UK.

[-] CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 4 hours ago

Wait, is it just called "Idol" there?

[-] shinratdr@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 hours ago
[-] NewSocialWhoDis@lemm.ee 2 points 7 hours ago

Exactly. Hence the name distinguishing it as the "American" one.... People (Americans?) are so dumb.

[-] overcookedpancakes@lemm.ee 7 points 15 hours ago

Aware and trying to let others in my circle that are unaware become aware.

[-] Mallspice@lemm.ee 13 points 18 hours ago

Depends. Everyone who voted against Trump knows this and it’s probably why they did but most non voters and maga are still ignorant.

[-] PanArab@lemm.ee 11 points 17 hours ago
[-] Mallspice@lemm.ee 8 points 17 hours ago* (last edited 17 hours ago)

We have first past the past voting here, this means we don’t vote based on who we like but rather who is the lesser of two evils.

It makes it easy for good and smart people here to support things like this, even if they don’t want to, because the alternative is worse.

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[-] AngryRobot@lemmy.world 7 points 16 hours ago

Some of us are aware. We tend to also be the ones who know this only ends in some kind of revolution. No dictator has even chosen to give up power.

[-] brucethemoose@lemmy.world 1 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 1 hour ago)

No dictator has even chosen to give up power.

Taiwan's did: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Taiwan_(1945%E2%80%93present)

It was actually neat. The "hybrid" between dictatorial state funding and a democratic business environment all but established TSMC.

Ukraine is sort of a dictatorship now, but Zelensky will probably give up power.

But, uh, we don't talk about them here I guess.

[-] AngryRobot@lemmy.world 1 points 24 minutes ago

How is Ukraine a dictatorship?

[-] Manifish_Destiny@lemmy.world 24 points 22 hours ago

I see the American media as softballing fascism, or they're just outright complicit.

No one will call shit what it is, and every fucking thing in the news needs to be both-sides-ed.

This doesn't help with the less educated grasping these basic concepts, nor does the massive stigmatization of intelligence and critical thinking, nor does the attacks on institutional education.

There's laws constantly being passed in the form of 'vouchers' to drain public school funds and funnel American kids into Christian indoctrination, and our public schools are now dramatically underfunded.

So I guess I understand why more than half the population just straight up ignores politics. because reality here is really depressing.

[-] aeshna_cyanea@lemm.ee 1 points 14 hours ago* (last edited 14 hours ago)

To be fair, this is pretty similar to the way American press covered the rise of German fascism at the time

[-] dryfter@lemm.ee 10 points 19 hours ago

No "average" person is aware because they are too busy trying to just survive. Nobody wants to chance losing what they've worked so hard for. The only people who watch the news are seniors and disabled people, and they're being misled if they just watch TV news.

People who call themselves Republicans are happy with what's going on. People who call themselves Democrat are not happy but think they need to work within the system to solve the issues and wait until the next election. Libertarians have sided with the Republicans. Socialism is still a taboo way of thinking for the most part here.

Then you have disabled people (like me) who are watching what is happening in horror and have sky high anxiety wondering if they're next to be disappeared or homeless. I can stand for maybe 30 minutes at most, holding a sign maybe 15 minutes at most. So I'm doing what I can and that is trying to live as if things are "normal" to continue on my mental health recovery and sobriety journey at the same time being horrified and terrified of what's to come. It's a weird duality that I don't like. I told my therapist the other day that I have hope for the future for my recovery but I have lost all hope in what is going on politically and in the news.

A lot of this I also blame on false American beliefs fed to us in school that we were safe from all of this nonsense because of our constitution. The American Dream and all that B.S. They sugar-coat our history as a country in schools -- at least they did when I went to school in the 80's/90's, I don't know about now. It's as if America only has a rosy history, even the Civil War is glorified in false narratives.

It's easy to see how we got to this point as a country. The question is, how do we get ourselves out of it?

[-] blorps@lemmy.world 5 points 17 hours ago

Whatever the answer is, it's going to take years if not decades. I wish I had the answers. I wish I had the power to make things right. I wish I could stop the suffering. All I can do is do what I can. For now, that's surviving. For now, all I can do is continue to be kind to people and educate them when I can. Help them when I have the ability to.

My fellow disabled person, I see you. A murmur can become a tidal wave with time. We must stick together. We cannot lose hope. We must go on.

[-] bilb@lem.monster 4 points 16 hours ago

The phrase "rogue state" to me always just sorta meant "uncooperative with the United States," which the United States can't be. I'm sure there's a more useful definition.

[-] loweffortname 3 points 16 hours ago* (last edited 16 hours ago)

Honestly? I think the US can be uncooperative with itself. At this point, nothing would really surprise me.

[-] phubarr@lemmy.world 8 points 20 hours ago

We're successfully distracted by the more immediate personal problems they've created for us

[-] ShittyBeatlesFCPres@lemmy.world 15 points 22 hours ago* (last edited 22 hours ago)

We’re aware. People who get all their news from Fox or ignore politics in general probably aren’t but even my conservative family members are embarrassed about the threats to Canada and Greenland. Canadians are generally considered super nice and polite by Americans so pissing them off crossed a line. Even apolitical people probably know the U.S. National Anthem is being booed at sporting events.

There’s elections in several states today that will provide some data to know more. Louisiana had an election on Saturday and rejected 4 constitutional amendments supported by Republicans. None even got 40%. Louisiana is an oddball state so I’m not sure it’s a harbinger of today’s elections but if voters in Wisconsin and elsewhere vote like Louisiana, it’ll be very telling.

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[-] surph_ninja@lemmy.world 47 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

There was never a point in US history that it was not a rogue state. If you believe there’s a period it wasn’t, you simply do not know enough history about the time period you’re referring to.

Or more likely, you believe white lives to be more valuable, and you take offense now that the US is directing their usual behavior towards white Europeans.

[-] Ferrous@lemmy.ml 24 points 1 day ago

Yup.

What we are seeing now is a critical inflection point for liberals: do they do honest introspection and start to apply real criticism to the history of the US, or do they cover their ears and claim Trumpism is an aberration for which they have no reasonable explanation.

To put it simply, liberals now have a choice between

"Damn, this is really the outcome of the american political project, huh? How did we get here?"

And

"Trumpist fascism is un-American, and I am clueless as to how it took hold, but I am going to continue to vote blue no matter who!"

If the amount of liberals on .world bizarrely harkening back to the "good old days" of the founders, Reagan, Obama, and even dubya is any indication, I suspect most of them have gone with the second option.

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[-] TacoButtPlug@sh.itjust.works 20 points 1 day ago

In the Los Angeles Mexican community no one is fucking aware. In the Chicago black community no one is fucking aware. I'm sick of the people in this shit hole. They are happy as long as they have their bread and circus, no matter what.

[-] tomenzgg@midwest.social 3 points 16 hours ago

In the Chicago black community

I'm sorry, what‽ As a black Chicagoan, no the Hell we aren't.

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[-] gamer@lemm.ee 44 points 1 day ago

Based on the pro Trump people in my life, I've seen two classes:

  • Those in denial and ignorant in general (don't really follow the news), who don't believe for example that Trump is deporting people without due process, and blatantly violating the law and constitution.

  • Those who are so sucked into the MAGA own-the-libs circle-jerk that even when presented with the facts and proof of Trump doing something blatantly illegal, will usually retort with something like "oh so when the Democrats do it it's okay, but now the Trump is doing it it's wrong??? You fucking communist!"

Both I believe are the result of being fed far right propaganda by YouTube, TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, etc. It's the only explanation I have. These aren't random people I don't know. These are people I love and have known my whole life.

It hurts to see, and I don't see a way to help them that doesn't involve ruining those relationships. I avoid talking about politics around them because I know it's going to make me resent them, and I don't want that.

[-] merc@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 hour ago

Note, that this isn't actually the question. It's not whether Americans are aware of what's happening, it's about whether Americans are aware of how the rest of the world perceives the US.

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this post was submitted on 31 Mar 2025
722 points (100.0% liked)

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