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No Way (lemmy.world)
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[-] unmagical@lemmy.ml 290 points 5 months ago

There absolutely is way. The dems are routinely ineffective and they lost a lot of votes from 2020 because of the whole "Harris backs Israel in a genocide" thing.

Just cause the greater evil won doesn't mean the left needs to start peddling unfounded "stolen election" conspiracy theories. It's completely reasonable that enough people realized they fucked up by voting for Republicans, Third Party, or abstaining and took this as an opportunity to refute the actions of the current administration.

[-] almost1337@lemm.ee 112 points 5 months ago
[-] WhatAmLemmy@lemmy.world 65 points 5 months ago

I've also seen evidence that the same systemic election interference, voter purges/disenfranchisement, gerrymandering, etc — the leading reason for GOP wins over the last 20 years, and were never legitimately addressed or removed — were more than enough to secure Trumps win of the EC.

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[-] TranscendentalEmpire@lemm.ee 33 points 5 months ago

What if there was statistical evidence of probable tampering?

All of the allegations listed on this site have fairly logical explanations when given context.

Republicans pushed against mail in ballots hard, so it makes sense that Harris would do better with mail ins and trump would do better with early voting. It also makes sense that trump voters mainly cared about the presidential election compared to Harris voters. It also makes sense that Harris underperformed as Democrats didn't get to participate in a primary. Basically it makes sense for there to be abnormalities in an abnormal election, that doesn't mean there's "statistical evidence of probable tampering".

Plus Trump, in his rambling, said something that [heavily implies tampering with vote counting machines

Right...... But this means that we would be questioning trump's honesty based on assuming that trump is being honest on this particular subject. He's a troll who likes to stir the shit and make people assume he's more competent than he really is, the same as musk.

It does not behoove progressives to question the reliability of elections without real evidence. Having people question the reliability of elections only serves conservative agenda of making it harder for people to vote.

[-] almost1337@lemm.ee 15 points 5 months ago

Abnormal Clustering: In contrast to Election Day voting, Early Vote results display an unusual pattern: once approximately 250 ballots have been processed a visible shift is observed, resulting in a high degree of clustering and unusual uniformity. This is a departure from expected human voting behavior.

This is not logically explained by an "abnormal election".

[-] TranscendentalEmpire@lemm.ee 9 points 5 months ago

It's also not really explaining much either. They don't give examples of other elections to compare it too, and their own methodology is lackluster.

They are basically saying that after approx 250 votes trump started to pull ahead, which is to be expected as a lot of early Dem voters were mail ins.

To be honest it just seems like they are trying to purposely confuse normal phenomena with statistical diction, and alluding to claims without providing context.

Usually when making claims this grand you would also want evidence to match it. You'd also want to provide an example to compare it to previous elections utilizing the same methodology.

[-] earphone843@sh.itjust.works 9 points 5 months ago

Not to mention Musk's DOGE people publishing their vote generation scrip on Git. You tell it the outcome you want, and it'll make ballots to match.

[-] GissaMittJobb@lemmy.ml 17 points 5 months ago

So I get how this could sound compelling with that framing, but note that:

  • This was part of a hack project by 4 students in 2020
  • The tool they built in the hack was an ML computer vision system to validate ballots, in an effort to reduce mail-in ballot rejection rates
  • As a part of testing this project, they needed a way to generate a large amount of ballots which the system could then validate
  • Five years later, one of the authors of this hack works for DOGE

Like, take a look at the code - it's trivial, in large part because it was made by college students in their early academic career. Creating something of similar caliber would be extremely trivial.

That this student hack project would have been used as a part of a greater scheme of election fraud seems highly unlikely.

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[-] MNByChoice@midwest.social 9 points 5 months ago

I would like to see the similarities between voting machines in districts overlaid with the results.

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[-] earphone843@sh.itjust.works 52 points 5 months ago

You honestly think the party of "Every accusation is a confession" who spent 4 years screaming about election fraud didn't commit election fraud?

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[-] surewhynotlem@lemmy.world 35 points 5 months ago

The problem is the down ballot. I'm having trouble believing that a whole lot of people went out there and voted for Trump for president, and Democrats everywhere else.

I understand staying home. I understand voting Republican. But lots and lots of split ballots?

[-] usernamesAreTricky@lemmy.ml 33 points 5 months ago

A decent number of trump voters only voted for Trump. They left the downballot blank because they don't really care about anything but Trump

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[-] auraithx@lemmy.dbzer0.com 24 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

There's actually quite a lot of evidence.

https://electiontruthalliance.org/

https://smartelections.substack.com/p/so-clean

The tabulators switched after 500 votes and restricted dems to 45%, the data looks artificially smoothed to hide this. The same pattern is visible on elections going back to 2014.

They also found the remote access code for Dominion machines on a public repo with the private admin password in it, there's evidence of breaches all around the country from people associated with Trump. They got caught red handed, told us they were doing it the full time.

And that's before we get to the voter suppression, and 10-20% of the country being in a state of algorithmically induced psychosis.

[-] jj4211@lemmy.world 9 points 5 months ago

A lot is made of the 'drop-off', which is easily explained by the fact that Trump is a unique phenomenon. People are shocked that some Trump voters might swing towards a democrat downballot, and I can't imagine the mindset personally, but I acknowledge it exists. Remember, they aren't Republican voters, they are Trump voters. Further, NC has a history of voting for democrat state offices and republican federal offices.

I think if they were going full tampering, you wouldn't see the drop-off, because they'd rig the down-ballot as well.

As to the graphs look funny, well, I think I'll need to see more analysis from more data by a broader set of analysts. I know that statistics will say anything if you torture the numbers enough, so I'm not going to get too invested in visualizations from one source.

Scrutinizing the vote is fine, but feel like this looks more like denial than an educated analysis.

For this case specifically, again, a 'Trump' voter is not a republican voter, the democrat party is way more energized to vote against a would-be Trump ally than before the election. Finally, I don't know about this race, but it's possible that those two in particular have something in the local population making the democrat more popular. For example in NC the republican governor candidate was way specifically a problem, so there's a much easier explanation for why he lost by an anomalous amount.

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[-] Cethin@lemmy.zip 16 points 5 months ago

I don't disagree with the sentiment, but I think it's more to do with them saying how great "the economy" is. They didn't even try to appeal to the working class. They just told them they should be appreciative. They lost because they eschewed the left.

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[-] jontree255@lemmy.world 83 points 5 months ago

People on the left need to stop peddling this “Trump stole the election” stuff. It plays right into his rhetoric about our elections being rigged and allows him to cry again whenever his side loses. The comment in the screenshot looks like a fucking bot anyway.

Dems didn’t dump Biden early enough and the average American voter is dirt fucking stupid. Plus you’re telling me there’s some sort of massive conspiracy to alter votes in 7 different states with separate election systems and no one blabbed?

While I agree that every accusation is a confession until we see some hard proof that’s peer reviewed I’m skeptical. We shouldn’t be focusing on the past anyway, it doesn’t solve our current problems. We need to focus on the present and future.

[-] scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech 20 points 5 months ago

Agreed. Fact is I don't think they even needed to. The electoral college does most of it for them, and then when over half the nation doesn't vote, and on top of that many Democrats just didn't vote, it's pretty obvious exactly what happened.

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[-] MDCCCLV@lemmy.ca 13 points 5 months ago

People were unhappy with inflation and stuff and so they vote out the incumbent, it's as simple as that. 100% the opposite party wins if things are going very badly.

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[-] ninjabard@lemmy.world 10 points 5 months ago

If he stole the election, and he did, then that needs to be drummed into the heads of the ones who actually voted for him. He doesn't care about anyone but himself or anything except whatever he defines as winning.

[-] SGforce@lemmy.ca 13 points 5 months ago

Why would they care even the slightest bit? They'd be proud of it.

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[-] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 5 months ago

People on the left

Libs are right-wing.

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[-] OldWoodFrame@lemm.ee 82 points 5 months ago
  1. He didn't "handily win" he won by 1-2 points in the swing states.

  2. It tracks with an anti-incumbent sentiment, people are not happy with inflation so they voted against the incumbent, they're still not happy and still voting against the incumbent.

[-] unphazed@lemmy.world 35 points 5 months ago

And he only won because a few million people who voted in 2020 sat on their asses instead of voting this time.

[-] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 28 points 5 months ago

It seems like supporting a genocide depresses turnout. Democratic consultants, take note.

[-] Fedizen@lemmy.world 20 points 5 months ago

Democrat politicians have already decided "DEI" was the problem. Good luck getting those spineless cowards something resembling a moral framwork.

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[-] Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 14 points 5 months ago

The only notes they pay any attention to are Federal Reserve Notes.

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[-] UltraGiGaGigantic@lemmy.ml 9 points 5 months ago

Sounds like First-past-the-post voting doesn't accurately represent the people with its inherent two party system. Are you working towards giving these people representation in your state by pushing for electoral reform?

[-] _stranger_@lemmy.world 10 points 5 months ago

That fight is dead, the current fight is "will we ever have federal elections again"

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[-] Skullgrid@lemmy.world 10 points 5 months ago

He didn’t “handily win” he won by 1-2 points in the swing states.

he won the popualar vote despite all the EVERYTHING

[-] unpluggedunfettered@lemmy.world 24 points 5 months ago

That tracks with the reality that half of America really likes the guy.

America is the country that had almost 70% of Republicans polling that Nixon shouldn't resign the day before congress decided to impeach.

He won. It is unfortunate, but not unsurprising or requiring a leap of faith, and it has all evidence supporting it, factually.

Now we need to take that reality and address it and the root causes--rather than fighting facts with preferred fantasy like the right wing has done at every opportunity.

[-] Dragonstaff@leminal.space 17 points 5 months ago

I know that Republicans spent 2020 looking for bamboo in ballots, but haven't been able to find even hand recounts in swing states. I think Democrats are so invested in being "good losers" that there has not been enough investigation into an election where Republicans certainly cheated as much as they were able to.

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[-] HawlSera@lemm.ee 53 points 5 months ago

Trump's been talking about how he won because of Elon "being good with computers"

Investigations were launched over less

[-] GrumpyDuckling@sh.itjust.works 14 points 5 months ago

Everone is getting real jumpy around Isreal. Isreal has a booming cyber security industry and is one of the biggest exporters of security exploits that they sell to corporations and nation states.

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[-] Norgoroth@lemmy.world 27 points 5 months ago

He already admitted Musk rigged the voting machines

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[-] Diurnambule@jlai.lu 17 points 5 months ago

Hello, sorry to disturb, can you add his name or surname or political party in the description or title so I can filter this out please?

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[-] fallowseed@lemmy.world 17 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

your takeaway is a lot different from mine: here i'm thinking, how useless must this this katie whittington be.. LOL 9+k votes (total) between them. 14 percent of the district voted in this special election. tell us again how its IMPOSSIBLE kamala lost her swing states in the general presidential election.

[-] HighFructoseLowStand@lemm.ee 14 points 5 months ago

Let's be frank: it was a special election where about a tenth of eligible voters turned out.

Trump ain't gonna see an FDR level midterms victory, unless he manages to destroy the American democracy totally, but I wouldn't look at this as evidence of some major shift by itself.

[-] jmsy@lemmy.world 12 points 5 months ago

this really draws attention to how unpopular kamala harris was and what a fucked up party the DNC is.

[-] SoGrumpy@lemmy.ml 10 points 5 months ago

No it doesn't, it shows how gullible yanks are for trumps bullshit.

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[-] inclementimmigrant@lemmy.world 10 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

And what we'll see is by next election this guy will lose his seat because Republicans and Independents are dumber than goldfish.

You know, after Mike Zimmer stopped being the defensive coordinator for the Cincinnati Bengals I lost track of what happened to him. Thought he went to the Cowboys or something. I guess we really could use some better defensive plays in the legislature though.

(I assume this must be a different Mike Zimmer)

[-] Zink@programming.dev 10 points 5 months ago

Yeah sure they're a bunch of evil criminals, so if they had the methods to cheat they probably did.

But let's say that tomorrow there are worldwide headlines about some irrefutable smoking gun evidence. Or maybe Musk goes on TV being a little bit too high, or Trump gives an interview while a few neurons too many wither and die in his skull, and they say they did it, tell us where to find the evidence, and say it was worth it and they did it because they are patriots trying to save the country. Just doubling down on the old "He who saves his Country does not violate any Law."

DOES ANYTHING EVEN HAPPEN? Who is gonna do something about it?

The absolute most extreme result I could possibly see being reality would be that Trump manages to get Musk accused and convicted for the interference. That would be just as funny as it is unlikely, but it would fix nothing.

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[-] elav@lemmy.world 9 points 5 months ago

It’s simple: challenged votes. Watch Vigilantes INC in YouTube.

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this post was submitted on 17 Feb 2025
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