497
submitted 3 weeks ago by FundMECFSResearch to c/world@lemmy.world
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What is it to study? He's already said that he supports the nazis, and it is clear that he uses his twitter as his personal billboard.

There's nothing else to consider. Twitter should be banned from Europe until the nazi controlling it loses its control over it (hopefully in a pemanent way).

[-] wewbull@feddit.uk 9 points 3 weeks ago

Right, but what in what you've said is illegal?

[-] TheEntity@lemmy.world 92 points 3 weeks ago

Supporting nazism is quite illegal in many places. In Germany for sure.

[-] errer@lemmy.world 14 points 3 weeks ago

Clearly not if the far right party exists in Germany and their leaders aren’t being sent to jail. In the eyes of German law the AfD are not nazi enough to be illegal.

[-] the_wise_wolf@feddit.org 3 points 3 weeks ago

I don't know if these anti Nazi laws have ever been enforced in a rigorous manner. And most politicians are too afraid of doing it because the Nazis have growing support by the people. I'm pretty sure they could do more to fight the afd legally. But then again, they could also do more to satisfy voters, so they don't vote for extremist. Both is never going to happen.

[-] zqps@sh.itjust.works 9 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

It is currently under legal review, though unfortunately caught up in Realpolitik and unlikely to go anywhere due to the government disbanding.

Fact is the center-right always has a bullshit reason to sit on their hands. They stopped the NPD review years ago saying they aren't popular enough to be a threat. Now with AfD they say they're too popular to be banned.

Institutions and laws are meaningless if they aren't used as intended.

[-] FlowVoid@lemmy.world 5 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

Germany bans certain symbols, including the Nazi swastika, the Communist hammer and sickle, and the Hamas flag.

But it does not otherwise ban support of those organizations/ideologies.

[-] Metz@lemmy.world 15 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

Of course they are banned. There is a long list with organisations and groups that were banned since 1951. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_in_Deutschland_verbotener_rechtsextremer_Organisationen

Not only symbols are prohibited. Extreme-Right / Facist / Nazis writings, music, images, videos, etc. are also banned.

Holocaust denial is forbidden. Historical relativism in relation to the Second World War is prohibited. etc.

[-] FlowVoid@lemmy.world 3 points 3 weeks ago

Yes, the organizations themselves are banned.

Expressing support for them is not banned, unless accompanied by those symbols.

[-] Metz@lemmy.world 7 points 3 weeks ago

Admittedly, it is not enforced often enough and hard enough, but in general this falls under criminal organisations law.

German Criminal Code §129

Whoever supports such an organisation or recruits members or supporters for such an organisation incurs a penalty of imprisonment for a term not exceeding three years or a fine.

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Nothing. IF his personal billboard was used to post kitten gifs.

But since his personal billboard is used to promote nazism during an election and is big enough to be able to influence the results of the elections by simply filtering that people can see on it to be what he wants, I'd say that he is interfering in a democratic election, which is a crime in democratic countries.

[-] FelixCress@lemmy.world 19 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

Have you actually read the article?

“Elon Musk chatting with AfD leader Alice Weidel on X is covered by freedom of expression. His algorithmic manipulation, [which] is intentionally flooding German X timelines with far-right propaganda and drowning out progressive content, is not.”

[-] wewbull@feddit.uk 1 points 3 weeks ago

I'm pretty sure the second half is covered by freedom of expression too.

The people saying "election interference" are probably closest to having something real to pin on him, but circulation of propaganda is not election interference. Buying votes like he was doing is the US is, but he's not doing that here. Violating campaign or party donation rules would be, but I'm not aware of him doing that either.

You need an actual crime.

[-] FelixCress@lemmy.world 3 points 3 weeks ago

I am pretty sure that you are just another ignorant USian without the foggiest clue about how laws works outside of your ridiculous country.

[-] Wintex@lemm.ee 1 points 3 weeks ago

what you're saying is LITERALLY false. it's election interference in germany. his main actions would be covered in Manipulation campaigns in the information space or disinformation campaigns, but you could even make a case it's a hybrid threat. He'll probably also indirectly sponsor them monetarily if possible, which should also be illegal.

EITHER way, the one of the first three actions are all easily observed from the megalomaniac's behavior.

If you are trying to argue the courts won't be able to take action before he gets the AfD in power, sure. Is a law a law if it ain't enforced? No, I agree there.

[-] Maggoty@lemmy.world 10 points 3 weeks ago

Foreign election interference is generally illegal. Which is why it happens in back channels and under the table. He has openly declared his intent to do so though. That justifies blocking X and any source of funding Musk can bring into those countries. Hell it justifies an interpol warrant.

[-] Weirdmusic@lemmy.world 2 points 3 weeks ago

Then make it legal

[-] Treczoks@lemmy.world 98 points 3 weeks ago

Hit him on both fronts: Block X.com IP ranges and issue an international warrant for foreign election interference.

[-] apfelwoiSchoppen@lemmy.world 61 points 3 weeks ago

And sanction his other companies.

[-] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 23 points 3 weeks ago

These are the right answers.

Which of course will push him 100% harder to support his political benefactors, the nazis.

[-] odioLemmy@lemmy.world 9 points 3 weeks ago

He's already doing this. We worry too much about "oh how bad would the backlash be?" but we are already heading for X,com-powered fascism, what's to lose?

[-] golli@lemm.ee 74 points 3 weeks ago

Honestly, while I don't mind legal proceedings against Elon, the best thing the EU or any European government could do would be to start using alternatives to Twitter.

If they'd spin up their own mastodon instance and politicians, institutions and parties would start exclusively posting their statements there, then journalists would have to follow them and news organisations would also start linking those instead.

Twitter isn't as big here anyways, but doing that could imo make it even less so.

[-] jlh@lemmy.jlh.name 28 points 3 weeks ago
[-] GreyEyedGhost@lemmy.ca 2 points 3 weeks ago

This would be a reason for me to start using Mastodon. I currently don't, and never used Twitter, because the value i got wasn't worth the pain. Mastodon looks like it would be less pain, but there isn't any real value drawing me in. If my country or province spun up instances with verified accounts and media releases, I'd be very interested. If they made their own crappy app, thanks, I'll pass.

[-] x00z@lemmy.world 19 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

If they’d spin up their own mastodon instance

It's slowly becoming a thing yes.

[-] Evotech@lemmy.world 16 points 3 weeks ago

Yeah the police in Norway used to post all their ops messages on twitter. But now has a self developed platform they use.

It's probably going to go that way for a lot of stuff.

[-] DicJacobus@lemmy.world 50 points 3 weeks ago

The EU needs to wake up to the fact that its in a stage prepatory to war. They're under attack by a wave of fascists, Russian army on the east, and Politicians and Corporate Syndicates from America and within their own borders.

The entire State of Russia, Elon Musk's Megalomaniasphere, MAGA, Hungary's Fidesz, Germany'd AFD, France's RN. We're essentially in a plot similar to the tom clancy's Sum of all fears book, where a bunch of Fascists are trying to collectively take over the world.

Its a little conspiracy theorist-y, but some are suggesting the International Democracy Union is one angle of this plot.

[-] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 47 points 3 weeks ago

They shouldn't need to be pressured to stop him from engaging in election interference.

[-] felykiosa@sh.itjust.works 35 points 3 weeks ago

Simple block x , its better for everyone

[-] MaxPow3r11@lemmy.world 24 points 3 weeks ago

Block all of Musk's companies.

He's clearly a villain set on world domination.

What the fuck are we even doing as a SPECIES?

[-] fannymcslap@lemmy.world 34 points 3 weeks ago

Block Tesla sales and Twitter. Fuck this putrid cunt.

[-] HootinNHollerin@lemmy.dbzer0.com 33 points 3 weeks ago

Please do it before it’s too late

[-] Corkyskog@sh.itjust.works 17 points 3 weeks ago

Heck, use the illegal weapons on him too while we're at it.

[-] Fedizen@lemmy.world 19 points 3 weeks ago

Or, alternate plan, find some handsome italian lads who know how to use a gun.

[-] Andromxda@lemmy.dbzer0.com 17 points 3 weeks ago
[-] FundMECFSResearch 4 points 3 weeks ago
[-] savx@lemmy.world 16 points 3 weeks ago

they need to do what france did to durov. after the arrest, telegram did a major shift on content moderation. they need to make actual law enforcement instead of just saying things. but, eh, it's elon musk, i bet they dont have balls to stand against world richest dickhead.

[-] ouch@lemmy.world 3 points 3 weeks ago

Did he get out of France already?

[-] blady_blah@lemmy.world 8 points 3 weeks ago

I'm a little surprised that most countries don't have laws that make it a crime for non-citizens or people outside their country to influence elections. For any country, but the biggest and wealthiest, this seems like an obvious thing. Nobody wants their larger richer neighbor coming and interfering with their elections.

If you consider Twitter like a newspaper or other media outlet, then the owner of the media outlet using Twitter's megaphone should violate all sorts of laws. At least that would be my expectation......

[-] SaltySalamander@fedia.io 5 points 3 weeks ago

Ban his cars, ban his platform. Refuse entry if he tries to visit.

[-] adam_y@lemmy.world 3 points 3 weeks ago

When they say legal weapons, do they mean the sort of legal weapons we are allowing in Gaza?

[-] index@sh.itjust.works 2 points 3 weeks ago

See even governments are doing something about it, it's about time you all stop upvoting musk news

this post was submitted on 07 Jan 2025
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