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A California-based startup called Savor has figured out a unique way to make a butter alternative that doesn’t involve livestock, plants, or even displacing land. Their butter is produced from synthetic fat made using carbon dioxide and hydrogen, and the best part is —- it tastes just like regular butter.

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[-] atro_city@fedia.io 152 points 4 months ago

My thought was "I doubt you can make fat only with hydrogen and carbon", but fats/lipids are literally hydrocarbons. Adding other elements changes the taste, so it isn't necessary to have mammals anywhere in the production chain.

Very interesting and probably not the first time this is/has been done. It seems quite obvious.

[-] phdepressed@sh.itjust.works 59 points 4 months ago

It's quite obvious at a theoretical level but not easy in terms of figuring out the actual process. A lot of science like that.

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[-] Tryptaminev@lemm.ee 12 points 4 months ago

Adding other elements changes the taste,

This is not how chemistry works at all.

To start with, fatty acids also need Oxygen because of the COOH and OH group of the glycerin in fat. They are not hydrocarbons. You know what also is just made of Carbon, Oxygen and Hydrogen? Hundreds of thousands of molecules. All sugars and carbohydrates. If you allow for Nitrogen too, you could cover most molecules found in biological life.

None of this has any bearing on how difficult or complicated it is to synthesize these from more basic molecules like CO2 or H2.

[-] ValenThyme@reddthat.com 11 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

this is a good https://www.nature.com/articles/s41893-023-01241-2 article on different ways this can be done

i learned the nazis made butter from coal!

[-] disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world 11 points 4 months ago

Hopefully by producing a potentially profitable product, they’ll secure the funding to drive some carbon capture systems as well.

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[-] amio@kbin.run 125 points 4 months ago

the best part is —- it tastes just like regular butter.

Yeah, never heard that one before. Weird how every non-whatever replacement foodstuff tastes just like the original... literally 0% of the time.

[-] hperrin@lemmy.world 71 points 4 months ago

Butter is one of the few that I legitimately can’t tell the difference between the real thing and the vegan alternatives (some of them).

Cheese is the opposite. Not only have a never had a vegan cheese that tasted like real cheese, I’ve never had a vegan cheese that tasted good.

[-] match@pawb.social 25 points 4 months ago

I want that vegan blue cheese that won the competition and then got disqualified by dairy industry corruption

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[-] RebekahWSD@lemmy.world 10 points 4 months ago

I want to try non dairy cheeses but they're all so so bad it makes me sad. And super expensive for being bad!

[-] obinice@lemmy.world 10 points 4 months ago

Have you tried good proper butter? Not that weird white stuff Americans make. Actual flavourful yellow Irish butter.

Margarine tastes okay and I use it all the time, but it's a pale imitation of the real thing.

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[-] JayObey711@lemmy.world 23 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

I don't know about international food, but the German vegan meat companies like Rügenwalder Mühle and Like meat have made huge leaps last year. Mortadella, Fleischwurst, Schnitzel and Chicken Nuggets all taste almost identical to the original. Ground "meat" is close, but you have to chose the right kind for each recipe. More complex stuff is still really bad tho. I say all of this as a passionate vegan meat hater.

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[-] Stern@lemmy.world 63 points 4 months ago

Sounds like margarine with more chances to shit myself

[-] disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world 85 points 4 months ago

Margarine is made of hydrogenated oil. This is chemically identical to the fatty acids in butter. It’s not an alternative for dietary purposes, it’s just a more planet friendly solution.

[-] adarza@lemmy.ca 10 points 4 months ago

actual margarine is getting hard to find in stores around here, and when you do it's priced almost as high as a non-sale price of real butter. margarine has 80% fat content and similar baking and cooking properties as butter.

what's on store shelves is a cheapened, watered down product laced with extra chemicals and fillers, ranging from 25-40% oil and can't even make a proper box of mac & cheese. some of them don't even melt when put on toast, hot, right from the toaster.

[-] imPastaSyndrome@lemm.ee 23 points 4 months ago

I see you didn't read the article

[-] Hamartiogonic@sopuli.xyz 15 points 4 months ago

Basic internet etiquette. Never read the article. Disagree with everyone. You are always right. Everyone else is always wrong etc.

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[-] whotookkarl@lemmy.world 9 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

I think it's closer to the coal butter synthesis but maybe they found a more efficient method using other carbon sources

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margarine#Coal_butter

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fischer%E2%80%93Tropsch_process

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[-] mipadaitu@lemmy.world 32 points 4 months ago

Interesting way to get fat alternatives, people are already used to eating fake butter regularly, so it probably wouldn't take much to add this to our diet.

[-] disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world 48 points 4 months ago

It’s also closer to butter than butter alternatives. It’s not made to be more healthy, just more planet friendly.

[-] Ephera@lemmy.ml 27 points 4 months ago

Fat and oil production from animal and plant-based sources are collectively responsible for about 3.5 billion tons of CO2

You cannot be serious that animal-based and plant-based are grouped in this figure. Plant-based is likely close to carbon-neutral, and only not net-negative, because of transport, cooling etc., which will also be necessary for this artificially created fat...

[-] disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world 30 points 4 months ago

Tilling, seeding, treating, and harvesting all require machinery and therefore increase carbon output in farming.

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[-] match@pawb.social 12 points 4 months ago

Well you see, animal sources are responsible for 3.7 billion tons and plant sources are responsible for -0.2 billion tons.

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[-] phdepressed@sh.itjust.works 27 points 4 months ago

The biggest question which is barely alluded to in the article is cost. If it can't compete with mass produced butter at cost and scale then it'll just be another "alternative" which is good but not as big.

They also mention that they compared emissions and land use but give no aspect of what synthetic processes are used (I'd assume they at least have provisional patents on the "how to" already).

[-] SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world 15 points 4 months ago

Take all the subsidies out of the dairy industry and see how competitively priced butter actually is.

[-] ganksy@lemmy.world 10 points 4 months ago

Could be subsidized as a "real" carbon offset. That could make it competitive with other butters. Assuming it's actually legit.

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[-] Deebster@programming.dev 10 points 4 months ago

“The big challenge is to drive down the price so that products like Savor’s become affordable to the masses—either the same cost as animal fats or less. Savor has a good chance of success here, because the key steps of their fat-production process already work in other industries,” Gates said.

Sounds like it's not currently price competitive but it might be in the future. I expect economies of scale would be helpful too.

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[-] catbum@lemmy.world 22 points 4 months ago
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[-] Asetru@feddit.org 21 points 4 months ago

During WW2, due to the food shortage, Germans did this using the carbon from coal... The process is old and known.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margarine#Coal_butter

Let's see if the process can be made more efficient this time. Allegedly, the product was virtually indistinguishable from butter.

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[-] I_Fart_Glitter@lemmy.world 20 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

Computer! Butter! Room temp!

[-] cmbabul@lemmy.world 18 points 4 months ago

If this were to take off France and the US South by themselves could eat us out of climate change in a matter of months

[-] olafurp@lemmy.world 15 points 4 months ago

Don't want to be a hater but doesn't this basically create fat without nutrients? It feels like this is reinventing margarine albeit in a cool way.

[-] disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world 19 points 4 months ago

They’re the same fatty acids found in butter. Margarine is hydrogenated oil.

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[-] 01189998819991197253@infosec.pub 15 points 4 months ago
[-] hark@lemmy.world 14 points 4 months ago

Is it as bad for your health as hydrogenated oils?

[-] CoffeeJunkie@lemmy.world 16 points 4 months ago

Even if it is -- I'm interested in seeing how it performs. Feed some rats 3-5x the recommended amount, see what happens. Have some long term studies.

If it is the same as what we use, right now, for a lessened cost or environmental impact, that is still worth exploring.

[-] pezmaker@sh.itjust.works 11 points 4 months ago

Guarantee that A) it doesn't taste just like real butter, and B) it'll make you shit yourself and bring a return of the label "may cause anal leakage".

Does that mean it's not a potentially viable product? No, it doesn't. But let's not bullshit.

[-] disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world 47 points 4 months ago

The problem with Olestra (the anal leakage oil alternative) is it’s a mixture of hexa-, hepta-, and octa-esters of sucrose with various long chain fatty acids. The resulting radial arrangement is too large and irregular to move through the intestinal wall and be absorbed into the bloodstream.

What Savor has supposedly created is chemically identical to the fatty acids in butter. It’s not made of new compounds, but made in a new way.

[-] atro_city@fedia.io 16 points 4 months ago

What's up with people talking about shitting themselves?

[-] Nasan@sopuli.xyz 12 points 4 months ago

We're in the presence of masters of the art of shitting one's self

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[-] nandeEbisu@lemmy.world 10 points 4 months ago

I wonder if they can use CO2 that comes from industrial carbon capture, or if it needs to be something purer that takes a lot of energy to produce.

Also, I'm not sure if we can get industrial volumes of hydrogen from sources other than fossil fuels now. Its been a while, but last I checked it was coming from things like byproducts from reformers.

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[-] cyborganism@lemmy.ca 9 points 4 months ago

So they invented another kind of margarine.

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this post was submitted on 14 Jul 2024
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