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this post was submitted on 15 Sep 2023
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You kinda did though. At least that's the stance anyone reading your previous comment is going to infer.
No, I said supporting prejudicial views normalizes it and thus exacerbates it. I didn't say all prejudices were equal. But, continue to support it if you want. Maybe I will too, seems healthy.
See you are kinda doing it again. I was explaining why Americans are the focus of frustration but you want to be reductive about it and just make it all flat prejudice. That frame work puts it on equal footing with actual serious prejudices.
You're right. I will now be prejudiced. Thank you for the enlightenment. Truly inspiring stuff.
Or you could have been reasonable at any point.
Naw, children aren't prejudiced, they have to be taught that. I'm prejudiced now, all grown up.
So are you acknowledging then that you were categorizing knocking on Americans as the same as prejudice against Roma?
Yes, oh yes, the very same thing. And being prejudiced against either is very much OK and good.
I also think America is number one, the best, two thumbs up. We're better than everyone.
I also know that you believe this, too, because you're American. Godamn we're awesome, this rules.
This new perspective is so much easier than acknowledging the uniqueness of the human spirit. What a relief.
I learned it from watching you, dad!
Speaking of which, brb, gotta go teach my kids to judge people based on things outside of their control.
Well you introduced the childish sarcasm to this conversation so you couldn't really learn it from me.
Wait a second. So you're saying that you were actually being serious while justifying prejudicial views as long as they weren't as bad as others!?
I was just fucking around, you should consider not supporting that. It gives weight to much larger issues.
I didn't justify it. I explained where it comes from. You went on to be reductive in order to use what you thought was more grand rhetoric because you are weirdly defensive about Americans. I don't think you are just fucking around. I think you probably do think something along the lines of "making fun of Americans is prejudice. Being bigoted against Roma is prejudice." And then making no further distinctions. You keep trying to pull that "you should stop supporting prejudice" line which is either you being sincere or you "just fucking around" but it's hard to tell since what you think is sarcasm is dangerously close to what you seem to actually believe.
You're right. I do think being bigoted against the Rromani is predijuce. But, I'm not so sure if you believe that. Americans are so blinded by hate, they really will justify anything.
So I said that knocking on Americans is not on the same level as being bigoted against Roma but you are somehow concerned that that means I don't think being bigoted against Roma is prejudice? Is that you being sincere or just fucking around again?
You made that point as if it were relevant or necessary. It's insulting and simple-minded to believe that speaking out against prejudice is necessarily equivocation. And it's frankly weird to support being prejudiced at all. And the lengths to which you fight for that view is gross, and you're in bad company.
Ok so it's not that you don't think there is a difference you just think that difference is irrelevant and that acknowledging that difference is supporting prejudice?
I think you support being prejudiced as an acceptable moral premise, and you bring up equivocation in a weak attempt to justify it.
Again I can't tell if you are sincere or just fucking around again.
Ok because before you were not being serious and it's a pretty fine line between what you say when you are just fucking around and what you say when you are being serious.
Naw, I was just making fun of your support for bigotry. I think that shit is whack.
And the support of bigotry thing is still you being sincere? Cause that's in direct opposition to everything I've said so far.
Naw, I was like, "boo bigotry," and you were like, "Yeah, but it's understandable in this case, and also, it's worse for the Roma so I can’t believe you think they're the same 🤓."
I think that making fun of Americans or not being fond of them in response to the decades of American exceptionalism messaging falls below the threshold of bigotry. But you seem to think that it doesn't. That's what makes it seem like you are putting that one the same level as serious issues of bigotry.
I stand against all forms of bigotry, period. You don't.
I do actually stand against bigotry, I just have reasonable standards for what qualifies as bigotry. That you just made that statement reinforces my point that you are treating making fun of braggart Americans as being as heinous as actual forms of bigotry.
What do you base that on? Or are you just fucking around again?
So you've stopped being sincere again. But we do seem to have settled on you actually were putting mocking Americans at the same level as actual bigotry. Were you just fucking around before when you took exception to that observation?
Jesus christ, I knew Americans were dumb, but it's worse than I thought.
I'm calling you out on the bigotry you accept, but turning it back on you because obviously you don't believe those things about yourself. And you don't deserve to be judged by other people's bigoted perceptions.
I don’t think all bigotry is on the same level no matter how many times you say it. But an American probably dosen't even understand that they can be bigoted.
I just don't buy that making fun of people going on about how they are number one is bigotry. I think calling it that is what cheapens actual bigotry. How much of what you just said was sincere and how much is just fucking around?
Godamn, you actually believe that shit and think it's OK. Remarkable.
Bigotry: obstinate or unreasonable attachment to a belief, opinion, or faction, in particular prejudice against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group.
You are a bigot. You seem to be ok with that, and that's fine. People being bigger bigots than you dosen't justify it.
Which if you take the unreasonable stance that making fun of Americans for bragging for decades is bigotry makes sense. But I still can't tell what you actually believe. I assume that you were not being serious when you used a circular definition for labeling me a braggart but that's a risky assumption. I'm guessing that you are being disingenuous and trying what you think is a clever rhetorical method of being insulting to me for being an American so that you can bait me into saying that you yourself are being a bigot. It really is hard to distinguish your fucking about from what you really believe.
You actually think those things about Americans because you are a bigot. You believe those things so wholeheartedly that you don't even see that they're not true, even for yourself.
Believe what things?
The things you downplay as just "making fun of." The dumb shit you believe about people.
Let me put it this way.
I work within a large international collaboration. If I "made fun of" these types of stereotypes about my colleagues, then I would be looked down upon for that ignorance, rightfully so. And our work would suffer for it. And if they believed similar things about me, I would lose respect for them too, for being bigots.
If I tried to brush off my actions by saying, "Come on, it's no big deal. I'm just making fun, it's not on the same level as others, etc." I'd probably end up in HR. Again, rightfully so
Make sense?
So we come back to the point that American exceptionalism was a huge part of America's messaging and something that the majority of them believed and didn't question at the time. Hell large portions of Americans believe that still. That's real. It was baseless bragging and self promoting most of the time. Or are you referring to something else? Responding to that arrogance with the same measure of disrespect or scoffing openly at the claims isn't bigotry. Make sense?
What the fuck are you talking about. You ascribing those views to an entire group is the problem. And it is bigotry no matter how self-righteous it makes you feel.
So I'm not ascribing it to the entire group, that's an unfounded leap on your part. Majority doesn't mean entirety. Give "history of American exceptionalism" a Google. This isn't some fringe idea. So again not bigotry. It's a real wide spread thing.
OK 👍, I'll just make fun of people from another country and justify it by saying a "majority" of them believe it, so it must be true for them.
It makes sense that you think you are exceptional, how arrogant, how typical.
Goodnight, bigot.
I still can't tell if you are just fucking around again or if you are sincerely saying that I think I'm exceptional. I think you lost track of that thread too. You should consider being honest and straightforward in conversations instead of this convoluted ambiguous fucking around.