1317
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[-] Diplomjodler@feddit.de 286 points 2 years ago

I wish them the best of luck. Not that they have any chance of success but the more damage they cause to the Russian army, the better

[-] perviouslyiner@lemm.ee 90 points 2 years ago

Was there actually anything stopping them before, other than some traffic cops with a grenade launcher, and some excavator operators frantically digging up the motorway?

[-] Dntshoot@lemmy.world 118 points 2 years ago

No, but they chickened out and now Putin has had a month to set up defenses

[-] Corkyskog@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 years ago

It was a bad idea to begin with. Putin would and did flee to his bunker and then have to endure a siege on Moscow after that... There is no way they win a siege against the Russian army, in Moscow.

[-] Dntshoot@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

Yea but at least he would have died fighting. Now he died for nothing lol

[-] Corkyskog@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 years ago

Died fighting whom? The Russian populace that he seems to support, and are apathetic at worst towards him? It's not like Putin himself was going to lead the siege charge on horse back carrying an AK or something.

[-] KIM_JONG_JUICEBOX@lemmy.ml 2 points 2 years ago

Putin lost his corn flakes.

[-] thenightisdark@lemmy.world 13 points 2 years ago

Wagner group doesn't have any air assets, the Air Force probably could annihilate them on the way to Moscow. Not much cover in Russia

[-] M0oP0o@mander.xyz 18 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Well that did not work so well the first time. No idea if they still have any anti air capacity though.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/06/26/wagner-group-shot-down-seven-russian-aircraft-coup-attempt/

[-] skillissuer@discuss.tchncs.de 8 points 2 years ago

not anymore, they had to give up all heavy equipment

The Russian Air Force sucks absolute balls at CAS. Apart from their general systemic issues, they don’t train for CAS, and it shows in Ukraine. Also, when Wagner tried to bum-rush Moscow the first time, pilots who actually attempted CAS missions didn’t do so well - there are several videos of them trying to airstrike Wagner positions and columns where the Russian pilots are not even close to putting munitions on-target effectively.

[-] BackOnMyBS@lemmy.world 6 points 2 years ago

Wagner even shot down one Russian helicopter.

[-] Silverseren@kbin.social 6 points 2 years ago

Wagner did manage to take down quite a few Russian air units in a short period of time before.

Whether that was due to lack of organization and command among the Russian military because of the surprise of Wagner's actions is up for debate, but I guess we might get to see how that turns out this time around.

[-] InvertedParallax@lemm.ee 5 points 2 years ago
[-] thenightisdark@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

Anti-aircraft is different than air assets I get it that both are AA but I meant an air assets not anti-aircraft. 👍

[-] fluke@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago

Same could have been said for their day trip. And that saw several helicopters and a couple of fixed wing aircraft getting knocked out the sky.

[-] dditty@lemm.ee 8 points 2 years ago

You forget that Russia had some garbage trucks lined up as well 🧱

[-] agressivelyPassive@feddit.de 9 points 2 years ago

We call them tactical landfill launchers.

[-] Silverseren@kbin.social 6 points 2 years ago

I wonder if Putin will try destroying the roads to Moscow again.

[-] awwwyissss@lemm.ee 7 points 2 years ago

And run away to hide in St. Petersburg

[-] Jaysyn@kbin.social 20 points 2 years ago

FSB as an organization needs to die to the man before anything good can happen in Russia.

[-] Strangle@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

Wouldn’t they have a better chance if Biden funded them?

[-] xkforce@lemmy.world 41 points 2 years ago

I hope that you realize at some level how batshit insane that idea is.

[-] BNE 1 points 2 years ago

Oops, All Taliban!™️

[-] CarbonIceDragon@pawb.social 19 points 2 years ago

Considering they're arguably even worse than Putin, we probably don't want them to actually have a chance at being successful, it's just that any forces Russia has to use to stop them are forces they aren't using in Ukraine. Giving them funding would be a seriously bad move.

[-] Jumper775@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago

If Biden funds them Biden funds a direct attack on Russia, due to the increased pressure Russia will take that as an attack from the US and will escalate. We want to deescalate everything we can because we don’t know if putin will use his nukes, and if he does the world ends. Putin will not win a war with the us though, so he may not care about the end of the world.

[-] bernieecclestoned@sh.itjust.works 6 points 2 years ago

Every near nuclear war has been averted by Russian officers. The dude on the sub near Cuba and the other dude who realised that the USA hadn't launched nukes, it was their computer system falsely alerting.

100% success rate so far!

[-] skillissuer@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 2 years ago

nukes were never on the table. putin's goal number one is holding power in russia, and it's no fun when it's all shiny glass or when you're dead. the reason behind invasion? believe it or not, also holding more power within russia. over two decades of putin's presidency, he carefully molded his electoral base to consist of nationalists, and every time he invaded another country his ratings went up (2008, georgia, 2014, donbas, 2022, ukraine, at least initially) because even if your elections are faked, you need it to be believable and you need to have some real support. that's even how he got presidency in the first place, by initiating second chechen war

in this situation, what options putin does have?

  • he can't sue for peace right now, or deescalate in a big way, because his electoral base will see this as a sign of weakness and move on to another rabid nationalist
  • he can't escalate, because he has little to escalate with, in terms of (modern) equipment and (mobilized) manpower. mobilization is an unacceptable political risk, additionally, he runs a risk of corresponding western escalation, with west is much more capable of, and would consist of equipment only, which is much less politically risky
  • he can't use nukes, because there's already nuclear bunker buster with his name somewhere in the midwest and he probably wants it to stay there

the only survivable option for putin seems to keep intensity at this level or lower, try to limit western aid, and try to slowly grind through to whatever propaganda objective he wants. remember all these russian threats, that if west provides whatever equipment, they will use nuukes! it seems that everyone called bluff on this one, multiple times. conversely, the more favourable scenario for ukraine is escalation. more info here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWKGYnO0Jf4 https://yt.artemislena.eu/watch?v=fWKGYnO0Jf4

[-] PipedLinkBot@feddit.rocks 1 points 2 years ago

Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/watch?v=fWKGYnO0Jf4

Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.

I'm open-source, check me out at GitHub.

this post was submitted on 24 Aug 2023
1317 points (100.0% liked)

World News

46510 readers
1817 users here now

A community for discussing events around the World

Rules:

Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.


Lemmy World Partners

News !news@lemmy.world

Politics !politics@lemmy.world

World Politics !globalpolitics@lemmy.world


Recommendations

For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS