this post was submitted on 15 Jan 2025
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Privacy
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The only thing I want to hear from you is that you actively disavow Trump, or if you feel this is going to hurt your business, at least say nothing at all. Anything other than that marks you as a shameless suck-up, and I want nothing to do with you or your business.
Ergo, I want nothing to do with Proton. It's time suck-ups pay the price and see their bottom lines drop because of their dubious choices.
if you disavow every company contributing to the republican party/trump you might as well sell all your belongs, and learn to live off grid. no internet access, no power, no retail.
we just dont live in a black and white world. its lovely shades of depressing grey gradients.
As much as possible, I will take my business to companies that aren't openly terrible.
Tell that to the orange utan. He sure is about to turn the word from RGB to 1-pixel color space.
Do you really think I want to split people into people I can talk to vs. people I want to avoid at all costs? Trump is doing that. He's forcing shitty choices on everybody. I'd rather have constructive and peaceful interaction with my fellow man. But can you honestly shake hands with a magard and not feel sick to your stomach? I can't.
right, i agree the idea is revolting... but the old man at the dog park who only watches fox news isnt inherently evil. hes brainwashed. hes a fellow human who if shown the light would absolutely change his tune. to abandon those people is to abandon civilization.
sure thats not everyone, but its enough. we just need to show them the truth.. that theyve been lied to and actually do have a choice.
treating every conservative voter as you would trump himself is absolutely painting in black and white.
I'm sorry but no.
You have the die-hard racist MAGAs with the flags and the red cap. Those can fuck right off obviously.
But you also have all the ordinary folks who are NOT die-hard MAGA, but who decided that it was okay to vote for a convicted felon who tried to overthrow the government. And guess what: in a sense, they're even worse.
Voting for Trump is crossing a line. If you voted for Trump, I really don't want anything to do with you because you have proved to me that your sense of morality and your respect for the institutions of this country are compromised.
Either that or so fucking stupid that interacting with them wouldn't be worth my time. I honestly used to believe what originallucifer said, but after this election i've been thoroughly and completely radicalized.
remember that 88 million people who can vote, dont.
many of those that did vote are under a veil of propaganda. theyre not all rabid maga racists. its been proven that one-on-one interaction with adversaries can often change their minds. its just a slow, painful process.
The Dems have been "reaching across the aisle" since before I was born. How's that working out? 20 years ago, racism was couched under the guise of "it's just a joke." 10 years ago, the racists and transphobes were screaming about how they were getting canceled for their views on their TV specials. Today, members of the incoming administration have openly called for the genocide of trans people (their words, not mine).
America has always been deeply bigoted. It's just out in the open now. And with my life on the line, the only thing I'm reaching across the aisle with is a loaded gun. The time for reconciliation is past. It's time to make Nazis afraid again.
Nah dog, I'm good. I've tried, not gonna do it again.
I once read this on lemmy and it stuck with me. I think it applies here:
True for me, and worse, I never seem to learn.
Fuck, that's just exactly me. It's an autism trait??
More and more, I approach wishing everyone was autistic lmao
Does this actually sound like a utopia to anyone else or just me?
Sure, there's not always an option, but sometimes there is. My tiny bit of $ isn't going to make or break a company, but i try to give it to places who donate less to the big orange turd. I'm in a constant struggle choosing among home Depot, lowes, and Ace hardware.
Just be aware that this is a peculiarly American take. In Europe at least, most people will agree that somebody's opinions cannot somehow pollute whatever it is that they produce. Be it a traded good, or art, or in this case software.
Americans did not invent the idea of voting with their wallets. What a preposterous claim
The concept that wrong opinions are like a taint that rubs off on everything they touch is indeed pretty uniquely American (with some echos in the rest of the anglosphere). It explains much of the craziness and bitterness of US politics in recent years. It is absolutely not replicated in, for example, Catholic Europe.
Avoiding giving your money to companies that go against your politics isn't some irrational "tainted" concept. Not sure why you're insisting it is. It's just not supporting things you don't want to happen. These companies donate to and otherwise push forward bad policy. Also, still not sure where you got that Americans invented any of this, or how it would relate to the recent increase in polarization
This is a guy's personal opinion about one aspect of a politician's program. The only fact he mentions is just that, a fact. His insinuation that Democrats are supported by big business is also fairly defensible. There's no obvious link to his company's practices. The opinion is banal and widespread. You and a bunch of others here are treating this semi-non-story like some kind of religious heresy. I can tell you're American just from that fact.
The truth comes out. You think this is a "both sides" thing, and you agree with it.
No, what's being said ITT is that he's praising trump prematurely and people don't want to support a business run by people who do that. Incredibly simple, and might I add, logical.
I don't. I'm not American (as if it wasn't already clear) but if I were then I would have voted for anyone but Trump and done it with both hands. He's a literal insurrectionist, an obvious criminal, a complete charlatan, a nasty bully, and generally an all-round terrible human being. I'm a pretty phlegmatic person so these are big words and I mean it.
But I still won't judge a whole company based on the personal opinions of one of its employees.
...this is their CEO. "One of their employees" couldn't possibly be more unrepresentative here.
That's fair. Still, I will judge the company on what it does. The situation calls for vigilance, not hysterically running for the exit. Until proof to the contrary is forthcoming, Proton can still be considered a force for good.
Is this thread hysterical? I don't think so. Only saw like 3 people saying they would see this as a sign to stop patronizing the company, which makes sense to me entirely. You might be misreading the tone here.
Well one thing's for sure anyway: you're intolerantly downvoting all my opinions while I'm letting yours stand. Symptomatic of my underlying point.
Weird, I noticed all my comments got a downvote by the time I loaded your replies. In any case, reading so much into a downvote might also fall under "misreading tone". Kinda laughable to me in any case that downvoting could correlate to such political turmoil which is what you seem to be saying.
Probably not but censoriousness over wrong opinions is definitely a US specialty these days. I see in the culture and I've seen it in person with my own eyes. Culture can have deep roots and America, after all, was founded by religious fundamentalists. The 1st Amendment probably plays a role too. You don't see any of this because you're on the inside.
I would probably agree with you to some degree within other contexts, but I do not see anything like that here. It's easy, vote with your wallet. Don't like something a company or its executives do? Don't give them money, done, easy.
Praising trump for something he hasn't even done yet seems like a no brainer to me. It's indicative of an attitude held by the person that can make sweeping changes to Proton as a company. I don't see how it's controversial honestly. If this post also showed a campaign of people demanding everyone stop using proton over this opinion, maybe you'd have a point. Spreading it for awareness is a good thing, not "hysteria".
Edit: One last thing, can you provide evidence that any of this originated in America? "You are on the inside and don't see it" is not evidence.
Fair enough. We can agree on that.
It's not a personal opinion:
Notice how it says "here is our official response"
This. Also, in Europe you can get internet, electricity, email from coops. There are even some "ethical banks" and some survivors from the 2008 (at least in Sapin) as "small savings rural banks" (cajas de ahorros).
And if you aren't a rich progressist and can't afford some expensive eco-bio-coop consume, there are 2d hand options, food recicling, stealing is easy enough (and nobody will shoot a bullet to you for this) and so on. So, yeah, off-the-grid is a legit option, but on-the-grid stealing electricity from huge power corps is super legit also. No need to go to the caves.
Even in case of no alternative (say, I must have an id and a cellphone number), this doesn't justify anything from CEOs. Fun fact is, in the case of Proton, there is PLENTY of alternatives. So, let's use all the colorful gradients instead of accepting to remain in a dark-gray scale
I mean for most people there are lots of variables here. You have to pick and choose your battles. This is the entire concept of The Good Place TV show.
The only people that are 100% "good" are living in a fuckin yurt.
Idk in the rest of Europe, but in France I've witnessed the contrary a lot of times. I do however not have a study on a big enough sample to make a claim, this is all anecdotal evidence on my side.
Examples please. France is the classic example of a country where most people put the art before the artist. The partial exception, unsurprisingly, is younger people who are more plugged into the poisonous world of America's culture wars.
Even Michael Jackson?
Absolutely, yes. Great example. Great music. I guarantee you that almost everyone outside of the US-centric bit of the anglosphere agrees with me here.
Well, assuming they actually like music, of course.
Do you even use Proton?
I do yes - VPN. I won't next month though.