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this post was submitted on 16 Oct 2024
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politics
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it must be really nice to be privileged enough to have this viewpoint. and all for what? so you can give yourself a nice ethical pat on the back when you help siphon from the dems, and the gop comes after women and minorities? not sure what your background is but damn dude that's some fucked up shit
Ok I've heard all kinds of different reasons someone might be privileged, but doing work on the ground for years and laying the groundwork for real activism rather than whatever the hell you call this terminally online bullshit, is now what you people call privilege?
This shit is why Occupy died.
ground activism is great! but this person's comment pretty much sums up to "whichever if the two candidates win in November, I won't be effected enough to consider not tossing my vote into the trash to prove a point," as do all 3rd party arguments. that's privileged.
many many people quite literally have their lives on the line with this election, it's extremely disrespectful to put them all in danger for some self centered, ill-thought out attempt at morality.
Occupy died because of "terminally online bullshit"? I guess that terminally online bullshit is either more effective than what you're suggesting or your analysis sucks.
One whole paragraph followed by a comment like that implies someone is usually talking about the whole episode going on and not just the keywords you singled out.
I still don't get why you think occupy died, but regardless it wasn't because of online shit or coopted lingo.
I've bumped into a bunch of you online socialists before and every one of you thinks your efforts made some profound difference when in reality socialism is still a nothing nowhere movement in the US and we get more fascist every election cycle.
And whose fault is that? When you give your vote away for free you get rightward drift. Make the fuckers earn it instead of leaving the switch on Vote Blue No Matter Who like the good little liberal you are.
It's the collective fault of the American electorate.
Maybe they just like the GOP but don't want to admit that they like them.
They also completely disregard the fact that the Voting System itself causes the very problems they have with the political system.
First Past the Post is 100% the reason why we vote against a party, rather than for a candidate.
That combined with the Permanent Apportionment Act of 1929 have caused all sorts of problems. That too is something to advocate against. But one thing at a time.
What background do I need to have in order to be allowed to recognize that the mathematics of lesser evils don’t make any sense?
Is there some amount of subjugation I can be under that allows me to have a materialist analysis?
Literally me: Don’t encourage these scumbags, don’t wait another moment to stand up for what you know is right, voting is the easiest way to make your voice heard!
You: wow, must be nice!
If youre reading this, don’t listen to people who try to mobilize identity politics against you. They don’t know or care who you are and would hate you more if you were a minority speaking out.
A mathematically illiterate one.
See, we live under a system of First Past the Post, otherwise known as Plurality.
It's a system that forces a two party system. Not as a conscious choice, but as a consequence of the very system itself.
Here's the kicker. Plurality voting actively punishes you for supporting a third party.
If you siphon votes away from the lesser of two evils, the greater evil wins.
It's a pretty simple concept. And since we are just weeks away from the election, anyone who is actively pushing for third parties is automatically suspect.
Because the problems with Plurality are not some newly discovered quirk. They've been studied for centuries, but most extensively by Kenneth Arrow in the 70s.
What I'm saying is that most of the money given to support Third Parties, comes from people who are on the opposite side of the spectrum from those Third Parties.
Simply put, Trump and company throw money at the Greens and Socialists to siphon support away from the Dems, so that Trump and company can win with fewer votes.
So you, advocating for a third party, are mathematically indistinguishable from a Trump supporter.
Wow if third parties are so powerful then how come you’re not voting for one too?
It seems like a great way to force the major party of your choice to pay attention to your politics.
I'm not voting Third party because I'm not a Trump Supporter.
But you may be one. Mathematically speaking.
My vote isn’t going to be counted for trump, and is for a party in opposition to his program.
You have a funny way of figuring out if someone is a trump supporter. Is it perhaps based on the old “with us or against us” chestnut?
You should know before you keep pushing that line, I will not vote Harris. If there was no party for socialism and liberation, I’d vote a different third party. If there were no third parties, I’d write a candidate in.
If you want to pick up a Harris vote, look elsewhere.
But you're publicly advocating for others to drop their support of Harris in favor of a third party.
Which is mathematically identical to telling people to vote for Trump. So I name thee a Trump supporter, because that's the only person who benefits from your actions.
Where?
My top level reply is an attempt to get Green Party voters who are starting to not feel so good to switch over to psl.
Also it’s not mathematically identical because my third party vote isn’t counted for trump.
I’m kinda surprised you care. Your party has written us off, do you not agree with their decision?
Man. Its really sad seeing people out here pretending they've got a math degree. Out here saying shit like not 7 equals 6. Get the fuck out of here with that dumb shit. Being a part of the subset does not make you the whole fucking set. If a vote for PSL or Green or fucking whatever, means more left leaning politicians elected locally and nationally, then great. It absolutely does not support Trump. It supports making the DNC maybe fucking listen to the left for once. Stop fucking going further and further right into pushing back against immigration. Stop supporting committing literal genocide in the hopes israel takes over iran for its lithium deposits and the rest of the middle east for the oil. Instead y'all would rather shill for genocide & becoming more and more evil as long as the other party gets evil fastererer.
But since you love math so much: The Libertarian/Constitution party has 3x the vote of green/PSL. Green/PSL was 0.31% of the total vote last presidential election. Which was 0.1% of the total number of possible votes. Stop focusing on shaming the few who absolutely won't vote DNC but still likely will vote down ballot and instead maybe focus on making your party actually have policies people would give a shit about, or focus on the DNC doing something to actually energize voters outside of making sure Trump runs against them so they can point to big scary. Or like, literally anything that might help you. Shaming 3rd party voters is just going to lose you more elections. Like, holy fuck do y'all learning nothing from 2016? Y'all look at Michigan and freak out about green party, ignoring that even fucking the constitution party had more votes than the tiny gap. and the libertarian party had 3x the amount. Even if the DNC successfully made it illegal to vote 3rd party like they seem to want to, they would've lost Michigan in 2012. They know that too. They just want to scapegoat someone instead of themselves. Stop blaming people other than the DNC. They're the ones who actively fought as hard as they could against any progressive policies. Letting Clinton using the "victory fund" well before securing the nomination in order to campaign against Bernie. literally just shooting itself in the face. Not a surprise they lost while doing that.
Anyways, sorry, people being shills for stupid DNC talking points made to alienate leftists and lose more elections annoys the fuck out of me.
For some fucked up reason, this election is close enough to make every vote matter. So, yes, pulling support from Harris is mathematically indistinguishable from supporting Trump.
Also, I always look down on idiots who think they can accomplish anything by separating themselves from the system. No, we work to fix it from within, or we don't get to fix it at all.