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"Do something!" Michelle Obama's big-hearted, urgent, barn-burner of a convention speech
(www.motherjones.com)
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this post was submitted on 21 Aug 2024
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politics
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We are doing something, refusing to support another war mongering neoliberal.
So instead support a felonious warmongering rerun fascist billionaire Wall Street cock holster?
We play the cards we are dealt and put pressure where we can to force their hands. If every pork chop were perfect, we wouldn't have hotdogs.
This. Cornel west and Jill Stein are not options in this. If you live in a safely blue state, go ahead vote your heart out.
But just know that there is no scenario where West or Stein win. If that doesn't happen and Trump wins, we will not have another election. Trump is literally going to put the most evil anti democracy zealots into very powerful roles. And with a Republican scotus, we will be fucked. That is the outcome here. So you can be pragmatic or vote your conscience but the risk is that we will be fucked.
If there's one thing that 2016/2020 should have taught us is; presidential elections matter not just because of who is leading the country but who is selecting judges and filling very important roles in the government. Ultimately, our lesson should be that things can always get worse.
One of Jill Stein’s major international positions is that the US should immediately withdraw from NATO.
Now, let’s ask ourselves: which parties on the world geopolitical stage would massively benefit from that happening?
TL;DR: don’t vote for Stein, under any circumstances.
I know hardly anything about West, though. But I agree that everyone pushing 3rd parties as a valid choice in the general has their head firmly up their ass.
That's considered a positive outcome if you are on .ml.
And if Harris continues to support what Israel is doing in Gaza, then we already have evil anti-democracy zealots in our most powerful roles, so what's the difference?
Equating the Israel-Gaza conflict with anti-democracy is absurd. One side literally wants to end voting, destroy the Constitution, and install a fascist regime that would be far worse for everyone, including Palestinians. If you can't see the difference, then you're part of the problem. Go ahead and pretend a hockey puck is an ice cream sandwich if you want, but don't drag the rest of us into your delusions. Either you're being intentionally deceitful, or you've got the cognitive capacity of an empty bucket.
And the other side just supports that in occupied Palestine.
I didn't realize Trump supports the Palestinians!
See the difference yet?
No.
"Nuh uh, you"
Fucking child. Go back to the fucking playground.
Dude. Take the time to read and comprehend. Things can always get worse. Do you think Trump will help Palestinians?
We really need you to pull your head out of your ass. The extremely simple reality follows, and I am speaking for every reasonable person:
The situation in Gaza is not supported by us. It's evil. It should not be happening. We condemn it. However, we also recognize that around our elections some war or conflict occurs. Moreover, possibly more than any other time in modern history, we are educated.
It is precisely the idea of malicious and evil persons intent on causing as much harm as possible why we must turn inward and focus on stopping more damage from occurring. Harris, Walz, Biden, they are not the same. We need you to back up and look at the larger picture. In fact, traditionally Republicans have used wars and conflict to distract the Left leaning voting bases. They know their supporters will, quite literally if you let them, go in guns blazing in support of war, all of them yelling some false patriotic zing of a bad battle cry. Meanwhile, the rest of us condemn it in various ways and that breaks us apart.
Look, I understand your frustration. To you it must appear as if we are okay with people dying. We're not. We just accept that if Trump, and more importantly the people who coerce their way into certain positions, are allowed to take the Presidency that it will get worse. Much worse. We aren't willing to let that happen due to ethical or moral quandaries. As gross as it is to have to turn inward and focus here when people are being killed. We have a job to do.
Fail that and we may as well apologize to the entire world.
If you haven't noticed things have been getting worse. And electing Democrats again and again hoping things will change isn't working out so well. Their role is to protect that status quo, to ensure things DONT change for the better.
Yeah, that’s basically what they want. They are fine with the new rabid brand of GOP fascism ruining the country and the western world.
Many of these people are the ones who chant “death to America.” They just want to burn it down on the chance that something better might replace it someday in the future. Never mind the fascism and death that would result in the meantime. They’re not shy of violence anyway, but it’d be easier for them if it’s someone else doing it. It’s why they support leaders like Putin and Kim - they may be objectively shit, but they’re against the west, so…
The naive idealism is just a means to manipulate otherwise well-meaning people into supporting their cause. I don’t like choosing the lesser evil either, but when full-blown fascism is on the ballot, along with even worse outcomes for Palestinians, it’s obvious what needs to be done.
Point to where I said I would support trump
Then who ya voting for there buddy? An intentional vote splitter? Captain Brainworm? Or the Russian plant Jill? 40k votes in 3 states was all that was between the death of democracy with trump term 2. Attempting to siphon off votes to 3rd party runs is at best hurting the country, at worst condemning it to collapse.
Then I suppose Democrats should have listened to leftists and not supported a candidate that had no chance of winning. But instead insisted that 'it was her turn' and that you did t need our vote to win
Splitting the vote implies that we would have supported your right-wing warmongering candidates If there were no other third party candidates on the ballot, we would not.
There's a better chance of you finding something in Donald Trump to support than a leftist supporting either one of your hand-picked corporate installed political candidates
Lmao I've never heard this saying before, love it
Bold of you to support the warmongering fascist instead.
At this point in the game, you either support Kamala, or you're a fascist. Sorry, but the stakes are very high and very obvious, and anyone voting against Kamala is asking for tyranny.
Get with the problem, or else.
What is your opinion of the idea that this position may make you indistinguishable from a Trump supporter?
I'm not that guy, but my two cents:
Both the fascists and the communists want to overturn the liberal system, it's about the only thing they actually genuinely agree on. Fortunately the actual full-on seize-the-means-of-production sorts are a vanishingly tiny percentage of the American population, and the two factions are otherwise completely antithetical to each other, with fascism being pure hierarchy and communism being no hierarchy. Liberalism in all its forms sits between these two extremes.
Lemmy, being international and non-corporate, is a small hub for the community though, with .ml (the more moderate ones) and .grad (the full-on tankies) being their homes.
I'm generally not worried about them. They know full well the fascists would literally try to eradicate them, that's a primary component of fascist philosophy going back to Hitler. They also won't be able to gain much of a foothold in the US until they can demonstrate a large-scale example of success somewhere, which is difficult when even China of all places has moved away from communist economic principles in recent decades. They will never stop hating liberals unfortunately, since we're clearly not communist and stand in their way. We at least permit them to exist though, when there's no McCarthyites running things anyway.
Lmfao paint brush nonsense, maybe you should take your two cents and invest it
WHAT COMMUNISTS??
Dude what the fuck are you even talking about?
Check out .grad and you'll see pretty quick.
Dude just say you're a fascist. You aren't fooling anybody here.
I'm not the one supporting blue or red fascists
Lmao you aren't fooling anyone.
By definition, fascism is a right wing movement. You can't be both blue and fascist.
https://education.cfr.org/learn/reading/what-fascism
A good modern definition is 1. belief in inequality 2. based on a mythological identity.
Unfortunately the marxist-leninists have their own definitions and basically speak a different language.
Fascism is a right wing ideology, as is the entire DNC.
The DNC is not "right wing" by any stretch of the imagination.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-wing_politics
The Overton window in America is a bit fucked
Compared to international politics the DNC is very right wing. The Overton Window wouldn't exist without the DNC pushing their party and the country to the right.
Obama acknowledged his policies would be viewed as moderate Republican in the 80s. Enabling right wing policies with their ratchet effect helps push the party further to the right.
He also acknowledged Richard Nixon was more liberal than he was.
We aren't talking about international politcs, we're talking about the DNC and when the right wing is carrying tiki torches and chanting "Jews will not replace us", NO, the DNC is NOT "right wing".
Removed, civility.
Republicans probably don't see themselves as fascist either
Do not attack other users, that includes bot accusations.
So if I see a bot, I should treat it like a real person, because calling out bots is an "attack"?
What else is an attack? Calling out trolls? Do we need to act like they're acting in good faith?
What about disagreement? Am I going to get in trouble for telling you that you're doing a bad job as a mod for running protection for bots and trolls?
If you see what you think is a bot, report it and let the mods handle it.
So if I see propaganda, and my peers are falling for it, you expect me to say nothing and delegate power to you, so you can sanitize your community. But my peers? They can stay fooled...
No. If I see something, I'm going to say something, because people should share with the community (not just its leaders) when they see something suspicious.
Propaganda only works if we don't call it out. Bots are run by people with agendas, and everyone here is target.
I seem to remember Trump making a little call recently, a couple of them in fact.
Nah, imma say it. The biiig spooky:
Fuck off.
Zzzzzzzz...