Wouldn’t this lead you to postulate that the housing crisis in America is real and out of control when the money you give them goes right into housing?
Is this how they intend to fleece America? Give people a guaranteed income paid for by their tax dollars, so it can go right into government subsidized housing, owned and run by a shadow company that the politicians and their buddies just happen to be on the board of?
Honestly if it means guaranteed housing(which it doesn't) then I'd be down with that. It's better than getting fleeced with no house.
Congratulations, you managed to make people having a place to live sound not just bad, but sinister.
"Kapitalet höjer hyrorna, och Staten bostadsbidragen."
The Swedes were calling out this game back in 1972.
Of course, our solution was to just stop subsidizing housing altogether and screw over poor people.
I had no idea there were so many people who were against a UBI on Lemmy. I'm honestly surprised.
There's a lot of effort to deny any previous UBI experiment as having even been done. Heck the top reply to your comment here denies this is even a UBI experiment. The line is usually the only way to do the experiment is to do it and that's the Socialisms so we can't ever know, sorry poors.
Well, since the "U" in UBI stands for "universal", and since the group of people who received this money were selected because they were very poor, then this is not a UBI experiment. This is just a welfare program.
I've been surprised and super disappointed by a lot of the views I've been seeing in Lemmy comments lately. Anti homeless, judging addiction, fairly socially conservative, buying into the whole retail theft narrative, and the worst has been the misogyny framed as "realism" or some shit.
I don't know, it's not for me.
It makes sense....I think the FOSS/anti-big tech world brings together a weird mix of far-left socialists and also libertarian types (hence the anti UBI sentiment)
IDK, I'm a leftist, and am skeptical about UBI because it's more of a free-market approach to solving a problems, rather than just directly solving problems. I.e. the government could just build more and better homeless housing, and expand section 8 to cover more of the cost and more people. I'm a bit afraid UBI would be used as an excuse to cut social programs, in a similar way that school vouchers are used to cut spending on education and leave families paying for what the vouchers don't cover.
This isn't UBI though. It's welfare. It just proves that people will use welfare support responsibly. A real test of UBI would be to give everyone in a community, not just a small pool of low income families the same amount (among other things). That ain't going to happen.
Fine, then people here are anti-welfare. Either way, it's a surprisingly conservative attitude.
It's been done at a town level before, with the same results
https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2020/2/19/21112570/universal-basic-income-ubi-map
And if everyone got this, rents would mysteriously increase by $1000 …
Fuck these landlords.
This trope is dumb and you should feel bad for repeating it. It shows a truly shocking lack of insight into even the most basic middle-school-level economic principles.
Rents are being driven up by illegal collaboration anyways. This just like the inflation argument against minimum wage increases. Prices going up is not an argument against giving people more money. Prices will go up anyways.
To all the people saying "hur dur it's just giving money to landlords":
No it's not. People who would not have had housing were able to have it. If you think that's a bad thing because some landlords got paid in the process, you seriously need to have your moral compass checked.
To those explicitly linking this to the idea (which is often cited but never backed up with evidence) that landlords (and mysteriously no other segment of the economy) will medically capture 110% of the value of any possible UBI program: This is not the evidence you've been lacking. The money wasn't given to everyone as it would be in a universal basic income program. It was given to people who were struggling. Of fucking course people who were homeless or near homeless spent the money on rent. The fact that people who become able to afford housing mostly choose to spend their money on housing just tells you how much people value having a place to live. It says nothing about how money would flow in a full scale system.
The sad thing is that high cost of housing is entirely unnecessary exploitation anyway. Just pass a law that transfers all house and land ownership into collective hands and erases all dept based on houses. I bet the vast majority of people would vote for it lol.
Yeah, surely nothing could go wrong with that plan.
Ever been to public housing? There's a reason it's usually shitty, and that's because the people who live there don't own it, so they have no reason to care for it because they could be moved somewhere else at any time.
The same is true of a lot of average apartment buildings, especially college housing, but they are rigourously maintained by staff.
Public housing in the US is rarely funded enough or maintained properly. It's almost a cliche in the US, municipalities purposely underfund public programs so they fail, to encourage privatization.
So the money went straight to the pocket of landlords. Cool.
You can’t give ordinary people money and not increase taxes on the rich. Otherwise it just becomes a wealth transfer from the state to rich people.
Well, at least some people who needed it got housing along the way.
I'd rather transfer it to them indirectly like this than directly like we've been doing...
The study didn’t give us the answer we wanted so we burned the results and cut social programs some more.
Didn't this basically happen like 10-15 years ago in Canada? I remember hearing about a similar study being shut down and the records sealed when the new conservative administration at the time came into power.
It's always "this small test just wouldn't work on a larger scale, so let's never try at all."
It's a GOOD thing this ended! If they enacted this NATIONWIDE my Rent might Increase! Because it OBVIOUSLY hasn't increased at ALL since I moved in thanks to not having a UBI!
State Sen. Paul Bettencourt sent a letter to the state's attorney general asking him to declare a new program in Houston as unconstitutional.
Of course they call it unconstitutional. It actually helps people and the constitution says nothing about helping people. /s
When people can afford houses, they stop being homeless.... Amazing
When will humans learn to attack the problem and not the victim of the problem?
Let’s find out if they can continue it without other states funding their existence.
*gestures to Rafael theodore Cruz at the airport
Texas didn't fund shit, Austin did. The government of Texas is actively hostile to the city of Austin.
Popular opinion is that if you give people free money they will use it on what enriches their lives.
Economists would probably just point out the fact that whenever you subsidize something the thing you're trying to make easier is suddenly even more expensive to the point where there's hardly a discount if one even exists.
Look at the cash for clunkers program. At the end of that car dealerships were raking in huge profits.
In this case if you give someone a thousand bucks a month, odds are landlords will pocket the majority of that, because housing is the biggest cost for everybody who is not already an owner. If everyone has 1000/mo more, they can suddenly afford 1000/more on housing. This may make minimal impact in areas with extremely high COL, but all the associated suburbs, rough parts of town, college areas... yeah those rents are gonna go way up.
example: 4BR apartment? Oh... I guess that's another +$3500/mo... after all all four of you are getting that money for free. New price: $7000/mo. It's only 1750/mo, or 750 per person per month because the government (our tax dollars) is paying that poor, poor landlord. How ever would they survive elsewise?
Look at the cash for clunkers program. At the end of that car dealerships were raking in huge profits.
That was an intended effect, as they were all facing enormous deficits in the wake of the '08 housing/car-note crash. Cash-for-Clunkers was supposed to be a back door bailout of dealerships in exchange for moving high emissions vehicles off the market.
In this case if you give someone a thousand bucks a month, odds are landlords will pocket the majority of that, because housing is the biggest cost for everybody who is not already an owner.
In theory, we live in a large and competitive housing market, such that people with excess cash can change landlords in pursuit of lower prices.
In practice, what we end up with is a handful of cartelized renters all setting a clearing price for the last vacant unit at slightly above what the median renter can pay. This traps people in existing leases, because they can't find a better deal anywhere else in the city.
This has nothing to do with the cash distribution program and everything to do with the functional monopoly on housing owned by a handful of mega-landlords.
Economists would probably just point out the fact that whenever you subsidize something the thing you're trying to make easier is suddenly even more expensive to the point where there's hardly a discount if one even exists.
That's a very convenient "fact" to point out if you want to eliminate all assistance for people who are struggling.
Now explain how corn subsidies had no effect on corn prices and definitely didn't result in everything being full of corn syrup.
Next explain how basic income is a subsidy.
"In completely unrelated news, average rent prices in the Austin area have soared by $1,100 dollars over the past year."
The good part about UBI is that this doesn't happen. There was a study from an African UBI program that showed no inflation at all in the village they provided funds to.
Maybe in a national version of UBI where you can't easily move somewhere cheaper this would be more of a risk, but that just makes it more profitable to build more houses, and increasing the supply brings the price down again.
There are two types of UBI supporters- Those that want UBI on top of the targeted welfare program, and those that want UBI to replace targeted welfare programs. If UBI was ever implemented, which kind of UBI supporter do you think the republicans and moderate dems would be?
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