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submitted 1 month ago by trainsrkool@lemmy.ml to c/memes@lemmy.ml
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Obviously China is going to look bad if you consider western liberal democracy and free market capitalism to be objectively good things and have them as the standards by which you judge the political-economic systems of global south countries.

If you're judging China based on how similar it is to Western European countries then you're not going to like it.

[-] minty@aussie.zone 15 points 1 month ago

When you believe truth is only dependent on who says it (west=lies, not west=truth) you start believing nonsense like china has not flaws, or events with verifiable footage (1989 TS) are exaggerations/a western lies.

[-] minty@aussie.zone 7 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Would technically also, and indeed commonly go the other direction, but please .ml, stop navigating the world based soley on whether the west supports/is against something

[-] davel@lemmy.ml 23 points 1 month ago

please .ml, stop navigating the world based soley on whether the west supports/is against something

Yeah that’s not what we’re doing; it’s what you imagine we’re doing.

[-] minty@aussie.zone 6 points 1 month ago

Name one major western critic of china you agree with.

I'll name a critic of the US: the cuba embargo for the past 70 has been a major disaster, and any deaths from economic collapse isnt due to cuba's socialism, it is instead because of the US.

Do that, I'll be far more willing to believe you.

[-] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 19 points 1 month ago

China's support of the Khmer Rouge was shameful.

Name one major western criticism of China you don't agree with.

[-] minty@aussie.zone 10 points 1 month ago

I think they aren't the aggressor in the China/USA relationship. The US is in their "backyard" and has clearly surrounded them, and China is naturally nervous about it

[-] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 12 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

(This is more of a train of thought, and is not intended to roast or provoke a response)

When you consider who the aggressor is, and then consider that the aggressor has spent a century building the most enormous and sophisticated propaganda machine in human history, you can begin to see why, for someone born into that machine like you or me, who get virtually no real information about these Designated Enemy countries, someone supporting them might just look like someone supporting "the bad guys" for no understandable reason. Of course our media isn't going to show us any reason why anyone would support China, because they want us to support the Epstein Empire instead.

So for those of us who grew up in that bubble, supporting The Enemy is just made to look like some kind of insanity, like "oh these poor people just snapped out of hatred for capitalism, and now they support something even worse." Of course, in reality there is nothing worse than what our countries (i am assuming you're western here) are doing and have done. The standard liberal outlook on other countries is that we have good or at least understandable reasons to do the horrible things we do, but our exes, all those countries we've exploited and invaded? Don't talk to them, they're crazy. Don't even listen to anyone who likes them, they're crazy and liars and paid and we may be bad but everyone else is worse, trust me.

[-] davel@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 month ago

oh these poor people just snapped out of hatred for capitalism

This is like the silly rationalization some religious people have for atheists, that we’re just angry at god.

[-] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 5 points 1 month ago

That's all well and good, but it raises the question: if you think the US is the aggressor, why do you believe their accusations against China?

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[-] deathmetaldawgy@lemmy.ml 11 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

I met a white American guy that lives in China over the weekend, he was awesome. No real story about it, yes he said he can speak mandarin and he had the friggin cutest little half Chinese baby with his wife. Shoutout Paul

[-] caboose2006@lemmy.world 11 points 1 month ago

I lived in china for 4 years, got out of the expat bubble, lived in smaller cities and I gotta say, for people that have never been to china or actually been friends with Chinese people, y'all are pretty allergic to any criticism, no matter how legitimate, of china. Maybe take a step back from YOUR OWN biases and be a little objective. There are great things about china. There are bad things about china. No country's perfect

[-] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 19 points 1 month ago

Quite the impressive straw man you've built here. At risk of falling into a no true Scotsman, I have never seen anyone on here even approach implying China is perfect simply that criticism should be situated within the proper context of material reality and pushing back on the unfortunate tidlewave of nonsense many people seem to believe is true and valid criticism.

[-] caboose2006@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

You haven't been the discourses I have. All my previous comment is based on firsthand experience right here on lemmy.

[-] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 12 points 1 month ago

If you say so just doesn't seem accurate to my experience.

[-] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 9 points 1 month ago

Bullshit, bring receipts

[-] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 8 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

So's mine, and my experi3nce says you're lying about your experience

[-] caboose2006@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago

Imagine someone having a different experience than you. The shock and horror.

[-] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 8 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Might it have anything to do with your demeanor, disposition, actions and words?

[-] caboose2006@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Idk, I've been much more civil than you. Probably has to do with the fact my views on china aren't as rosy as the sinophiles here on lemmy. Usually goes something like this "Idk man, there's a lot of merit to the claim that there's aggressive censorship in China. I experienced it firsthand." And the response will be something like "You're a brainwashed western chauvinist."

But I also get it from the other side. Like when it comes to healthcare in China. People call me a liar when I tell them it was fast, cheap, and good.

So I guess I'm a liar to both sides of the china brain rot.

[-] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 6 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Idk, I’ve been much more civil than you.

Haha, no.

Probably has to do with the fact my views on china aren’t as rosy as the sinophiles here on lemmy.

The classic western liberal thing of pretending that any other westerner who sides with the empire's enemies must simply be doing it out of some kind of contrarian fetishism or pseudoreligious mania. Whatever the reason you decide, it can't possibly be that the communist is in his right mind, because that's a terrifying prospect you have no answer for.

[-] caboose2006@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago

Hahaha, yes I have. You came right out of the gate and called me a liar with zero evidence. That is uncivil. And here you are proving my point. Have the day you deserve

[-] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

You too man

[-] folaht@lemmy.ml 7 points 1 month ago

That comment makes me question your other experiences.

[-] yogthos@lemmy.ml 15 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Literally nobody here says that China is perfect or that there aren't bad things about China. The reality is that no human society is perfect, but ones not run by pedo kleptocrats are objectively better than ones that are.

[-] Duke_Nukem_1990@feddit.org 1 points 1 month ago
[-] yogthos@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 month ago

There is inequality, there is still capitalism being allowed as a compromise to global trade. Education system in China is pretty harsh and doesn't give kids a lot of time to play and be kids. Work, especially in tech, is very competitive with long hours. There is no lack of contradictions in China today.

[-] StinkySocialist@lemmy.ml 8 points 1 month ago
[-] Hirom@beehaw.org 8 points 1 month ago

The US has set the bar pretty low. It would take tremendous effort to look worse than USA under Trump extremist leadership.

[-] sangeteria@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 month ago

Finally, a half-decent meme about something I agree with. Thank you for making a not dogshit meme like half of the communists on this forum lmao

this post was submitted on 15 Jul 2026
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