Yes, shooting civilians has that effect. I read something similar in the 3rd Reich general memoirs.
Israeli army is significantly made of conscripts. Men need to serve at least 3 years compulsory military service, women 2 years.
And I am sure not all of them support the government. I would go as far as the one with PTSD and committing suicide are the ones that less support the talking points of the government
That excuse is one step removed from "just following orders"
Cool, what would you do? Desert? (And go where?) Commit suicide?
It is possible to refuse to be conscripted, and be sent to jail for 30 days. Mostly people go to another country.
Most of them are dual citizens anyway, easiest out for any military.
I sure as shit wouldn't be shooting children in the streets. Anywhere I guess, but also the streets. I'd rather take a bullet to the head denying an order instead of murdering an innocent.
Option 1: Rape and kill (in)discriminately for 3 years Option 2: Use your passport and leave Option 3: Object and face jail time (inversely proportional to how well your parents are connected to police, lawyers, or politicians)
Gee, all three options sound equally bad so it’s a very tough choice
They have the option of refusing service and serving a few months in jail instead of shooting toddlers in the head. Conscription is not an excuse.
If you're downvoting the idea of refusing to shoot children for 30 days in jail, you might just be a Nazi.
They were just following orders?
Men need to serve at least 3 years compulsory military service, women 2 years.
Are you saying there are no innocents in Israel?
There's children, there's folks who refuse service. So I would venture to say that there are some people in Israel who are innocent. Of course, anyone who served in the military is not on that list.
Conscientious objectors are a thing. There are consequences to objecting, of course. Maybe it makes you a pariah in the settler colonial apartheid ethnostate of Israel, but just fucking move, you're not supposed to be there anyway. Maybe you cannot move out of Israel, and you'll be flipping burgers for the rest of your life or whatever. But you know what? Murdering a child to save your own career still makes you the bad guy. Helping others murder children to save your own career still makes you the bad guy.
But even beyond that, it's not like these folks are going to gaza with a gun pointed to their head. Most of the population supports the government's genocide of Palestinians, as polls show. There are very few innocents in Israel.
Almost like committing war crimes feels unethical. Obviously seen in Iraq, Viet Nam etc. I think it’s ok to feel bad for everyone
"Shooting and crying" (Hebrew: יורים ובוכים, romanized: yorim ve bochim) is an expression used to describe books, films or other forms of media that portray soldiers expressing remorse for actions they undertook during their service. It has often been associated with a practice that some former Israel Defense Force soldiers follow.
Gil Hochberg described "shooting and crying" as a soldier being "sorry for things I had to do." This "non-apologetic apology" was the self-critique model advanced in Israel in many politically reflective works of literature and cinema as "a way of maintaining the nation's self-image as youthful and innocent. Along with its sense of vocation against the reality of war, growing military violence, occupation, invasion, [there was] [...] an overall sense that things were going wrong."
Poor genociders
(Article from Oct. 2024)
I remember this article was suspiciously titled similar to another one from a different outlet about a Gazan teenager who suffered loss of limbs and family, while sheltering outside a a school in a makeshift refuge camp.
Almost as if CNN saw it and wanted to do a reverse take.
I guess that, sometimes, the trash takes itself out...
Well, no because this means all the people with some form of independent thought and morals will be gone and only psychopaths and sociopaths will be left, who are the actual trash.
Good. Let’s hope they all do it.
Seems like suicide is the only proof that Zionists have any humanity.
It is not a war, it is a genocide. The IDF target and shoot kids in the head. Knowing that your side does this would mess up most people.
According to Israel, they have, ahem... 'the most moral military in the world'. And according to this psychiatrist these suicides are attributed to 'moral injury' due to 'accidentally' killing women and children.
With the amount of women and children murdered by the Israeli army, surely the entire army should have killed themselves through 'moral injury'?
Perhaps the truth is simpler, Israel is a genocidal apartheid ethnocolony that forces its citizens to be complicit in its bloodshed through conscription and these are the few soldiers with any shred of morals left.
Being a Nazi come with mental baggage?
I know you're making a joke, but the Nazis actually ran into the exact same issue.
The Einsatzgruppen (death squads) had the problem that executing so many people was 'demoralizing' to the troops. They started to suffer from mental health problems. It's not surprising, is it? Even with all the propaganda, even believing they were only murdering 'lebensunwertiges Leben' (life unworthy of life), killing so many scared, crying people, including children, takes a toll. Oh and it also costs a lot of bullets.
Because of this the Nazis started using gas vans to kill people. But even that was a problem, because the soldiers were getting traumatized when they had to empty all the bodies out of the vans. So they started using prisoners to do that work..
But well, it was all very inefficient and slow and expensive. And that's how we eventually ended up with fully industrialized death camps with gas chambers and crematoria (of course with prisoners doing all the dirty work because why the hell not).
People are human and naturally sociable. They created monsters out of their soldiers. Dissonance gonna cause something to snap sooner or later.
What do you think? Every country has this problem if and when a war 'persists'.
Russian Soldiers Confront PTSD, Alcoholism and Suicidal Thoughts After Fighting in Ukraine
The battle Russia has not yet fought: The mental health of its war veterans
And, not to forget, there are also victims:
Ukraine: Mental Health Crisis Intensifies for Children
There are -unfortunately- many reports on that across literally all wars.
One key thing that our research into PTSD has found is that soldiers are far less likely to experience it when they understand what it is they're doing and why they're doing it. This means both at the large scale operational level, and the small scale tactical level.
"You're holding this trench so that our sister company can safely withdraw" is a lot more motivating than "You're holding this trench because orders are orders."
And yeah, at the operational level, the people fighting a war want to believe that it has a purpose. That they're doing good. That their suffering will make other people's lives better.
Hard to believe that when you're mostly just murdering innocent civilians.
More of this please.
I'd rather have the war stop though.
*genocide
It can be both.
Good.
I believe the article is true. However, I would like to know what the rates are among Palestinians.
I expect there's a bigger rate increase and numerically far more broken people among them. And most likely, they aren't getting assistance.
So sad that these Israeli soldiers simply did not kill enough Palestinian children to sleep soundly tonight
OP's post history contains exclusively pro -China and anti-Western propaganda narratives, but this here has a special spin. Not that condemning Israel's atrocities is wrong, but while posting this here OP's communities literally celebrating Russia's atrocities against Ukrainian civilians or China's genocide against people in Tibet, East Turkistan (Xinjiang), and Inner Mongolia.
As one study says:
... The presence of left-wing extremism on the Lemmygrad. ml instance of the decentralized social media platform Lemmy, from its launch in 2019 up to a month after the bans of the subreddits r/GenZedong and r/GenZhou ... reveal a substantial increase in user activity and toxicity levels following the migration of these subreddits to Lemmygrad. ml. ...
[Users] frequently share posts that support authoritarian regimes, as seen in their support for China, North Korea, and Russia. Moreover, their support can extend beyond backing these authoritarian regimes, even cheering on their violent actions, as evidenced by their posts on the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Additionally, we observe anti-Zionist and antisemitic behaviors, which show similarities to right-wing extremism ... Our analysis suggests a concerning endorsement of authoritarian actions and extremist rhetoric on Lemmygrad. ml, further indicating that left-wing extremist communities on decentralized platforms should receive more attention from the academic community.
It's a deeply repugnant mindset.
Every time someone calls out Israel we get people discounting it because they are not perfect, and project motives.
Every time. Suspicious no? All the shit to discount, corporations funding fake science to poison to save a buck, you cancel an israel critic for an alleged lack of purity.
Every time someone calls out Israel we get people discounting it because they are not perfect, and project motives.
That doesn't happen 'every time' nor is it about discounting Israel's war crimes or what you call a 'lack of purity.' Just read OP's post history. It's a devastating testimony for a lack of any ethics.
I know we should be friendly and polite here, but celebrating violence against innocent people because they perceive them as 'enemies' is - at best - brainwashed, and it is mentally derailed at worst. Just read the linked study or go to the comms and read the posts there yourself.
Israel is the most ratfucked online discussion. Legions of mechanized troll divisions scramble to any mention. Chatbots too, the newer generation ones, paid for with tax dollars. This is one of their go to moves, criticizing anyone posting anything, any media reporting anything. Al jazeera they are in a country mean to woman, and so forth. Coming from the worst people in the world.
Not only do they ratfuck the discussion, they use the corrupt influence of the US government to get people cancelled on social media. Cancelled in a way people are not told why, a different issue, not even a violation, flags the person. Whether it's mass flagging social media pretends not to see, or agencies and their contractors giving lists of accounts to violate.
Any time you find yourself on the same side as those people, you should re examine what you are doing, to prevent being tooled. There are a thousand issues you could call out right now, like Iran War 2 they are hyping.
The next wave of weird conspiracies just to distract from the topic.
As an addition: You don't need to believe me or the linked study. Just go to these communities and read their posts and comments yourself.
This is an ad hominem attack. I can abhor both the IDF and the CCP simultaneously, and this post is pro-neither. If OP posts something "repugnant", then call them out in that comment section.
Read their entire post history. The spin is absolutely clear.
TLDR: A well funded and developed brainwashing machine vs the mind of an 18 year old will end in tragedy. The Israeli government is doing generational damage to its own people and this is just the beginning. There is no excuse for the genocide but there are reasons.
I had to serve 3 years in the IDF 2013-16. I spent a year trying to get out of it using medical issues but then the police showed up to our door. I spent 3 years fixing armored combat vehicles at an engine shop.
When you grow up in Israel you are surrounded by pro military and anti Palestinian/Arab propaganda. At 16 they call you in for a physical and that's where the brainwashing really kicks in. The next two years of high school you're thinking of finals and graduation, prom but also what unit you and your classmates could end up in. My school had a program where you spend time on a military base to "try it out". They draft you at 18 years old, you've just graduated and you've received a letter from the government telling you what unit you're in and when to report. You may hate the Israeli government you may think Palestinian should have rights but the social pressures of serving have been hammered into you for years. Now you're on a bus taken to a remote military base where they put you through all the brainwashing and cult building tech they've perfected over the decades. You're just a kid out of highschool already conditioned to follow authority and now they're yelling at you to run, shoot and protect your new best friend you made in the army. They tell you that every Palestinian at the check point is a threat and show videos of Palestinian resistance to make sure you're scared. You hear about a soldier who fell asleep on a bus and got stabbed in the neck by a Palestinian fighter. You hear about a police officer shot at a checkpoint.
These kids are committing war crimes while deep in a cult that tells them it was right. When they leave and see reality it will cause PTSD and suicide for those that can't live with what they've done. The feeling when reality conflicts with your brainwashing hits hard.
Imagine looking back at your teenage years when you were an idiot by instead of cringe you recall shooting innocents that a system convinced you were out to kill you.
When I first drafted I was not aware of the Palestinian struggle but over my 3 years, even though I wasn't in combat I started to realize who the bad guys were. I tried to transfer to the humanitarian arm of the IDF that allegedly does outreach to Palestinians but was denied due to my low physical score. If I had protested and dodged my draft it would have ruined my life, I did not live in a progressive town or household. To this day I don't know any other pro Palestinian liberation people from my old social circles.
. The Israeli government is doing generational damage to its own people and this is just the beginning.
It is therefore necessary the Netanyahu dictatorship be toppled.
So many if not most of tbese suicides are the state, connected groups, killing them. They are fascist, it comes with the territory.
Not all that knew either, they have long disguised state sanctioned murder as car accidents.
Fuck these monsters; they deserved to be locked up for their crimes, who care about their nazi consciences?
breaking news: fork found in kitchen
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