645
submitted 1 year ago by JRepin@lemmy.ml to c/technology@lemmy.world

cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/5431344

The enshittification of the internet follows a predictable trajectory: first, platforms are good to their users; then they abuse their users to make things better for their business customers; finally, they abuse those business customers to claw back all the value for themselves. Then, they die. It doesn't have to be this way. Enshittification occurs when companies gobble each other up in an orgy of mergers and acquisitions, reducing the internet to "five giant websites filled with screenshots of text from the other four" (credit to Tom Eastman!), which lets them endlessly tweak their back-ends to continue to shift value from users and business-customers to themselves. The government gets in on the act by banning tweaking by users - reverse-engineering, scraping, bots and other user-side self-help measures - leaving users helpless before the march of enshittification. We don't have to accept this! Disenshittifying the internet will require antitrust, limits on corporate tweaking - through privacy laws and other protections - and aggressive self-help measures from alternative app stores to ad blockers and beyond!

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[-] rickdg@lemmy.world 67 points 1 year ago

The internet will always have many niche places, but overall it can’t escape late stage capitalism.

[-] GentlemanLoser@ttrpg.network 38 points 1 year ago

We should get paid a portion of the revenue generated by our collective data along with the ability to opt-out completely. If they our data is a commodity to them we should be able to sell it.

[-] nxdefiant@startrek.website 35 points 1 year ago

they can keep my 42 cents and just stop their shit

[-] pensa@kbin.social 15 points 1 year ago

I bet they sold your info to cambridge analytica for a bit more than that.

[-] shasta@lemm.ee 30 points 1 year ago

If you wanna fix this, there needs to be more incentive for people to develop open source software. It doesn't have to be created by individuals either. Organizations and nonprofits can be used to make basic services for the Internet, like utilities. Or this could be a government agency. There is already talks of classifying Internet access as a utility instead of leaving it to private ISPs. This would be a step beyond that but could be done first.

[-] PipedLinkBot@feddit.rocks 30 points 1 year ago

Here is an alternative Piped link(s):

https://piped.video/watch?v=rimtaSgGz_4

Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.

I'm open-source, check me out at GitHub.

[-] centof@lemm.ee 28 points 1 year ago

Anybody got a TLDW;? Or did all of you just comment on the title and the snippet?

[-] centof@lemm.ee 41 points 1 year ago

Reposting from PeepinGoodArgs@reddthat.com in Technology@beehaw.org

Here’s an AI outline because this was actually a good talk:

How Platforms Die
    The speaker introduces the concept of platform decay or “enshittification” and how it leads to the death of internet platforms.
        He defines platforms as firms like Uber, Amazon, and Facebook that connect users and business customers.
    He outlines a 3-stage process called enshittification where platforms:
        Are initially good to users
        Abuse users to benefit business customers
        Eventually abuse business customers to only benefit shareholders
    This results in the platform becoming a “pile of shit” that dies.

Facebook Case Study
    He uses Facebook as a case study of enshittification’s 3 stages:
        Initially attracted users by promising privacy protections and custom feeds
        Then broke promises and sold user data to advertisers and flooded feeds with publisher content
        Finally, reduced value to users and fees for publishers to extract all value for shareholders
            This led to an angry user base and brittle equilibrium

Causes of Enshittification
    Lack of Competition
        Weak antitrust enforcement has allowed consolidation across industries
        Companies can use predatory pricing to undercut competitors
        Mergers eliminate competition
            Example: Google relying on acquisitions rather than in-house innovation
    Unrestricted “Backend Tweaking”
        Tech platforms control the algorithms and systems behind their products
        They can arbitrarily change these to alter user experiences
            e.g. Facebook reducing visibility of publisher content in feeds
        Done without transparency, oversight or accountability
    Bans on Reverse Engineering
        Laws like DMCA 1201 and CFAA criminalize circumventing DRM and terms of service
        Makes it illegal to reverse engineer platforms to enable interoperability
        Tech companies use IP laws to prevent modding and adversarial interoperability
            e.g. Apple using IP laws to prevent iOS modding

Solutions
    Strengthen Antitrust Enforcement
        Block anti-competitive mergers
        Break up existing tech giants
    Pass Privacy, Labor and Consumer Protection Laws
        Comprehensive federal privacy laws with private right of action
        End worker misclassification through gig economy
        Apply consumer protection standards to platforms
    Allow Adversarial Interoperability
        Roll back laws criminalizing modding, reverse engineering
        Use government procurement to incentivize open ecosystems
        Appoint special masters to oversee platform legal threats
    Keep Interoperators in Check
        Bind interoperators to the same privacy, fair trading and labor laws
        Determined through democratic process vs corporate policy

Conclusion
    We need to prepare and spread these policy ideas to capitalize on the next crisis
    Efforts are underway to enable a better internet through this approach
[-] madcaesar@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago

The steps to fix this might as well say have Jesus come to life and fix it all... It's depressing, but there is zero chance of any of that happening... Nevermind all of it.

Our best bet is for consumers to fight back with their wallets, but people are on average too stupid to even understand how they are being fleeced. We're fucked.

[-] Pretzilla@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Thanks. Here's a slightly easier to read on mobile non-monospace paste:

How Platforms Die The speaker introduces the concept of platform decay or “enshittification” and how it leads to the death of internet platforms. He defines platforms as firms like Uber, Amazon, and Facebook that connect users and business customers. He outlines a 3-stage process called enshittification where platforms: Are initially good to users Abuse users to benefit business customers Eventually abuse business customers to only benefit shareholders This results in the platform becoming a “pile of shit” that dies.

Facebook Case Study
    He uses Facebook as a case study of enshittification’s 3 stages:
        Initially attracted users by promising privacy protections and custom feeds
        Then broke promises and sold user data to advertisers and flooded feeds with publisher content
        Finally, reduced value to users and fees for publishers to extract all value for shareholders
            This led to an angry user base and brittle equilibrium

Causes of Enshittification
    Lack of Competition
        Weak antitrust enforcement has allowed consolidation across industries
        Companies can use predatory pricing to undercut competitors
        Mergers eliminate competition
            Example: Google relying on acquisitions rather than in-house innovation
    Unrestricted “Backend Tweaking”
        Tech platforms control the algorithms and systems behind their products
        They can arbitrarily change these to alter user experiences
            e.g. Facebook reducing visibility of publisher content in feeds
        Done without transparency, oversight or accountability
    Bans on Reverse Engineering
        Laws like DMCA 1201 and CFAA criminalize circumventing DRM and terms of service
        Makes it illegal to reverse engineer platforms to enable interoperability
        Tech companies use IP laws to prevent modding and adversarial interoperability
            e.g. Apple using IP laws to prevent iOS modding

Solutions
    Strengthen Antitrust Enforcement
        Block anti-competitive mergers
        Break up existing tech giants
    Pass Privacy, Labor and Consumer Protection Laws
        Comprehensive federal privacy laws with private right of action
        End worker misclassification through gig economy
        Apply consumer protection standards to platforms
    Allow Adversarial Interoperability
        Roll back laws criminalizing modding, reverse engineering
        Use government procurement to incentivize open ecosystems
        Appoint special masters to oversee platform legal threats
    Keep Interoperators in Check
        Bind interoperators to the same privacy, fair trading and labor laws
        Determined through democratic process vs corporate policy

Conclusion
    We need to prepare and spread these policy ideas to capitalize on the next crisis
    Efforts are underway to enable a better internet through this approach
[-] smileyhead@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 1 year ago

Just listen to the video itself?

[-] elephantium@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

It's a 45-minute video. That's a big investment just to engage with a Lemmy post.

[-] ashtefere@lemmy.world 25 points 1 year ago

We need more than this.

We need a way to make sure that the internet can't be owned, physically.

We need some kind of easy to use and fast and robust open source alternate internet that we can all use.

Something that somehow costs nothing to run, that has enough storage and bandwidth for everyone and everything.

Something that has interoperability built in. Every platform should confirm to openid or openauth or activitypub or something like that.

And you know what? we have the technology!

We all have spare devices lying around. Old PC's, old laptops, old phones - they could all be running some kind of node in a distributed platform of some kind of open source AWS equivalent, and let anyone host anything and post anything without getting ad-raped or data stolen.

It's a pipe dream of mine, and I'm sure others... but with a will and a movement we could just take it all back, all at once.

[-] Rouxibeau@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

and let anyone host anything

That's how they'll spin the legislation to ban it:

Pedophiles and terrorists use that service!

Side note -- I wanted to use 'X' instead as a variable above, but Musk ruined that.

[-] vacuumflower@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 1 year ago

Search for Locutus, it's very similar to what I've been imagining, only real (well, not yet, it's a project).

[-] kandoh@reddthat.com 4 points 1 year ago

Wolf 359 was an inside job

[-] vacuumflower@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 1 year ago

Is that a Star Trek reference?

[-] uskok@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

It is, Locutus was a commander in the battle at Wolf 359.

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Battle_of_Wolf_359

[-] KonalaKoala@lemmy.world 2 points 4 months ago

The result you may get then is "I am... Locutus of Enshittification. Resistane... is futile. You life, as it has been... is over. From this time forward... you will service... us" which may make you go "Lock on and file all weapons on full!'

[-] friend_of_satan@lemmy.world 22 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

That was such a great video. I highly recommend everybody listen to it (there is no visual presentation so listening is enough). Great content, great delivery.

[-] los_chill@programming.dev 16 points 1 year ago

While I don't know how well it will work, nor if the implementation is even fully possible, I like the idea of Yep.

[-] patchwork@lemmy.dbzer0.com 13 points 1 year ago

I tried to find the video on PeerTube, from the end users perspective I think we should encourage others to choose community over corporate and use platforms like PeerTube to post these videos instead of YouTube (Alphabet).

[-] Armen12@lemm.ee 10 points 1 year ago

I get the idea, but I also don't want to go back to the days when BestGore and LiveLeak were around either, you know

[-] piyuv@lemmy.world 67 points 1 year ago

Illegal content will still be illegal, no one is promoting criminal activities in this talk. Privacy and safety do not have to be mutually exclusive.

[-] hedgehogging_the_bed@lemmy.world 45 points 1 year ago

Hahahaha. "Go back to"?

Just because you don't know what they are called today doesn't mean those sites stopped existing. Shock and gore sites have been part of the Internet for a long time because they fill a human desire, same as porn and gambling and anything that makes your brain think you're being naughty enough to hand out that sweet dopamine reward.

[-] spacecowboy@sh.itjust.works 10 points 1 year ago

Slightly before the internet we had The Coliseum for our gore fetish.

[-] Armen12@lemm.ee 3 points 1 year ago

Watching people die fills a desire to who?

I can't possibly imagine the kind of person that would think watching people die is somehow on par with whacking off, and gambling? I mean did you really just compare whacking it and playing slots in Vegas to watching someone get killed?

[-] spacecowboy@sh.itjust.works 12 points 1 year ago

You should do some reading on humans and violence as entertainment. It’s been a part of civilization since the beginning, homie.

[-] hedgehogging_the_bed@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago

Teenagers, adrenaline junkies, other thrill seekers of all sorts. People jumping out of airplanes is a popular hobby worldwide and so is controlled falling down snow-covered mountains. People get happy doing weird stuff, what can I tell you?

Bread and circus has worked since Caesar. Ever heard of the Coliseum?

[-] Socsa@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 year ago

That's fine, you don't have to understand everything everyone else does.

Sick fucks that's who, and free speech absolutistes in here defending snuff like wtf. I want federation, but I still believe in moderation

[-] uwe@lemmy.world 41 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

What are you talking about? The internet is full of people being mangled in Ukraine or shot in police footage . If anything there is more death online now than before.

[-] Zorque@kbin.social 11 points 1 year ago

Yes, but right now their experience is carefully tailored by Facebook, Google, or reddit so they don't have to experience them.

Exactly. By making the internet more welcoming to advertisers, in a way we also made it more easy going. I would rather not go back to the days where just scrolling opened you up to seeing gore, goatse, or worse.

Like it's valid to want good moderation. I think that's all the other person was saying

[-] bioemerl@kbin.social 11 points 1 year ago

Why? If people want to see stuff, they should be able to see stuff. Who cares if some guy wants to see some random gory video?

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[-] Gsus4@programming.dev 1 points 3 months ago

What was censored at 9:50? What is he saying about pivoting? Was it a joke?

this post was submitted on 24 Sep 2023
645 points (100.0% liked)

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