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Avoiding AI is hard – but our freedom to opt out must be protected (theconversation.com)
submitted 2 months ago by Pro@programming.dev to c/technology@lemmy.world
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[-] spankmonkey@lemmy.world 118 points 2 months ago

I disagree with the base premise that being opt out needs to be a right. That implies that having data be harvested for companies to make profits should be the default.

We should have the right to not have our data harvested by default. Requiring companies to have an opt in process with no coercion or other methods of making people feel obligated to opt in is our right.

[-] ItsComplicated@sh.itjust.works 44 points 2 months ago

being opt out needs to be a right. That implies that having data be harvested for companies to make profits should be the default.

As the years have passed, it has become the acceptable consensus for all of your personal information, thoughts, and opinions, to become freely available to anyone, at anytime, for any reason in order for companies to profit from it.

People keep believing this is normal and companies keep taking more. Unless everyone is willing to stand firm and say enough, I only see it declining further, unfortunately.

[-] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 4 points 2 months ago

I'm there with you, and I'd join in a protest to get it.

[-] Zenith@lemm.ee 3 points 2 months ago

The death of the private life

[-] Maeve@kbin.earth 4 points 2 months ago

Actually and time for data sales to be illegal. Not even opt-in.

[-] taladar@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 months ago

We should have the right to not have our data harvested by default.

I would maybe not go quite that far but at the very least this should apply to commercial interests and living people.

I think there are some causes where it should be acceptable to have your data usable by default, e.g. statistical analysis of health threats (think those studies about the danger of living near a coal power plant or similar things).

[-] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 4 points 2 months ago

I disagree. Yes, there are benefits to a lot of invasions of privacy, but that doesn't make it okay. If an entity wants my information, they can ask me for it.

One potential exception is for dead people, I think it makes sense for a of information to be released on death and preventing that should be opt in by the estate/survivors, depending on the will.

[-] taladar@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago

But they literally can't ask you for it if it is about high volumes of data that only become useful if you have all or close to all of it like statistical analysis of rare events. It would be prohibitively expensive if you had to ask hundreds of thousands of people just to figure out that there is an increase in e.g. cancer or some lung disease near coal power plants.

[-] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 months ago

They don't need most of the date, they need a statistically significant sample to have a high confidence in the result. And that's a small percentage of the total population.

And you could have something on file where you opt in to such things, just like you can opt in to being an organ donor. Maybe make it opt out if numbers are important. But it cannot be publicly available without a way to say no.

[-] spankmonkey@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

That implies that having data be harvested for companies to make profits should be the default.

I sure hope those studies are not being done by for profit companies!

[-] General_Effort@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

We should have the right to not have our data harvested by default.

How would that benefit the average person?

[-] spankmonkey@lemmy.world 8 points 2 months ago

Send me your name, birthdate, web browsing history, online spending history, real time location, and a list of people you know and I will explain it to you.

[-] FourWaveforms@lemm.ee 1 points 2 months ago

By giving us the choice of whether someone else should profit by our data.

Same as I don't want someone looking over my shoulder and copying off my test answers.

[-] General_Effort@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

By giving us the choice of whether someone else should profit by our data.

What benefit do you expect from that?

Same as I don’t want someone looking over my shoulder and copying off my test answers.

Why not?

[-] FourWaveforms@lemm.ee 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

I prefer that the benefits of those things accrue to me, or to others, or to no one, in accordance with my choice.

In this way, I would decide who gains the economic or social benefits of these activities of mine; and I also, in the case of personal data, would decide who gets to make my business, their business.

[-] General_Effort@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

Thanks for the answer.

[-] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 months ago

Exactly. The focus should be on data privacy, not on what technologies a service chooses to use.

[-] underline960@sh.itjust.works 24 points 2 months ago

I doubt we'll ever be offered a real opt-out option.

Instead I'm encouraged by the development of poison pills for the AI that are non-consensually harvesting human art (Glaze and Nightshade) and music (HarmonyCloak).

[-] T156@lemmy.world 9 points 2 months ago

Remind me in 3 days.

Although poison pills are only so effective since it's a cat and mouse game, and they only really work for a specific version of a model, with other models working around it.

[-] Loduz_247@lemmy.world 8 points 2 months ago

But do Glaze, Nightshade, and HarmonyCloak really work to prevent that information from being used? Because at first, it may be effective. But then they'll find ways around those barriers, and that software will have to be updated, but only the one with the most money will win.

[-] underline960@sh.itjust.works 10 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

AI is a venture capital money pit, and they are struggling to monetize before the hype dies out.

If the poison pills work as intended, investors will stop investing "creative" AI when the new models stop getting better (and sometimes get worse) because they're running out of clean content to steal.

[-] Loduz_247@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

AI has been around for many years, dating back to the 1960s. It's had its AI winters and AI summers, but now it seems we're in an AI spring.

But the amount of poisoned data is minuscule compared to the data that isn't poisoned. As for data, what data are we referring to: everything in general or just data that a human can understand?

[-] Zenith@lemm.ee 5 points 2 months ago

I’ve deleted pretty much all social media, I’m down to only Lemmy. I only use my home PC for gaming, like CiV or cities skylines or search engines for things like travel plans. I’m trying to be as offline as possible because I don’t believe there’s any other way to opt out and I don’t believe there ever will be. Like opting out of the internet is practically impossible, AI will get to this point as well

[-] oxysis 14 points 2 months ago

Is it really though? I haven’t touched it since the very early days of slop ai. That was before I learned of how awful it is to real people

[-] DarthObi@feddit.org 12 points 2 months ago

You don't need AI. There are enough porn sites with real humans.

[-] ICastFist@programming.dev 2 points 2 months ago

And lots of hentai for stuff that is humanly impossible

[-] Maeve@kbin.earth 9 points 2 months ago

It should be opt in

[-] KeenFlame@feddit.nu 7 points 2 months ago

Ah yes. The "freedom" the usa has spread all over its country and other nations.. Yes of course we must protect that freedom that is ofc a freedom for people to avoid getting owned by giant corporations. We must protect the freedom of giant corporations to not give us ai if they want to. I don't disagree but think people are more important

[-] Shayeta@feddit.org 6 points 2 months ago

Nope, screw opt-out. OPT-IN ONLY, i want it to be disabled by default.

[-] fxdave@lemmy.ml 5 points 2 months ago

The problem is not the tool. It's the inability to use the tool without a third party provider.

[-] Irelephant@lemm.ee 5 points 2 months ago

You can opt-out by deleting your accounts on corporate social networks.

[-] Don_alForno@feddit.org 5 points 2 months ago

Haha, no you can't.

[-] RvTV95XBeo@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 months ago

If AI is going to be crammed down our throats can we at least be able to hold it (aka the companies pushing it) liable for providing blatantly false information? At least then they'd have incentive to provide accurate information instead of just authoritative information.

[-] Womble@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

As much as you can hold a computer manufacturer responsible for buggy software.

[-] backgroundcow@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago

I very much understand wanting to have a say against our data being freely harvested for AI training. But this article's call for a general opt-out of interacting with AI seems a bit regressive. Many aspects of this and other discussions about the "AI revolution" remind me about the Mitchell and Web skit on the start of the bronze age: https://youtu.be/nyu4u3VZYaQ

[-] WaitThisIsntReddit@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

If there was an ai to detect ai would you use it?

[-] NotASharkInAManSuit@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago

Yes. That is actually an ideal function of ethical AI. I’m not against AI in regards to things that is is actually beneficial towards and where it can be used as a tool for understanding, I just don’t like it being used as a thief’s tool pretending to be a paintbrush or a typewriter. There are good and ethical uses for AI, art is not one of them.

[-] smarttech@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago

AI is everywhere now, but having the choice to opt out matters. Sometimes, using tools lik Instant Ink isn't about AI it’s just about saving time and making printing easier.

[-] PalimpsestNavigator@midwest.social 1 points 2 months ago

WUH OH, A COTTON GIN’S TRYNA REPLACE US!!

🥴

this post was submitted on 12 May 2025
532 points (100.0% liked)

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