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Altimont owns Carmen’s Corner Store in Hagerstown, Maryland, a community where around 20 percent of people rely on the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP) to buy their groceries. But a federal agency decided that Altimont can never accept SNAP as a form of payment at Carmen’s.

That decision isn’t because Altimont has done anything wrong as a business owner, but rather because of unrelated crimes from 2004, for which he’s already served his time.

The United States Department of Agriculture (USDA) permanently bans anyone with drug, alcohol, tobacco, or firearms convictions from participating in the SNAP program—a harsher punishment than the agency dishes out to those who have actually defrauded the program. That’s not just irrational, it’s also unconstitutional, which is why Altimont teamed up with our organization, the Institute for Justice (IJ), to file a federal lawsuit against the agency on Tuesday.

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[-] Gradually_Adjusting@lemmy.world 74 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Seems like a natural consequence of the 13th amendment. Why would you make it easier for an escaped slave to remain free? There are literally shareholders who have a vested interest in recidivism.

Edit: In case it wasn't clear, I find the situation monstrous. Just stating my thinking behind why it happens at all, and might be hard to change.

[-] OldWoodFrame@lemm.ee 58 points 1 year ago

You would think that an idea to reduce recidivism and thus reduce crime, like rehabilitation over punishment, would be popular in a democratic system, it's a real problem that it isn't. A bunch of states are dealing with this as there's a backlash for bail reform.

People just think punishing crime more reduces crime more and it's not (necessarily) correct. And in a democratic system we reward what people think is true over what is true.

[-] Furbag@lemmy.world 23 points 1 year ago

It's silly because it doesn't matter how bad the punishment is if every criminal from petty to professional thinks "I'll never get caught". They aren't even considering a possibility of failure, and thus the consequences will never be a deterrent to their actions.

Once they get to prison, no amount of human rights abuses is going to magically make them into upstanding citizens. But somehow people think that if prison is a bad place nobody would want to go back. While that's true, it's a naive point of view from people who have never stopped to think about how someone freshly released from jail earns money or pays rent or buys necessities.

If, as a society, we truly care about reducing crime and not just punishing criminals out of a sense of twisted vengeance, we should be prioritizing rehabilitation and reform, rather than letting prisoners who could otherwise be saved languish in a system that seems to be okay with criminal gangs having total control of the social hierarchy on the inside.

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[-] NounsAndWords@lemmy.world 13 points 1 year ago

People just think punishing crime more reduces crime more and it’s not (necessarily) correct. And in a democratic system we reward what people think is true over what is true.

This is one of those rare instances that (to them) punishment is openly the point. It doesn't matter that there are ways to save money and increase everyone's quality of life in the process. And it doesn't hurt that an entire industry has grown to steal money from the state to punish these people and a small portion is put back into advertising/lobbying to make sure the cycle continues.

[-] sab@kbin.social 7 points 1 year ago

I'm afraid a lot of people don't even care if it's working - they just think being "though on crime" makes society masculine and cool (and preferably white). They'd vote for it even if they knew it's bad policy.

[-] centof@lemm.ee 7 points 1 year ago

In addition to people somewhat naturally wanting to punish crime, A lot of people like to feel superior to others in any way they can. That way they can be internally excuse their own shortcomings.

Ex: I may be unsuccessful but at least I'm not a druggie, criminal, black, or a heathen. Too many Americans would rather hate and suppress someone in different circumstances rather than help them out.

[-] Spaghetti_Hitchens@kbin.social 6 points 1 year ago

It's very sad that in the US we have a justice system for protecting the rich and a revenge system for punishing everyone else.

[-] Alexstarfire@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

It's definitely not popular when prisoners are the only people we can legally treat as slaves.

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[-] lolcatnip@reddthat.com 47 points 1 year ago

In the US, all felony convictions come with a lifetime sentence. It's just that the sentence usually only includes prison time at the beginning.

It's pretty fucked up, especially considering how many victimless crimes are felonies.

[-] Neato@kbin.social 18 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I'm generally against prison for almost all offenses. There's no point to prison in America unless you just want to ensure someone suffers and is forever harmed by the state. Prison doesn't rehabilitate, it makes you into a worse person from what you need to do to survive. Prison doesn't encourage you being less of a criminal on release, it makes your life SO much harder to survive that crime is a much better option than before. Prison forces a social stigma forever through job applications and the like that ensures no one will ever forget and will treat you worse because of it. Prison and the justice system is designed to bleed money from poor people and their families so you can't even get out with a helping hand ready. Prison quality is incredibly low and practically zero Americans care about it. Just look at all the "prison rape" jokes: Americans by-and-large want prison to be tortuous due to a bloodthirsty feeling of vengeance and powerlessness.

Prison is there only to do further harm to those desperate enough to commit serious crimes in the first place. And to increase recidivism to ensure the prison industrial complex and police "unions" keep thriving. There's no point to sending 99% of criminals to prison but we have no alternatives besides mental hospitals which are not equipped to deal with a huge influx of violently disaffected people.

[-] HiddenLayer5@lemmy.ml 13 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Which is exactly the point. The prison system is too profitable to risk the supply of prisoners drying up.

[-] ComfyMuffin@lemmy.world 13 points 1 year ago

"Now prisoner 24601...."

[-] mcathen@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago

This is a feature, not a bug.

[-] some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org 9 points 1 year ago

I have a family member who got into a physical altercation with an airport employee nearly twenty years ago over the way that employee was handling his laptop. The government will have its boot on his neck for the rest of his life, even though he went to prison (it was only like six months) and completed probation. He's since tried to start multiple businesses, started a family, and in other ways moved on. He's forbidden from certain parts of society similarly to the people in this article.

It's completely ridiculous that a non-violent person could have an out-of-character outburst and be punished forever for it. But try discussing that with anyone who's advocating for crime-and-punishment policies.

[-] jon@lemdro.id 6 points 1 year ago

Does the world have a government or did the headline perhaps forget to mention that it's referring to one particular country...?

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this post was submitted on 29 Aug 2023
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