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'Admit you're Hamas or we'll send a drone to kill your family' (www.middleeastmonitor.com)

submitted 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) by IndustryStandard@lemmy.world to c/world@lemmy.world

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American Dr Mark Perlmutter, who has volunteered in Gaza, says one of his Palestinian colleagues was taken by Israeli occupation forces, had his fingers shattered and was told to confess to being a member of Hamas or have his wife gang raped in front of him.

Soldiers 'crushed' his fingers, Perlmutter explains, adding that they also threatened to 'send a drone to your bedroom window and incinerate your children.' The doctor did not confess and spent 11 months being tortured in Israeli detention.

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[-] hark@lemmy.world 94 points 5 days ago

This is yet another one of many examples that affirms the correct answer to "does israel have a right to exist?" is no. No nation has an inherent right to exist, but certainly a nation as horrible as israel should not exist for many reasons, including morally, just like how nazi germany has no right to exist.

[-] jsomae@lemmy.ml 3 points 3 days ago

For everyone wondering if this means genocide against Israel -- no! Of course not! This means the nation -- that is, the government, the borders, etc. -- needs to be reformed.

[-] tacobellhop@midwest.social 27 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

You gotta wonder how Israel will get out from under netenyahu/spelling. He’s their sadam now

[-] bedouin@infosec.pub 22 points 5 days ago

Nope nope nope. Putting the blame entirely on Netanyahu is like putting the entire blame on Trump. Both are symptoms of an underlying society and many people enabling and condoning that behavior. Look at stats, watch translated videos of their media, read Israeli and non-Israeli historians. This shit ain't new and some would argue is exactly what the Zionist state was created to carry out.

[-] tacobellhop@midwest.social 8 points 5 days ago

Oh youre not wrong but sadam wasn’t in a vacuum either is my broader point. These personalities have always existed in every time period in human history. It wasn’t until the cognitive revolution of he 50s did we start to develop archetypes of personalities and on a broader macro sense the cognitive behaviors of societies as a whole.

[-] Saleh@feddit.org 6 points 4 days ago

Saddam quickly went from ruling by popular support to ruling by scaring the shit out of any opposition.

Netanyahu and other Fascists in Israel still enjoy comfortable majority support in Israel. Even if people protest against Netanyahu, they are largely still in favor of ethnical cleansing and genocide against the Palestinians. Most people in Iraq didn't need reeducation when Saddam was toppled. The vast majority of Israelis need a reeducation and be confronted with their crimes at large and have hundreds of thousands of their war criminals permanently locked away in order to cure the Fascism that has deep roots in their society now. It will take decades to safe them from who they have chosen to become.

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[-] TheFriar@lemm.ee 27 points 5 days ago

I think you’re getting into dangerous territory with that thinking. People are not a monolith, even when an outspoken and visible portion of the population are monsters. Secondly, you say “Nazi germany has no right to exist,” but Germany does. Painting with that broad a brush and speaking in such absolutes opens the door to horrible acts. Because the zionists speak the exact same way about Palestine. That’s where that thinking and language can lead you.

[-] vibraniumdroid@lemmy.world 23 points 5 days ago

My dude, the whole thing is a settler colonialist project. It has no right to exist, and no word salad attempting to introduce nuance into a black and white situation is convincing anyone otherwise. This isn't Reddit.

[-] TheFriar@lemm.ee 9 points 5 days ago

The fact that you think no nuance exists in the Israel Palestine conflict is genuinely insane.

[-] wildbus8979@sh.itjust.works 9 points 5 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

The only nuance there is to be had is for Israelis born there who are advocating for complete integration and reparations under a one state solution. Bar that, they can fuck right off.

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[-] IndustryStandard@lemmy.world 20 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

There is no equation of victimhood here. Zionists have stolen Palestinian houses and land.

There were Nazi Germans occupying houses in Poland which they stole from Jews. After the Holocaust those Nazis were expelled back to where they came from. In this case from Nazi Germany (which included Poland) to Germany (without Poland)

[-] Saleh@feddit.org 8 points 4 days ago

Germany does not have the right to exist. The German people have a right to self determination, like any people in the world does. This right is not tied to any specific state.

It is also completely absurd to define such rights to a specific state. Any specific state needs a specific government, a specific territory and a specific people. The only thing that carried over from the Nazi era was the people. A different government was formed on a very different territory. If you claim "Germany has a right to exist" in connection with the Nazi Reich, that Germany would have to include large swaths of what is todays Poland and Czech Republic.

Meanwhile there was no Israel in 1947. There was no Israeli people in 1947. The entire people is a construct, that only started to become a reality through 80 years of ethnic cleansing and genocide against the Palestinian people. Now that they are a people is a reality. That this people thus has the right to form a fascist state and deny the rights to the people who they have uprooted is nonsense.

If the US was to invade Canada, drive the Canadians north of the arctic circle and then claim this is US-Canada now because the filled it with millions of their own settlers, that does not create a "right to exist" for US-Canada.

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[-] skozzii@lemmy.ca 8 points 5 days ago

If you condemn all the people for the actions of their government then you are no better than they are.

[-] FringeTheory999@lemmy.world 23 points 5 days ago

Saying that the nation state of Israel doesn't have a right to exist isn't the same as saying the people of Israel don't have the right to exist. A nation state is just a legal construct, it doesn't have human rights. The people who live in any region are not the nation state, and they have a right to exist, but they do not have the right to create and maintain an ethnostate that oppresses other people.

[-] pyre@lemmy.world 12 points 5 days ago

this is your strawman judging you

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[-] Mrkawfee@lemmy.world 14 points 4 days ago

We are all dirt to these people.

[-] victorz@lemmy.world 96 points 6 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

I don't understand the point of that, honestly. Torturing someone (thus punishing them regardless) into confessing, coaxing a confession out of someone making the confession itself highly incredulous. What's the point?

Thanks for all the replies, guys! I appreciate the responses but at the same time I'm now even more depressed. 😬

[-] alvvayson@lemmy.dbzer0.com 134 points 6 days ago

The point is to kill and torture these people. Calling them terrorists is a tried and true tactic.

They will call him Hamas whether he confesses or not and then say they killed another Hamas terrorist.

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[-] Arbiter@lemmy.world 77 points 6 days ago

Because it’s a genocide.

If he confesses they’re justified because “he was totally hamas” if he holds out they’re justified because “he’s a highly trained hamas agent”.

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[-] IndustryStandard@lemmy.world 58 points 6 days ago

The BBC and New York times will publish the confession uncritically to manufacture consent for Israel torturing doctors.

[-] Limitless_screaming@kbin.earth 47 points 6 days ago

Confess -> got a video of a "Hamas member" who works in the medical field confessing to whatever you want.

Doesn't confess -> torture him to death and don't share the story or simply increase the count of "Hamas militants" killed that you'll show later to journalists and other governments.

[-] RymrgandsDaughter@lemmy.world 25 points 5 days ago

To push them into breaking so when you kill them you can say that the torture is justified.

Hamas is an excuse, the genocide will happen regardless

[-] Keeponstalin@lemmy.world 40 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

The point is cruely and supremacy. Everyone knows torture doesn't work when it comes to extracting information, even the Nazis knew that much. What they want is to instill fear and terror into every Palestinian, in an attempt to bring the entire population into despair and cripple the resistance. That's why the IDF routinely kidnaps Palestinians, including children, without any evidence or fair trial, to incarcerate them indefinitely in torture prisons that are more inhumane than we can possibly imagine.

Palestinian Prisoners in Israeli Prisons

Palestinians are jailed without charge, forced into false confessions, routinely tortured, raped, denied medical attention, and some even killed as a result. This includes hundreds of children.

Palestinians denied civil rights (HRW) including Military Court (B'TSelem)

Palestinian Prisoners in Israel (wiki)

Children are jailed and abused in Israeli prisons (Save The Children)

Torture and Abuse in Interrogations (B'TSelem)

Thousands of Palestinians are held without charge under Israeli detention policy (NPR)

Urgently investigate inhumane treatment and enforced disappearance of Palestinians detainees from Gaza (Amnesty)

Israel/OPT: Horrifying cases of torture and degrading treatment of Palestinian detainees amid spike in arbitrary arrests (Amnesty)

[-] quack@lemmy.zip 9 points 5 days ago

The point is the cruelty.

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[-] Melvin_Ferd@lemmy.world 34 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

I'm always really surprised more people don't post this stuff in conservative dominated spaces.

They're not monsters. Aside from the trolls and bots that are paid to try to sway them to be. Also the under 20 year olds that are edge Lords.

I think it's legit to get discussions and to challenge their core beliefs honestly. I do it. Some get through, sometimes I get banned. But I'm surprised more people don't go out and do similar

[-] IndustryStandard@lemmy.world 27 points 5 days ago

Most moderators of conservative spaces actively remove this type of news. If you manage to find a conservative space allowing this kind of stuff by all means do post it there.

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[-] ayyy@sh.itjust.works 21 points 5 days ago

Have you tried? Your fantasy depiction of unfortunate misguided Nazis does not meet up with reality.

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[-] magnetosphere@fedia.io 65 points 6 days ago

That headline seems like a bit of a catch 22. If he says he’s Hamas, he becomes a “legitimate” target.

[-] Clent@lemmy.dbzer0.com 88 points 6 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

If you refuse to tell us you're Hamas, we'll be forced to murder your family.

If you tell us your Hamas, we'll be obligated to murder your family.

Totally different scenarios.

Genociders gonna genocide.

[-] Cocopanda@futurology.today 21 points 5 days ago

Boy. Im so happy that religious nut bags are using my tax dollars to kill children. /s

Honestly, if there is a hell. A lot of the American Christians are going to burn in it.

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[-] Lasherz12@lemmy.world 32 points 6 days ago

Makes a lot of sense that the IDF are the same people largely training cops in the US. Conflicting logic and orders so no matter what they get to shoot.

[-] catloaf@lemm.ee 34 points 6 days ago

That's the point.

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[-] BlushedPotatoPlayers@sopuli.xyz 21 points 5 days ago

These days feel like an 'Are we the baddies?' moment for the US

[-] WuceBrillis@lemm.ee 28 points 5 days ago

Always have been. Hitler said himself he was inspired by the American way of treating people of colour.

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this post was submitted on 26 Mar 2025

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