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submitted 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) by misk@sopuli.xyz to c/technology@lemmy.world
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[-] narc0tic_bird@lemm.ee 87 points 2 weeks ago

I'm not sure how sustainable this model is. Especially when a reader browses via a link aggregator and therefore reads news articles on many different websites. I doubt most people want/can afford a subscription on dozens of different news outlets, as that'll quickly add up to a triple-digit monthly bill.

Something like Flattr, but maybe non-optional, would be better. Pay a fixed monthly fee and split the payment between all sites you read articles on (maybe based on how many, or reading time or whatever).

[-] fluxion@lemmy.world 42 points 2 weeks ago

$1-$2 month maybe: they want $7 which is close enough to a Hulu/Netflix subscription fee that you immediately realize it's not tenable to subscribe to all the major news sites you read, so then you start needing to build a "top 5" in your head because that's all you can reasonably budget and that's either too much of a PITA for whatever article you're trying to read or you realize Verge isn't in that top 5 and move on

[-] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 22 points 2 weeks ago

Even $1 is probably too much. I read articles from dozens of different sources and managing that would royally suck. Got a new credit card? Have a fun next hour of your life logging in everywhere...

No, just give me an add-on so I can pay to bypass a paywall. I don't want an account everywhere, I just want to read your article, and I'm willing to pay a few cents to do so (way more than they'd get with ads).

[-] M600@lemmy.world 5 points 2 weeks ago

That price is way too much. My wife and I use Netflix for hours each day on average. I get significantly more use out of netflix. There is no way I’m paying a website like the verge $7/month when I can get the same new for free from some YouTuber.

[-] MagicShel@lemmy.zip 16 points 2 weeks ago

I would do this with one caveat: sometimes people link really garbage articles. There was one here yesterday written so poorly I feel less informed for having read it. I would like the option to take my money back for reading such a bad article.

I do want to pay for news, but I can't subscribe to everyone, or even just "the good ones", because I do use aggregator sites.

I also wonder if that would lead to a model of paying every website for content because if Reddit is good enough to train AI on and good enough that many people include it in their Google searches, who is to say the comments aren't "articles"?

or reading time or whatever

Could result in badly written, overly long articles and poor UI to force people to take longer. I know you're just spitballing, but thought I'd point out how easy it is to induce unintended consequences.

[-] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 5 points 2 weeks ago

Exactly. Give me an add-on to pay to bypass paywalls for a few cents and they'll get my money. I'm not making an account or paying a subscription, but I'm happy to leave some change in the donation box.

[-] AusatKeyboardPremi@lemmy.world 3 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

There was one here yesterday written so poorly I feel less informed for having read it. I would like the option to take my money back for reading such a bad article.

That’s hilarious.

Can you share the post?

[-] Rogue@feddit.uk 15 points 2 weeks ago

Flattr was such a good concept, it's so disappointing it never caught on

[-] MurrayL@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago

Pretty sure that’s the model Apple News+ uses, but the price has always seemed pretty steep to me compared to other subscription services.

[-] morrowind@lemmy.ml 4 points 2 weeks ago

This is what scroll did, before they got bought by Twitter. Same for coil, who shut down, by the people behind then still seem to be working on something. See https://webmonetization.org/

[-] dick_stitches@lemm.ee 3 points 2 weeks ago

Isn't this EXACTLY how it worked before publishers started using the internet? You had to pay either a subscription, or per issue for every magazine or newspaper you wanted to read. Instead of having subscriptions to "dozens of different news outlets", people only paid for a few. The ones that interested you most, you paid a subscription for, and if you were interested in anything else, you just bought single issues.

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[-] adam_y@lemmy.world 66 points 2 weeks ago

If it is behind a paywall, it isnt news, it is an asset.

[-] sunbeam60@lemmy.one 25 points 2 weeks ago

So physical newspapers aren’t news?

[-] nyan@lemmy.cafe 24 points 2 weeks ago

"Can I have that once you're finished with it?" Physical newspapers are subject to being given away by the original purchaser (or getting picked up from cafe tables or pulled from trashcans—people used to leave the damned things lying around everywhere), if you can't afford to pay for them. It's a bit more difficult to do that with digital content.

[-] NotSteve_@lemmy.ca 4 points 2 weeks ago

I guess gift links are a bit similar but obviously at a much smaller scale. I'm not sure how a fully similar digital system to sharing newspapers could be setup while still funding decent journalism.

I don't hate paywalls though because I get it but I can't say I've ever subscribed to get around one.

[-] Passerby6497@lemmy.world 17 points 2 weeks ago

News papers are a physical item, not bits hidden behind a boolean set to true. Plus, I can go read a newspaper at the store if I want to.

[-] misk@sopuli.xyz 14 points 2 weeks ago

You pay for information and not paper or pixels.

[-] ieatpwns@lemmy.world 12 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Information should be free. Putting it behind a paywall makes it so the less fortunate suffer by being kept out of the loop.

[-] Cyber@feddit.uk 9 points 2 weeks ago

Information is free, it's the transmission medium (paper printing or webservers) and the journalist's wages that you should pay for.

[-] Ohmmy@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 2 weeks ago

That doesn't really address their point, that's simply a motte and bailey. Limiting access to information (knowledge/education) on a basis of payment is a hindrance of lower classes not upper classes. We especially see this with academic publishing and the people writing those papers aren't even paid for it usually.

You shouldn't have to pay for the journalist or the transmission, similarly to education it is best for a society (especially a democracy) if information is freely accessible regardless of one's finances.

[-] dick_stitches@lemm.ee 4 points 2 weeks ago

I don't know about you, but I don't live in a utopia that works like this. Journalists have wages, web servers cost a lot of money to run. Printing presses and physical distribution channels also cost a lot of money. If information should be free, how should publishers pay for all of these labor and infrastructure costs?

[-] ieatpwns@lemmy.world 2 points 2 weeks ago

Everything you said is true and I never implied it wasn’t I was just saying that information should be free. If I had an idea on how to make it work I’d be working on it

[-] Ohmmy@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 2 weeks ago
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[-] ryper@lemmy.ca 58 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

The official announcement says they did because people have been asking for a way to support the site, but it's not at all clear those people had a paywall in mind. Ars Technica has had subscriptions for years, and they paywall extra site functionality like topic filtering and a full-text RSS feed, not content.

[-] BearOfaTime@lemm.ee 19 points 2 weeks ago

This is the way.

Same with mobile apps. And give me a way to support a dev without using Google Play (I realize iOS is more problematic).

[-] dinckelman@lemmy.world 37 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Ironically, it’s news that’s free, and garbage is behind the paywall. Verge is not what people remember it being from years ago

[-] iamericandre@lemmy.world 15 points 2 weeks ago

The verge I remember from a few years ago tried to make a video on how to build a pc and look how that turned out

[-] dinckelman@lemmy.world 13 points 2 weeks ago

That’s current Verge for you. It only got worse since then

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[-] DjMeas@lemm.ee 18 points 2 weeks ago

And that's $7/month for fewer, better ads.

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[-] PagingDoctorLove@lemmy.world 12 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Wow this is a great article, thanks for sharing. This quote in particular has a lot to unpack:

We are not chasing platform traffic, we’re not chasing social video views, we’re not doing sponsored content to make our business go like everyone else is forced to do. If you want to go play in those games, you have no choice but to do sponsor integrations. That’s just how those businesses work. We won’t do it, we sell our ethics policy.

The Verge’s decision to raise a paywall comes at a moment when many news media companies are grappling with the dilemma of an emerging gulf between the information ecosystems of free and paid news. As more media companies lean into subscriptions to drive revenue, the reach and impact of their news stories is often limited, or targeted more toward an affluent, educated audience willing to pay for news.>

That must be really challenging if you run an ethical journalism organization. Gone are the days of paying for newspapers, people now expect it for free, and that's not sustainable for a regular business. So it creates a moral dilemma for ethical journalists, who naturally want to continue to reach a large audience and worry about alienating people who can't afford subscriptions.

The free news sites don't have that same quandary. They make money by selling your data, so they remain free. Since it's what the people want, they don't think about the fact that this is achieved by unethical means. These people are already predisposed to be less educated due to income levels alone, meaning they're less likely to perform the critical thinking necessary to realize that journalism - ethics = fake news. Talk about a vicious cycle.

I know I'm not saying anything that people who've been paying attention the past 8 years don't already know, but when you really think about all the implications it's kind of astounding. >

[-] slampisko@lemmy.world 10 points 2 weeks ago

Hot take: Journalism is a public service and as such should be paid from our taxes, with checks and balances in place to prevent takeover by persons in power.

[-] ilinamorato@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago

Tough to do, and do right, but I'm down. Still, until that day...

[-] angstylittlecatboy@reddthat.com 3 points 2 weeks ago

I mean, that's why BBC, NPR, NHK, etc. exist. And the result is that in a lot of ways it is more reliable than for profit news, but at the same time they'll never really bite the hand that feeds (aka government, more specifically the Dems in NPR's case.)

[-] w3dd1e@lemm.ee 11 points 2 weeks ago

Supposedly The Verge is behind a dynamic paywall, metered based on high use, but I got a block in the first article I clicked on this week. I don’t mind a paywall but be clear on what is behind a paywall and what isn’t. I will stop visiting the site at all if I can’t figure it out.

I wish these sites had an option to pay 50cents or whatever for articles I want to read so i can still support them without having to commit to another fucking subscription.

[-] dantheclamman@lemmy.world 10 points 2 weeks ago

I subscribe to more periodicals than most, I think probably almost twenty of them. I just cut out NYTimes, Washington Post, LA Times, Atlantic. I was growing disillusioned with some of their coverage- NYTimes desperately triangulating to the comfortable, safe, meaningless center, WaPo and LAT owned by oligarchs kissing Trump's ring. Atlantic just bores me lately- lots of opinion and not a lot of investigative coverage. But happy to add The Verge. I've read them daily since they were This Is My Next and don't intend to stop.

[-] roofuskit@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Yeah I finally killed my Atlantic subscription. Lots of doom and gloom or pro-isreal opinions, very little substance compared to the magazine they used to be. I miss when they had writers like Ta Nehesi Coates doing real journalism.

[-] Fedditor385@lemmy.world 9 points 2 weeks ago

Well how do you expect people to both make money and provide stuff for free?

[-] masterspace@lemmy.ca 8 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Its a tragedy but not an unavoidable one. It's a direct result of choosing to fund information via the same scarcity based model that we use for physical goods (capitalism).

We don't need to, unlike physical goods, in the digital age it is virtually free to copy and distribute information, but because we still fund it via a model that only gives it value when it's scarce, paywalls or advertising end up being the only way to pay for it.

We should instead have the equivalent of government run subscription services that allow us to provide all information to everyone while still rewarding creators, without using advertising as a middleman / drain on society.

[-] essteeyou@lemmy.world 5 points 2 weeks ago

Sounds a bit like the UK TV License.

[-] PagingDoctorLove@lemmy.world 3 points 2 weeks ago

I hadn't thought about it that way, thanks for sharing that perspective. I agree, but isn't that what NPR was supposed to be? Or am I confusing it with PBS?

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[-] zephorah@lemm.ee 6 points 2 weeks ago

They’re trying to kill us all with financial bug bites.

Cue dipshit statement: It’s just one more little subscription, what’s the big deal…

[-] BearOfaTime@lemm.ee 6 points 2 weeks ago

Well vox is garbage anyway, so no loss.

[-] KingThrillgore@lemmy.ml 6 points 2 weeks ago

‘It’s a tragedy that garbage is free and news is behind paywalls'

Boy, you summed up The Verge beautifully.

[-] ikidd@lemmy.world 5 points 2 weeks ago

You go right the fuck ahead, Verge. Your content wasn't worth free.

[-] HeavyRaptor@lemmy.zip 4 points 2 weeks ago

In this case the garbage is behind the pay wall then. Verge is all opinion pieces and cheap content nowadays anyway.

[-] Kcap@lemmy.world 3 points 2 weeks ago

Oh no, if only I had a 12 ft ladder... 12ft.io

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this post was submitted on 06 Dec 2024
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