730
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[-] milady@lemmy.world 96 points 2 years ago
[-] luffyuk@lemmy.world 33 points 2 years ago

It's hardly a trickle either.

[-] WorldwideCommunity@lemm.ee 18 points 2 years ago

I caught myself mid laugh before realizing the reality of that statement.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] RatMaster@sh.itjust.works 75 points 2 years ago

I'd say it's more like disguised feudalism. We're all peasants for the few kings and queens that have all the money at the top.

[-] Corkyskog@sh.itjust.works 13 points 2 years ago

I don't think people actually agree on the definition of capitalism itself, I just looked it up and was a little surprised how definitive it is:

an economic and political system in which a country's trade and industry are controlled by private owners for profit.

If you asked whether capitalism is a political system, at least in my random polling, 2 out of 9 respondents said No.

[-] MrPoopyButthole@lemm.ee 49 points 2 years ago

Honestly one of the reasons I fell for a pyramid scheme coming out of high school.

A friend invited me and I went to shit on it and get him out, but the main guy's whole thing was "everything is a pyramid scheme, at least here you have the chance to build a pyramid beneath you."

Obviously there were other reasons as old as time, but the argument of "so what, your 'regular job' is already a pyramid scheme you can't win" was pretty rattling to a teenager in 2011.

[-] hihellobyeoh@lemmy.world 17 points 2 years ago

The difference between a pyramid scheme and a good business is where your money comes from, in a pyramid scheme it comes from the people at the bottom of the pyramid, in a business it comes from selling goods and/or services, that's not saying I agree with big business, but one is profiting off of legitimate customers, the other is profiting off it's own "employees". I nearly got caught into one a few years ago too, until I realized what it was, at that point they had only taken a couple $100 for the interview and sign up stage, i had to block my card for them to never get access again, because even though i didnt complete sign up, thwy kept charging me monthly

load more comments (3 replies)
[-] solstice@lemmy.world 48 points 2 years ago

It fundamentally is NOT a pyramid scheme. In a pyramid scheme there is no actual product or service of value and simply extracts wealth from the people in lower tiers. Value, or wealth, is simply the byproduct of an equitable transaction between two or more parties.

[-] bendak@lemmy.world 22 points 2 years ago

Transactions are often not equitable, and most wealth bubbles up to the people on the top tiers.

[-] solstice@lemmy.world 10 points 2 years ago

Markets are not always fair or efficient but that doesn't mean capitalism is a pyramid scheme. It is still very much the opposite.

[-] KirbyQK@lemmy.world 11 points 2 years ago

Unregulated capitalism places all of the power in the hands of the wealthy. Even with the amount of regulation in place, the last 4 decades has irrefutably proven that. The transfer of wealth from the bottom 95% to the top 5% has has been insane.

The only reason we need so much regulation is because people are garbage and if they can gain something for nothing, they will. You cannot consider the pure idea of capitalism without also considering the reality of human nature, that it is inherently going to create a pyramid scheme like situation where the top transfer power and wealth to themselves in the largest quantities they can, in spite of pesky things like laws and taxes.

[-] markr@lemmy.world 7 points 2 years ago

Yes that is true, and you can view wealth distribution as pyramid shaped, but that is not what a pyramid scheme means. As noted the system is very good at producing massive amounts of commodities, distributing them all over the planet, and exchanging them for your labor. If capitalism did nothing useful it would have disappeared long ago.

load more comments (4 replies)
[-] themeatbridge@lemmy.world 14 points 2 years ago

Except that you're describing commerce, not capitalism. Capitalism is the idea that the commerce has value, and that one can own the value of the commercial activity. Further, the value of the business is tied to it's growth.

Further, products and services are never exchanged in an equitable transaction between two parties, because capitalism necessitates a third party, the capitalist. The capitalist must acquire products and services from employees for less than their true value, and then sell them to consumers for more than their true value.

And because capitalism demands growth, one or both of those two margins must continue to expand. This means workers must be pressured to work for less and less, which is why the capitalist opposes social services, universal healthcare, and affordable housing. This also means the capitalism opposes consumer protections, environmental protections, and taxes that provide a functioning society that might interfere with their growth.

Now what happens when every producer and consumer is fighting for the same margins, the same advantages, and the same growth? Then the capitalist seeks new avenues for new capital and new capitalists. Building business on ensuring the growth of business for other capitalists. Selling the idea that you, too, can join us at the top of the pyramid, all the while kicking down ladders they climbed to get there.

So no, the system itself isn't a pyramid scheme. It's just an idea that encourages pyramid schemes because it relies on impossible growth, like a cancer eating away at society.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[-] xzqtlmn@lemmy.world 41 points 2 years ago

To be more specific, fractional-reserve banking system creates this giant pyramid scheme, not capitalism per se.

[-] 46_and_2@lemmy.world 10 points 2 years ago

Please explain, how exactly is fractional-reserve banking a pyramid scheme?

[-] capr@lemmy.world 8 points 2 years ago

Because it allows banks to lend out money they don't have and when the banks lobby hard enough to completely remove whats left of the gold standard, the sky's the limit for lending out money. Creating money out of thin air increases inflation. However, in a weird way it impoverishes the lower classes while inriching the elite class because the latter tends to better connected and therefor closer to the "monetary spigot". This allows the elite class to buy up everything(land, companies, lobby/bribe governments)from the top down like a game of pacman.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] peto@lemm.ee 31 points 2 years ago

If anything this understates the problem.

[-] pachrist@lemmy.world 14 points 2 years ago

True, because it's also a giant Ponzi scheme. We pick up new debt today to pay off debt from yesterday, and we hope expanding GDP and inflation will always offset the difference.

load more comments (6 replies)
[-] TowerofPimps@lemmy.world 25 points 2 years ago
[-] regular_human@lemmy.world 13 points 2 years ago
[-] Iron_Lynx@lemmy.world 9 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

I've seen several thought experiments about capitalism, and letting it run to its extreme conclusion.

  • Attempt one, with the theoretical best starting conditions, devolved into feudalism
  • Attempt two, which assumed people knew how attempt one ended up and where they wanted to do everything they could to prevent that from happening again, concluded towards theocracy, since capitalism ignores religion, which can become a coercive power structure, separate from capitalism or government.
  • Attempt three, where everyone knew how the previous two experiments went, did away with money, and replaced it with an economy based on service contracts, evolved into communism.
load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[-] God_Is_Love@reddthat.com 14 points 2 years ago

I would say this about the stock market

[-] TrickDacy@lemmy.world 13 points 2 years ago

This is the ideal shower thought imo. Concise, absolutely true, and something you wouldn't realize on a daily basis (at least not in these terms)

[-] Blackmist@feddit.uk 13 points 2 years ago

Yes, but you're going to find the same thing with Communism.

Too many shitty greedy people at the top, too many plebs with fuck all at the bottom.

And while you may be thinking "I could live on a commune, spend an hour a day growing our own food and have all that time left for whatever else I want", you'll quickly find you can't grow your own 65" OLED television or whatever other comforts you've become accustomed to.

The billionaires need reining in, and better distribution of wealth all around the bottom, but capitalism ain't going anywhere.

load more comments (6 replies)
[-] gaybear@lemmy.world 13 points 2 years ago

would you sign up to my pyramid scheme if I was a cat?? 🥺

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] juliebean@lemm.ee 10 points 2 years ago

and with a disappointing lack of giant pyramids, no less!

[-] MiddleWeigh@lemmy.world 8 points 2 years ago

Capitalism is anarchism for shitty people.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] A2PKXG@feddit.de 6 points 2 years ago

To all the people here ranting about monetary debt: its not an issue. Money isn't designed to hold value in the long term. It's a feature, not a bug.

It's just really unfortunate for those who play the game as if money were an asset. It's meant for transactions, not for storage.

load more comments
view more: next ›
this post was submitted on 29 Jul 2023
730 points (100.0% liked)

Showerthoughts

36337 readers
938 users here now

A "Showerthought" is a simple term used to describe the thoughts that pop into your head while you're doing everyday things like taking a shower, driving, or just daydreaming. The most popular seem to be lighthearted clever little truths, hidden in daily life.

Here are some examples to inspire your own showerthoughts:

Rules

  1. All posts must be showerthoughts
  2. The entire showerthought must be in the title
  3. No politics
    • If your topic is in a grey area, please phrase it to emphasize the fascinating aspects, not the dramatic aspects. You can do this by avoiding overly politicized terms such as "capitalism" and "communism". If you must make comparisons, you can say something is different without saying something is better/worse.
    • A good place for politics is c/politicaldiscussion
  4. Posts must be original/unique
  5. Adhere to Lemmy's Code of Conduct and the TOS

If you made it this far, showerthoughts is accepting new mods. This community is generally tame so its not a lot of work, but having a few more mods would help reports get addressed a little sooner.

Whats it like to be a mod? Reports just show up as messages in your Lemmy inbox, and if a different mod has already addressed the report, the message goes away and you never worry about it.

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS