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[-] henfredemars@infosec.pub 66 points 1 year ago

I’ve never understood the label. I’ve had to explain on a few occasions that no, you’re not trying to maintain traditional values. You’re just authoritarian.

[-] undergroundoverground@lemmy.world 42 points 1 year ago

Authoritarianism is the traditional value they're trying to maintain

[-] snooggums@midwest.social 17 points 1 year ago

Speaking of traditional values, I still want to know what Southern Pride is if it isn't glorifying the Confederacy.

[-] cmbabul@lemmy.world 18 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

So am a southerner, and have relocated, southern pride as in pride in the food, music, language/dialect, and culture all of which is heavily influenced by black people is very different than being one of the assholes flying a confederate flag and claiming the south will rise again.

I should add that I grew up in the 90s and witnessed the rise of black culture to the American mainstream so i probably view my enjoyment of southern things differently than someone 20 years older

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[-] pyre@lemmy.world 60 points 1 year ago

that's because fascism is not like other political views. it doesn't come from thinkers, economists, sociologists or philosophers. it comes from maniacs doing maniacal shit. there is no "theory" to read on fascism. which is why the best academic text you find on it comes from its critics.

[-] devils_advocate@lemmy.ml 49 points 1 year ago

People don't recognise fascism when it's in front of their faces.

  • Huge military budget

  • weaponized, authoritarian police force with little oversight.

  • Nationalist habits like pledging allegiance regularly when young and national anthems when together.

  • a strong belief that they are the best nation on earth, often backed with religious certainly.

[-] postmateDumbass@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago

Declaring war on inantimate objects/conditions

[-] positiveWHAT@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago

REJECTION OF PARLIAMENTARY DEMOCRACY AS A SHAM AND A FRAUD
After socialism, Fascism trains its guns on the whole block of democratic ideologies, and rejects both their premises and their practical applications and implements. Fascism denies that numbers, as such, can be the determining factor in human society; it denies the right of numbers to govern by means of periodical consultations; it asserts the irremediable and fertile and beneficent inequality of men who cannot be leveled by any such mechanical and extrinsic device as universal suffrage. Democratic regimes may be described as those under which the people are, from time to time, deluded into the belief that they exercise sovereignty, while all the time real sovereignty resides in and is exercised by other and sometimes irresponsible and secret forces. Democracy is a kingless regime infested by many kings who are sometimes more exclusive, tyrannical, and destructive than one, even if he be a tyrant.

From Benito Mussolini on Fascist doctrine

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[-] nifty@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago

Ummm many fascists are disguised as intellectuals whose sophistry is only revealed by challenging their assumptions. There were a number of such people who came to rise in Nazi Germany and afterwards, and there are many who are their contemporaries

[-] exanime@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago

Ummm many fascists are disguised as intellectuals

exactly... and if I put on a ninja costume, I do not in fact become an ninja.

[-] nifty@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago

Sorry but doesn’t make sense! There are people like Heidegger and Sam Harris who have partly useful contributions to intellectual and academic discourse, but their overarching worldview is authoritarian or fascism aligned. My point is: people multiclass all the time, and you cannot and should not underestimate your ideological opponents

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[-] SkyNTP@lemmy.ml 55 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Conservatism is a distinct political ideology that basically says not all change is for the better, nothing more--it's in the name: conserve. This is a separate concept from authoritarianism, which is all about how power flows. It's possible to be conservative and liberal at the same time if society is losing its liberal values.

US republicans are fascists through and through that wear a disguise of conservatism on select issues to convince people to relinquish their political power so that they can do whatever they want.

[-] Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works 23 points 1 year ago

Sure, it's theoretically possible, but I've never met a conservative anywhere who actually wants to conserve what they have today. In practice, they all want to go back to the past, and most prefer some kind of fictional 1960s past.

[-] rhombus@sh.itjust.works 11 points 1 year ago

That’s the tricky part about conservatism. If their values never change, they are eventually left behind by progress and they become reactionaries. Unfortunately, people just keep accepting their use of the label “conservative” when it stopped fitting them decades ago, which is a convenient cover for the more reprehensible ones.

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[-] Tinidril@midwest.social 23 points 1 year ago

Conservatism is a distinct political ideology that basically says not all change is for the better, nothing more

Based on what? Conservatism's roots go back to royalists after the French Revolution. Conservatives were the American colonists who objected to the war of independence calling it treason against the crown. It's not about change in a general way, it's about resisting democratic movements and preserving autocratic rule.

It's possible to be conservative and liberal at the same time

Liberalism is an offshoot of Conservatism that favors empowerment of the economic elite and institutions over kings and politicians. It's economic totalitarianism instead of political totalitarianism. These become indistinguishable when the economic elite capture the body politic.

US republicans are fascists through and through that wear a disguise of conservatism

This is backwards. The disguise is the thing that turns conservatism info fascism. It's the dressing up of conservative totalitarianism with nationalism, religious fundamentalism, racism, and other forms of identitarianism.

[-] buzz86us@lemmy.world 49 points 1 year ago

I like the idea of conservatism, but not the way it is executed.. Like why aren't these people for conservation of the environment, or actually financially conservative? All I'm noticing is greed, and corporate corruption.

[-] ThatWeirdGuy1001@lemmy.world 73 points 1 year ago

Because by "conserve" they mean conserve the status quo.

Rich people stay rich poor people stay poor and anyone who tries to change that is a commie.

[-] stebo02@sopuli.xyz 19 points 1 year ago

Rich people *get even richer and poor people *become even more poor.

[-] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 11 points 1 year ago

The status quo can include trends, it doesn't necessarily mean a static state. "If the status quo is me getting [richer, more powerful, more control], then that's the one I want."

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[-] Tinidril@midwest.social 14 points 1 year ago

It seems useful to note that the EPA was signed into law by Nixon. We have fallen a long way since Reagan took office.

[-] Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world 21 points 1 year ago

The EPA was the idea of the progressives who seemed to have some momentum toward eventually achieving it. The conservatives (and their polluting corporate benefactors) were threatened by it. So, Nixon co-opted it while conservatives were still in power with the purpose of making sure it was ineffective. They achieved that.

You'll notice that when conservatives have power, they castrate the EPA and make sure it does not affect any of their benefactors. The Dem neo-liberals usually bend a little toward the progressives and will re-instate some of the EPA's power when the Dems are in charge, but it's never enough to undo whatever damage the last GOP administration did. This is because neo-liberals are conservatives. (They aren't as conservative as Republicans, but they are conservative by every international standard.)

Do not give credit to Nixon for the EPA. Like everything else ever done by a conservative, it was an act of self-serving deception. Nothing good in all of human history has ever come from conservatism. Nothing at all.

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They only thing they want to conserve is their capital/social status.

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[-] BonesOfTheMoon@lemmy.world 32 points 1 year ago

I see the lightbulb flickering!

[-] octopus_ink@lemmy.ml 19 points 1 year ago

Assuming the post was made in earnest - the poor guy is so close to getting it. Just let yourself start with your last sentence buddy, and think out from there.

[-] nifty@lemmy.world 17 points 1 year ago

I hate the name of the community is US Authoritarianism when there’s so much fascist rise in EU

And for extra lols the dude in the meme should be asked what he thinks are “normal” right wing policies

[-] GraniteM@lemmy.world 15 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)
[-] OccamsRazer@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago

People in here acting like authoritarianism is somehow inherent to conservatives but not to progressives. Authoritarianism is a problem. Conservativism is a relative political position, meaning there will always be conservatives on one side of the Overton window, wherever it currently resides.

[-] Veraxus@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Eh, depends on what you mean by "conservative" and "progressive".

Authoritarianism is the defining characteristic of the right. The right consolidates wealth and power. The left is egalitarian, and is focused on ensuring that wealth and power is shared more evenly. There is no such thing as "auth left".

If you use "conservative" as a synonym for the right and progressive as a synonym for the left, then there is no such thing as "auth progressive" - you are just using incorrect terminology to talk about different flavors of rightism.

Now if you mean "conservative" as "resistant to change" and "progressive" as "advocates of change" then that's a completely different thing... but the language is STILL messy, because many who call themselves "conservative" are actually advocates of change in favor or more authoritarianism while those who call themselves "progressive" are also advocates of change, but generally in a leftward anti-authoritarian direction... which once again leads us to "auth progressive" being a contradiction.

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[-] Amadou_WhatIWant@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago

Look, conservatives suck but theyre not fascists. Calling everybody to the right of you fascist waters down the meaning of the word.

Heres a good take by Umberto Eco on what makes fascism distinct from other political movements: https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/umberto-eco-ur-fascism

[-] madcaesar@lemmy.world 15 points 1 year ago

It's hard because, yes you are right, but when can you start calling somone a fascist? Do you have have to wait for them to actually start rounding you up and putting you in prison, or can you point it out early in order to avoid the complete fascist takeover?

I guess my point is that, once a group is actually fully fascist, you will no longer be allowed to call them that.

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[-] niktemadur@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago

What a dense, stupid motherfucker. Smacked in the face by a sledgehammer of truth that screams at him at full volume, and STILL he cannot grasp the damn thing.

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[-] just_another_person@lemmy.world 13 points 1 year ago

Fascism is a movement led by a cult of personality with no clear direction, but get people to follow with maniacal views and populist energy against a false premise of a target in an "Us V Them" ideology.

Example: "They stand for everything we don't stand for. Also, they told me you guys look like dorks!"

[-] disguy_ovahea@lemmy.world 11 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

“Trying to define fascism is like trying to nail jelly to the wall."

-Ian Kershaw

But yes, Christian Nationalism, oppressive legislation on civil liberties, exploitative economic systems designed to further widen wealth inequality, and support for militant police conduct are all symptoms of fascism.

[-] barsquid@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago

Are you willing to vote for an obvious criminal who commits election fraud, commits insurrections, extorts foreign governments, and sells top secret documents to adversarial nations? Then you are a fascist.

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[-] FlashMobOfOne@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago

At least here in the US an admitted fascist won the Republican primary, so anyone who is willing to label themselves a Republican should also be perfectly fine with being labeled a fascist.

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this post was submitted on 06 Jun 2024
911 points (100.0% liked)

US Authoritarianism

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