2157
"Both parties are the same!"
(lemmy.world)
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Honestly, I'm here to debate faux progressives that think they can support the oligarch's foreign policy because "ackshually, this all benefits us... Just like the erosion of civil liberties when it's to oppose Drrrroomppfff..."
Truth be told, I am not really a progressive in any conventional sense of the word - but I am in many other ways and, more importantly, I remember the anti-war left. As I am a pacifist and the anti-war movement is close to my heart, I always feel that progressives who cheered on the Ukraine conflict were not really progressives...
And let me also point out: more people are killed and negatively impacted by US foreign policy than any border wall. Yes, of course, I will not ask any progressive to get on board with Trump's immigration policy, but let's also remember: even with the Republican congress, his policies were largely ineffective. There's also something to be said about immigration reform and coming up with a system where everyone who comes is legal and not exploitable.
I do not want to be too contentious because my goal here is to try to appeal to progressives to be more anti-war going forward and rethink their positions on the Ukraine war... But, more importantly, haven't we all just seen what the Biden administration is doing in regards to Palestine?
Establishment Democrats do not deserve your vote - displacing establishment democrats and replacing them with actual progressives should be the #1 priority of any US American progressives, right?
The Russian invasion can be seen as interfering with one side in a civil war that is historically a part of their country and has little to do with the Ukraine, and it does not have many parallels to WWII, IMO... I think each conflict has to be treated differently.
You also use some example where the entire tide of battle is shifted by the entry of the US - of course, such a thing could also happen here, but it could just mean that the war goes nuclear.
Here we are at the point where left wing progressives talk about how world peace has been maintained by the UN charter forgetting by the millions dead in Vietnam and Iraq at the hands of the US who blatantly could ignore these things.
I will not argue with someone who wants to believe that Biden has the right idea on this, but political pressure keeps him in the game of supporting a war abroad. This can be seen as part of my thesis: someone like Trump who is not beholden to the system has more ability to break from foreign policy norms.
Oddly enough, with the hundreds of billions in aid given to the Ukraine, the usurping of Western hegemony really isn't for another time. The multipolar world just arrived.
Ukraine is already a lost cause - the most recent declaration appears to make it so that Ukrainian women will now be drafted and sent to the front alongside their men since they are so starving for soldiers. It's unprecedented.