56
this instance is aging like milk
(sh.itjust.works)
before they were defederated by beehaw due to trolling issues, thenthedonlald showed up, and now exploding heads? what is happening right now?
One of the benefits of a federated social media network is being able to pick an instance that aligns with your own values. If you'd prefer that the admins defederate certain content that isn't defederated by this instance, have you considered using an instance that more closely aligns with your views? As long as they haven't defederated this instance, you'll still be able to interact with any users and communities on this instance that you don't personally block.
I sincerely hope this doesn't sound like I'm asking you to leave. One of the reasons I'm on this instance is that everyone is welcome to make an account, which feels very inclusive to me.
The admin gave democratic power to the users, the users voted in majority in favor of defederating with the alt-right instance, the admin is waiting for God knows what to respect the will of the users and meanwhile the place is getting overtaken...
Overtaken? Where? I'm subscribed to like the most popular subs in this instance and I haven't seen anything even slightly related to any of this shit at all.
How many threads about defederation bad when only one vote happened on the subject and it concerned an alt right instance? Always started by people who have dubious post history or no post history.
This instance could then have got defederated by more instances because a T_D community was allowed to exist on it.
Bruh, is the implication here that anyone who is against defederation is pro T_D or pro Nazi?
No, the implication is that all the anti defederation threads were started by people whose post history has pro defederation comments (only when it fits their own values) or comments on alt -right communities. Not all the people against it, but all those who created a thread.
The majority? Excuse you? ShitJustWorks has over 2000 active users, according to the fediverse explorer. No way a majority of those voted for anything.
And where is this overtaking taking place exactly? The Donald community, which was just one guy shitposting with literally zero engagement by the way, got axed already.
You don't express your right to vote then you support whatever the majority of those who did voted for.
People asked for one instance to be defederated, the vote happened, aye won and now there's one or two new conversations about how it's not a good thing to defederate any instances, always from people who, when you check their history, are active on right wing communities, support defederation of other instances, believe conspiracy theories or any other thing that makes them suspicious in their intent.
I counted 43 ayes. 43 vs over 2000 active users. That is why those early votes should not and most likely will not be honored.
In that case, it would be sound to cancel the decisions already voted. Namely Post Formats, Only those with an account on this instance should vote on the Agora, and Agora Moderators. If we follow that logic, those few dozens of users shouldn't have decided for the thousands of others.
Let's have a vote on rhe number of new users required to cancel all votes and start over! I think it should be a % because otherwise as the place grows we would end up voting again on a much more regular basis.
All in favor say aye
All against say nay
Should we cancel votes on a periodic basis as more people join the instance?
Not cancel the votes but new people will ofc have the possibility to bring existing rules newly to discussion. It may be totally reasonable to review rules, assuming they can get outdated. And ideally, yes, if it was a real community (real verifyable persons) then any new member must be asked if they had any objections to the existing rules, and given the opportunity to newly discuss them (or add to a constantly ongoing discussion). It just isn't all too practical in certain circumstances.
Or people should understand that decentralization means that if they don't agree with the rules on an instance then they can join an instance with rules they agree with and if their current instance goes in a direction they disagree with they can join another instance.
People are just attached to a username and, in this instance's case, to the cool name.
Well, i was implicitely talking about sh.itjust.works, where the owner just opened up all but their most vital rules to be discussed and decided upon by the users. This applies regardless of the age of a user account. ... And then i was talking about an ideal, in-person situation ... which we don't have here.
Votes should be held in a way that makes it apparent for users that they are happening, for example by giving a server-wide announcement. They shouls further run for at least a week, if not longer. They also need to be clear in their wording, concise and easy to find.
There's a sticky in the main community to announce the creation of the Agora and all the kinks about votes are being worked on already.
Worked on, not fixed. It's an important distinction.
You know your need to start by working on stuff before they're fixed, right?
Nice strawman.
I actually have to agree with you, I don't like defederation because the way that all dictatorships got into power was by manipulating the flow of information.
OP and the person making the strawman are bad faith actors trying to lie their way to returning to "Web 2.0", or for the evulz.
Just pointing out what is easily seen by looking at the post history of people
I'm probably as left as you can get socially and I always advocate for inclusivity, and am against defederation because then you're causing them to just have an echo chamber and then any unknowing party on that instance is just going to get blasted with only that shit and then you've just done the recruiting job for them.
The recruiting job happens outside of their echo chamber, not inside, giving them more platforms (social medias) is what caused a surge in the far right movement.
This sounds like a lot of homework. I want to interact with people, not worry about whether my chosen server is and will remain acceptable to every clique.
One other late thought on this. Lemmy advocates like this one have told me that “It doesn't matter which instance you use. You'll still be able to interact with communities (subreddits) on all other instances, regardless of which instance your account lives.” Doesn’t defederation prevent interaction between two instances, making the above statement false?
I think it would be harmful if defederation became commonplace and fragment the fediverse. On the other hand, I don't see any issue with there being "niche" instances which have a specific demographic of users they want to serve, and I don't see any harm in them defederating with other niche instances. Lemmygrad and exploding heads seem like a good example, I've heard they've defederated each other. I don't think that affects the overall fediverse too much because the users of those instances would probably block or brigade the other instance anyway. There wouldn't be any positive interaction between them, so nothing of value has been lost.
Basically, I think it would be ideal if it's only the "niche" instances that use defederation as a moderation tool, and most instances only defederate for spam or illegal content.
So you're saying that decentralization would be bad for an intentionally decentralized platform? 🤔
Decentralization good. Fragmentation bad.
Yeah so you want communities to be centralized on major instances that all communicate with each other in unity... So you want Reddit.
No, I clearly said I prefer decentralization. Are you intentionally misinterpreting my posts? I'm getting the sense got aren't participating in these discussions in good faith.
Well you don't understand decentralization if you want big instances instead of tons of small instances and if you don't want defederation to happen. Isolation also protects each instance from becoming the same.
I didn't say I prefer a few big instances over many smaller instances. I said I'd prefer if most instances didn't defederate with other instances, except for spam and illegal content.
In going to stop interacting with you now, because I'm almost certain you are not acting in good faith.
Defederation doesn't prevent you from subscribing to the instance that defederated yours, you'll only be able to interact with people from your own instance when checking content over there.
small and private instances are the key
it only applies when you use your own instance or an instance you can control
It only takes a little bit of homework. When I made the jump I was able to find out pretty easily that beehaw wouldn't be right for me because of their views that moderators should be heavily involved.
yeah, you're right, the problem was I signed up to any random instance that signups open so I catch up with what's happening
what's ironic was that I used Lemmy before back in 2020 (back when I started using the fediverse in general but I never expected Lemmy to take off that fast that much)
I guess I have to relearn from my mistake for the second time.
I really hope we get the ability to migrate accounts from one instance to another, but I realize it's more complicated than it might seem.
not quite, Pleroma implemented this, though it migrates everything except posts and replies
It would be great to see Lemmy adopt this feature, but until then our accounts are stuck on sh.itjust.works since it's not a Pleroma server.
Why not just make a new account on a different instance? Are you trying to keep record of your posts? Your subscription? Blocks and friends? Can be an interesting problem for someone with the time and skill to tackle.
I think it would be nice to keep your post history, subscriptions, etc. linked to your account if you decide to switch instances. It could also give other users a way to verify that the new account is legitimate. It's not an essential feature, more of a nice-to-have.
Well said!