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this post was submitted on 29 Oct 2023
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No Stupid Questions
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What wasn’t reasoned into her head, can’t be reasoned out.
Sounds like there’s a good chance that you may need to apply a method I use when dealing people who believe in conspiracy theories. It’s largely a psychological thing, and it has very little to do with proof, evidence, logic, reasoning and science. No amount of evidence is ever going to solve a problem that is psychological in nature. Religious cults and conspiracy groups share some characteristics, so maybe this is applicable in her case too.
The idea is that people believe in crazy BS because that makes them a member of a group. That gives them an identity and makes them feel like they’re a privileged group for knowing some “hidden truth” about something. It also produces an “us against them” dynamic between the in-group and the out-group. Many individuals in these groups also have sub-clinical psychosis, narcissism or paranoia accompanied by anxiety and loneliness. This setup means that they find these BS nonsense groups appealing, and that the misguided beliefs become essentially bullet proof. Fighting against these beliefs will only make them stronger.
These people need therapy more than evidence.
So what's your method? I don't think you ever actually spelled it out in the comment unless you meant sending them to therapy, which isn't a bad idea.
Forget all the evidence and facts. Provide psychological support instead.
They'll just consider psychological help as brainwash attempt and reject the help.
There's no help for them. It's sad really.
Just be kind. Be a human. Ask them how their day went. Listen to their worries. You don’t have to be a psychologist or pull any complex therapy maneuvers. Leave that to the professionals. Just having a normal every day chitchat can be surprisingly helpful to someone who is living in a completely different version of reality.
Just talk about other every day things, and avoid the topic of delusion.
What's hilarious to me is once I had this realization it was so relieving. I fucking hated the idea of me having to suck up to some asshole sky daddy just because I had the audacity to be born.
Absolutely. Fear and uncertainty are a huge part of many conspiracy theories. It’s actually quite human to be uncomfortable with uncertainty.
However, in the case of Conspiratorial Thinking (CT), that uncertainty just goes wild and the person in question will seek out unorthodox methods to cope with it. Even if the explanation is complete BS, it’s still more comforting than having no explanation at all. It’s comforting and appealing, but it does not solve the underlying problem, and that’s why people with CT have a hard time getting back to normal thinking.
The world is big, scary and full of complex interactions. If you can come up with a miserably flimsy excuse of an explanation that will at least calm you down, you’re absolutely going to hold on to it. Humans are pretty bad at tolerating uncertainty, and some people will feel absolutely devastated in the face of global economic turmoil and political unrest. Some people will go to great lengths to mitigate uncertainty, and resorting to CT isn’t even the most extreme example of this behavior.
I'm confused, can you describe the method you use directly? my only tool for dealing with people like this is ignoring them and cutting contact, it'd be nice to have some tools in case it happens to someone I actually like
These people might be in a vulnerable spot, so help and support are the types of things they really need. Be a human to another human. Provide social interaction, friendship and understanding.
Facts and debate will only push them further away from reality and deeper into a fantasy realm of their own. They find it appealing, but it won’t actually address their problems.
Interesting, because it seems that lack of identity and hobbies is causing this. It is like when people become fan of product such as sport teams, a car manufacturer, an operating system so they can feel included.
The difference is, the low fee entry to believe systems, you don't need to think or spend money, just listen or watch YouTube videos.
Maybe OP need to take these family members to join club or something else where they replace this passive lifestyle with a little bit active one.
That’s true. The feeling of community plays an important part in many conspiracy theories. Humans are social animals, so social interaction is essential for wellbeing. If you’re lonely, you’ll naturally crave for a sense of community, and that’s exactly what many conspiracy theories will provide. Alternatively, you could build a kite and go to the nearest park and talk to all the other people flying their kites, but it’s a lot easier to watch conspiracy videos and join those forums.
On top of that, there’s a strong sense of in-group vs. out-group. That’s basically just a modern version of tribalism. It’s the usual “us against them” setup all over again.