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this post was submitted on 19 Oct 2023
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I appreciate IDF bombs only striking Hamas fighters and leaving innocent Palestinians who are not being bombed, terrorised, starved, facing mass eviction and collective punishment (a war crime)
Again, you have no solution. Your calls for ceasefire is simultaneously a call for Israel to return to the status quo of hundreds of rockets launched at them per day and the threat of constant terrorism festering just outside their borders. Israel won't do that.
Nice strawman you built up there. Dealing with Hamas doesn't require indiscriminate bombing of Gaza. Most people in Gaza are not Hamas. Likewise, dealing with Hamas doesn't require starving the populace, nor using white phosphorous nor indulging in collective punishment - again, all war crimes. If you think that Israel has a right to commit war crimes then we have nothing to discuss.
Who said the bombings were indiscriminate? Did I ever say most Gazans were Hamas? Have all the Gazans starved or are they still there? You can be outraged all you want, but Israel is going to defend itself from an existential threat at its borders. So long as Hamas remains in Gaza, Israel is going to seek them out with prejudice. It doesn't matter how innocent the people are. Hamas is launching rockets at Israel from their kitchen window. Israel doesn't have to let themselves be destroyed for Palestinians, like so many wish.
Are the 5000 Palestinians killed so far all Hamas? The bombing is indiscriminate. That Gaza has no food supplies is a fact. Using white phosphorous is a fact. Collective punishment by the idf is a fact. These are war crimes and you are justifying war criminals. We're done. I will not discuss with someone who justifies war crimes (for the record the actions of Hamas are equally unjustifiable for the same reason)
No, but you have no idea how many of those deaths were indirectly caused by Hamas, for example, you don't know how many died because they listened to Hamas propaganda and refused to evacuate, or they died because they didn't evacuate and Hamas used their kitchen to fire rockets at Israel (war crime). You're pretending the bombings are indiscriminate but you have no access to Israel's military intelligence, so you must be going out of your way to view Israel poorly. You can be done with the conversation, but that just proves what I said from the very start, that those who call for peace for Palestinians are fundamentally ignoring the problems involved and essentially asking that Israel roll over and die. No, Israel exists and, so long as it does, it will defend its sovereignty. Both sides are bad, is a lazy copout, and a poor way to defend terrorism.
You're the one making excuses for war crimes
You realize launching missiles from civilian infrastructure is a war crime? And do you realize killing civilians is not a war crime if you are striking a legitimate military target?
Edit: You realize taking civilian hostages is a war crime?
I'm not claiming otherwise. Hamas are a terrorist organisation and should be dismantled. I feel the same about Likud and for very similar reasons. It's pretty fucking weird to assume that someone criticising Israel's actions against the Palestinians means they support Hamas.
As I've said from the start, what I'm criticizing is that those who call for ceasefire or for free Palestine, are implicitly ignoring the effects of the outcome they're calling for. What happens to the Palestinian people if they lay down their arms? Peace or war? What happens to Israel if they lay down their arms? Peace or war?
Those who call for peace in the face of an enemy sworn to kill all Jews and destroy Israel, these people are not calling for peace at all. They are rallying against Israel and demanding its destruction. You have no solution to offer for the problem of Hamas, yet you insist Israel allow them to continue to exist, knowing that they will simply plan more attacks in the future. You do not want peace.
"The Palestinian people" haven't taken up arms. Hamas has. Again you fail to distinguish the two and that is the problem
No, I pretty explicitly call out Hamas, it's all their in my comment. Run away if you want. You realize Hamas is Palestinian?
For fucks sake. We didn't bomb all the Irish for the existence of the fucking IRA. Piss off you fucking war crime apologist
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