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this post was submitted on 23 Sep 2023
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Off-topic below.
Btw, I saw some posters here still use the slur "cunt".
It's my understanding that depending on which country you're from (eg Australia or UK) this slur might not carry a sexist connotation in the mainstream culture, so I don't think any of you used it with the intent of being sexist.
Nevertheless, in the feminist circles I belong to, uskng a word that describes the genitalia of AFAB as a slur carries a sexist charge whether it was the intent or not. So we try to create new slur reflexes for ourselves and tend to use other words that do not carry an offensive charge towards a discriminated category.
Please do not take this as a personal attack or an attempt to tell you how to speak, I just think we can do better as a community if everyone spots the stuff they are the more sensitive to and explains to the others why they see a problem.
On-topic. Elon, please get lost in outer space in one of your stupid rockets.
No more using the word dick either guys! Oh wait while we're on it no more saying anything offensive guys, G rated at all times wouldn't want to accidentally offend anyone.
Words have meanings and their acceptance by society changes over time.
I’m middle of the road on the topic.
To me though, “dick” and “cunt” are perfectly effective words that I employ as needed.
Also, relevant link…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_disability-related_terms_with_negative_connotations
My major problem is that our culture and history are interwoven with language. An attack on offensive language could very well, maybe unintentionally, disconnect us further from our culture and history. Not all of that history and culture is great, but even then, we need to stay connected so that we can continue to learn from it for as many generations as possible.
We live in a world where we've been trading in culture for convenience. Now we have some burning books and attacking change. On the other side, we have others who are attacking anything remotely offensive to them, attempting to banish it. The casualty of this war will be the little we have left of our cultural traditions.
What culture do we lose when we remove hateful words from the cultural lexicon?
I wasn't talking about cunt. I don't think that is considered hateful, even in the US. The person I was replying to was making a very generalized statement
I don't really know, to be honest. But the way culture and language are intertwined, and how unnerving it is for people to be asked to adjust their lexicon, it concerns the heck out of me. Not book banning and burning levels of concerned, but in the same direction.
I dunno, I think we gain a better understanding of culture and history when we take a look at these words, their history and why they are hurtful, and decide to stop using them. Once you see things from the point of view of the people that have been called these things, it opens you up to be more empathetic.
Oh trust me, I've been called plenty of things, and have hurt for a great deal of my life as a result. I've also said awful things, and hurt even more for that.
I just think that separating people from parts of their language is more akin to a cultural lobotomy than anything else. Taking aspects of language from someone who does not truly understand why, will surely be jarring, and lead to negative reactions more often than not. I don't think this is going to have a long term positive effect, unless we take the slow road of working to understand each other, and truly embrace all diversity. If we condemn those who hurt us, it only acts to drive more of a wedge through our society.
Telling someone that their actions which are fundamental to their being are hurtful to you, and they need to change, is in fact hurtful to them. It's not their fault how they were raised, and how their experiences have shaped them, no matter how horrible someone might be. But if we embrace the diversity they add to society, and support them where we can, they just might come to see it for themselves, and strive to be better.
Only the individual can decide to change themself for the better. And even then, it's a life long journey, and often only minimal changes are possible. So, we should be celebrating the efforts they put forth, not condemning them for the things they don't have the capacity to change.
That is why you tell them why. "Hey, did you know that word is from the eugenics movement?" or "Hey here is why what you just said is racist." Saying that is akin to getting a part of your brain cut out is super extreme.
If using harmful words is fundamental to your being, you have a lot of other things to work on. Saying that you can't tell someone that they hurt you because it hurts them is some real victim blaming BS.
I never said it was, but they need to know what they do is harmful before they can start to unpack that.
No.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance
Very true, but the first step is knowing you need to change.
Yup, and long journeys start with a single step.
I would say sometimes, but what I find more true with the people I know, is that once the dam is broken, they start to look at the other things in their life that they can be better in and a cascade effect happens.
I think this is where the meat of the rub lies. Telling someone what they are doing is hurtful is not a condemnation. People tend to take it that way and get defensive, but even the best of us has some gaps in their knowledge. Especially in colonized parts of the world. Being made aware of them is not an insult. It means someone cares enough to bring it to your attention and thinks that you don't actually want to say harmful things, and they believe you want to be better.
Sorry for the wall of text, but there was a lot to unravel there.
https://youtu.be/CpzjPnDW1G4?si=tQyxm1jgi0O008t_
Link to a great video about the word.
you are on beehaw, so yes you probably should try not to offend people.
Careful, you could offend someone 😰
OFF TOPIC:
Speaking from a feminstic but also Australian position, I think it's kinda problematic to outright ban language internationally when the connotation of concern is specific to one culture. We use that word pretty liberally here, and it isn't done so with remotely the same definition; instead, it is typically used interchangeably with "dickhead" and "arsehole". Whilst I definitely support your efforts, I don't think this is the right way to go about it, as it's a very clear use of American exceptionalism when Americans, taken as a part of the world, make up a minority of people on the Internet.
ON TOPIC:
Yeahhhh, Elon both frightens and disgusts me. What a selfish twat.
Why is calling someone a cunt sexist but calling someone a dickhead not ?
If someone thinks one is sexist and not the other, they are a moron.
It's dumb to be offended by either in my opinion.
Probably because of the "you can't be sexist against males" standpoint
Shut up cunt
Thank your for your very interesting opinion.
Slur? That's not a slur. Fuck outta here with that
While I don't disagree with the general argument you're presenting, you must be pretty deep in those feminist circles to assume that you can just use an abbreviation like AFAB in casual conversation, and expect people to just understand what you're talking about.
You are right, I should not have assumed that.
And I should actually not have used this description, because vulvas are not exclusive to people Assigned Female At Birth, as another commenter pointed out.
It's obviously "all females are bastards."
So, serious question: why is "dick" okay and "cunt" is not? The former is much more common than the latter, both as an insult and (especially) as a reference to genitalia. While "cunt" is generally seen (in the US) as a more severely insulting word, it's also rarely used in reference to genitalia (in my experience as a cis male).
Language isn't logical, it's not governed by firm rules. It is, because that's how it developed over time. In 10, 20 or 50 years, this might change entirely.
I don't necessarily think either are great insults tbh and it'd be nice to see dick phased out.
It wouldn't be by that logic! Just nobody cares I guess
You have too much free time.
Thank your for your very interesting opinion.
Don't be a dick. Sorry for the slur
Thank your for your very interesting opinion.
Off-topic only, has nothing to do with the content related to CP2077 and the muskrat
So, based on some comments here, it looks like I came across as trying to ban language, to forbid words, to restrict your free speech.
As stated in my original post, this was and still is not my intention. I have not attacked personally the persones using "cunt", nor have I said no one should say that.
I just shared a reflexion, because that's why I sign up on social media platforms.
I am happy that some people felt safe enough in this community to explain why they think my views are incorrect, I actually learned some things thanks to you.
I'm not trying to ban the "cunt" word from language - and if I was, it would be so laughable to think I could have that kind of influence.
I just believe that the words we use have an effect on people. And I think it's worth it to sometimes pause and wonder which words we are using and if we can use better ones.
I'm not going to engage further on this topic in this channel, it's probably not the most appropriate space.
I appreciated your tone, it was measured and considerate.
A vagina is not exclusive to afab people. Post-op trans folks can gain and lose them.
You are absolutely right, I should have thought of it. Thanks for the correction !
Will keep in mind
The C word is not acceptable in Australia.
Cunts are just fine here. All my mates are cunts and all the cunts are mates
Instance checks out