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this post was submitted on 10 Sep 2023
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The legal grounds: The oil was shipped by a US company in violation of US law. American companies can't do business with an organisation that the US government has designated as a terrorist organisation. Thus American authorities siezed the ship and its cargo.
The legal grounds: it is ok when we do it. This is just old fashioned piracy, but of course you'll try to justify it.
The ship was not intercepted by the Navy. They served a court order on the company and the company turned the ship back and its cargo was seized
Why is this person getting upvotes for clearly lying. Empire Navigation is based in Greece. Here’s more info: Source.
But the company pleaded guilty...
Yes. And were fined. But that’s perfunctory so that they can make more money smuggling oil. The sanctions are solely enforced by the U.S., without consent of the UN.
Your own link argues against you:
"But the Suez Rajan case was unique at the time of the transfer because it was owned by the Los Angeles-based private equity firm Oaktree Capital Management. "
At the time the ship was being used for moving US sanctioned oil, it was own by a US company. That supports @NateNate60@lemmy.ml 's statements.
That is correct and why they could prosecute this case. But they have been seizing oil since 2019. And even if all those tankers were partially owned by US companies, it still doesn’t change the fact that this amounts to piracy. Defending international injustice with legalese doesn’t absolve what this is. When China seizes our tankers because the parts were made in China, will you defend them?
If the tankers or company is operating in the US, then they are bound by US laws no matter where they are in the world. A company can't benefit from the protection of the US government and laws at home only to go abroad to commit US crimes.
Many countries can use that justification. Why are you defending an act that you’d condemn if it was done to America?
You're really committed to the act, even after multiple people have pointed out your error in reading this situation. Kudos to you I guess?
It’s not an act. I care about this world I live in. I don’t debate to convince the people that disagree with me. I do it to show that those people don’t use logic and reason to decide their beliefs. They want the illusion of confirmation bias. I try to disrupt that illusion. We need to see the world from different perspectives.
I hate that "confirmation bias" have become moo words with people nowadays.
The logic is pretty sound:
I remark that sanctions do not require the approval of the United Nations. Under customary international law, it is an application of sovereign authority. Any country can apply sanctions and can do so in any way you like. What the USA has said is that "if you want to do business here, we forbid you from doing business with Iran".
I appreciate you going the distance with that guy. I don't think they changed their mind, nor do I think they have the capacity to. You certainly kept it on level for us in the peanut gallery though. Cheers!
You owe me $250 million for using the word “moo.” I sanctioned you 5 hours ago, without your knowledge or approval. You have to do what I want, because I have a bigger stick. I can make up whatever law or sanction I want, and you have to follow it or I’ll destroy your town. Pretzel logic. Call it confirmation bias or sucking your own dick, but that’s what is going on.
I wasn't aware that you were a sovereign state or that I had any money deposited in your banks or that I do business of any sort with you.
You can sanction me by putting a permanent embargo on conversing with me by blocking me if you want
It was an analogy. I don’t want to block you. I want to have an intelligent discussion about the merits of this act. But people just want to defend America despite its despotic acts. It makes me sad.
Wow you suddenly got so juvenile lmao
Trying to relate to the audience.
Logic - US said do not do that.
Reason - They did it.
If this has insulin, guns, food. You'd probably not care at all. This article would never be written.
America is not GOD.
Downvoters believe that America is indeed god. That is how far America's dick is down their throat.
It’s difficult when you first begin to realize that what you’ve been told is the truth your whole life is lie. It happened to me with the Iraq war and the PNAC report. I try to remain compassionate, because, as an American, I’ve been there. The truth sucks. It’s easier to believe the lies.
China tried to run illegal police stations in numerous countries.
And that has nothing to do with this story.
Neither does anything that you're arguing about.
china? is that you?
I’m an American that actually wants my country to act like the things it says it stands for.
Attack the person, if you can’t defend the argument. Be better.
I could not give less of a fuck what a people like you think or believe. Your "arguments" are born out of propaganda. Hell, half of your fucking posts I've seem were "this is written by a website based in a country I don't like", too bad truth is not written by propaganda websites you love to browse.
Go back to hexbear, grad, or whatever shithole you crawled out of, degenerate tankie scum
Impossible to take an insult from people like you, scatter insect
What a dolt.
The worlds largest terrorist state gets to dictate who is terrorist?
When you're running your company on US soil, yeah.
Yep. Anyone can do that, actually. I can declare you a terrorist. It's totally my right to do so, but the question is–so what? What am I going to do about it?
The US government has declared the Iranian organisation a terrorist organisation. What have they done about it?
The amount of outrage on this thread is just ignorant people learning how international geopolitics and the concept of absolute state sovereignty work for the first time. Yes, it is the case that big countries get to stick their fingers into the business of little countries. Yes, it is unfair. But that's how it is and that's how it's always gonna be for the foreseeable future. That's how it always has been for all of human history. From Ur to Rome to Vienna to London to Washington. From Chang'an to Beijing to Nanjing to Tokyo and now back to Beijing. In the next century maybe it will be some other country kicking around everyone else instead of the US. But I can practically guarantee that there will be kicking and there will be people continuing to complain about how unfair it is, because it is and always has been.
I'd like to say we should do better as a species, but in reality, what we have now is really fucking amazing compared to when Genghis Khan would come romping around town destroying your villages and murdering your people, or the Romans coming and demanding fifty talents of silver by sunset or else, or the Belgians planting rubber trees in your backyard.
Realpolitik go brrr
I am proud that America is finally doing something about this illegal oil trade. We have always turned a blind eye, and now we are actually forcing our hand to keep Iran from becoming a potential world-ending regime with no human rights for Iranians.
They wanna build nukes, I'm saying they'd also use them