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submitted 1 month ago by 8oow3291d@feddit.dk to c/world@lemmy.world

U.S. Vice President JD Vance said on April 14 that he is proud of Washington cutting off funding to Ukraine amid Russian aggression, listing it among the Trump administration's top achievements.

Speaking at a Turning Point USA event in Athens, Georgia, Vance recalled being confronted by a Ukrainian-American over his calls to halt funding for Ukraine.

"And this person got really agitated at me because I was saying we should stop funding the Ukraine war," Vance said.

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[-] TrickDacy@lemmy.world 9 points 1 month ago

Your analogy explicitly lays out the options and just whining about there not existing a third option does not change anything.

[-] Goodeye8@piefed.social 6 points 1 month ago

And there's no third option because anyone who falls out of line to demand more gets told to fall back in line. Case in point blaming the sitouts. They're sitting out because they don't want to get fucked and you're flaming them for not wanting a 6 inch dildo up their ass.

[-] AbidanYre@lemmy.world 8 points 1 month ago

If sitting out somehow resulted in a redo instead of the worse option winning, you'd have a point.

[-] Goodeye8@piefed.social 4 points 1 month ago

The point I'm making is that if the outcome of the vote doesn't really change anything for you then the vote itself is also meaningless. Let me use a different analogy. Let's say you don't like cheesecakes and you don't like chocolate brownies. What you do like is a nice Creme Brulee. If there's no option for a Creme brulee and you MUST choose between a cheesecake or a chocolate brownie does it really matter which one you get? You don't want either of them. So the choice is meaningless.

If this was a restaurant you'd say you don't want dessert and think to yourself what a shitty restaurant for not serving creme brulees. But because this is the American political system you think it's logical people shouldn't except a creme brulee and instead should be happy getting the cheesecake because they're allergic to chocolate.

[-] AbidanYre@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

You can cry about it all you want, but in the system we have right now one of two people was going to win and by not voting for Harris, you helped Trump win.

All your analogies are fucking awful, by the way. A better one here would have been your town has two restaurants, a Chinese place and an Italian place. But you want Mexican so you decide to just not eat. Even that is still flawed because you'll come up with some BS answer like "I'll cook at home" to sidestep the problem.

And if you think invading fucking Michigan and starting a war in Iraq after mass pardoning a bunch of insurrectionists (some of whom have since faced charges of child molestation) in addition to all the other horrendous shit Trump is doing is somehow not different from a milquetoast establishment candidate who would have maintained the status quo, then I don't think there's a sensible discussion to be had.

[-] Goodeye8@piefed.social 3 points 1 month ago

What do you think the status quo is? Are you happy with where America was heading to when Trump wasn't in power? Is the slow crawl into a dystopian hellscape really what you want? That's the problem with the milquetoast status quo maintainer. A milquetoast establishment candidate does nothing but kick the can down the road. If Harris had won you wouldn't be having ICE storming Michigan in 2025 and 2026, you'd get it in 2029 or 2030 when Trump or his successor (not JD Vance) would get into power. And if it's not then it's going to be the next presidency. The things Trump does right now are not relevant to the discussion because if the votes went a different way those things would just happen at a later date. They're an inevitability in the current US political climate.

As long as nothing is done to improve the material conditions of the American people you will always have the door open for fascism. Since the establishment democrats are not interested in improving the material conditions in any significant capacity all they're doing is paving the way for fascism. As people get desperate about their material condition they will start looking for ways to improve your life and those are the exact heartstrings Trump pulled to get the win in 2024. And even if you see through the lies Trump told you're still left with the choice of kicking the can and letting things slowly get worse or succumb to the apathy and just let things happen. There's only so many times you can kick the can until you think "what's the point?". Or worse you become so desperate that fascism starts to make sense.

The only way to prevent that from happening isn't to vote for the milquetoast establishment candidate. It's to build a new party, one that is representing the people not the corporations. And if that's not possible then prepare for the collapse of the empire and hope you live in a state that gets its shit together. Or you know, just dismiss me as a dumbfuck and go on with your day. At the end of the day if you're an American you're going to be the one living through the collapse. I just hope the rest of the world detaches from America before it happens so we can view things from afar.

[-] prole 3 points 1 month ago

And there's no third option because anyone who falls out of line to demand more gets told to fall back in line.

This isn't happening though. They're told to vote in fucking primaries.

[-] Goodeye8@piefed.social 6 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

What primary happened in 2024? Also how did it work out in 2016 when Bernie was running and the party was effectively sabotaging him by backing Clinton instead.

[-] prole 4 points 1 month ago
[-] Goodeye8@piefed.social 5 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Oh right. I forgot it actually happened because it was such a sham it might as well have not happened. That primary was the equivalent of a democratic election in Russia, which is to say the outcome was predetermined and the rest was just getting the apparatus to show that outcome. If you truly believe that primary would've changed anything you're delusional.

Edit: I'll also add that the "vote blue no matter who" pretty quickly went to running Cuomo as an independent instead of giving full support to the primary winner, Mamdani. All the slogans of unity and standing together apply only when it's the candidate the establishment wants.

[-] prole 3 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Edit: I'll also add that the "vote blue no matter who"

Who are you even talking to? Talk about false dichotomy

[-] Goodeye8@piefed.social 1 points 1 month ago

I brought it up as further proof that the primaries don't really matter because the primary doesn't exists as a method of finding the best democrat candidate, it exists as a tool of conformity to squash dissent against the establishment candidate. The "Vote blue no matter who" is the slogan used after the primary to tell people to put their differences aside and vote for the candidate who won the primary. But clearly the "no matter who" part has a secret addendum, it's actually "no matter who as long as it's the establishment candidate".

Had Mamdani lost the primary and ran as an independent the establishment democrats would've been up in arms about him sabotaging the chances of the primary winner, who in this case would be Cuomo. But because Mamdani won there's no outrage from the establishment about Cuomo running as an independent and getting backed by democrats, because that's who the establishment wanted to win in the first place. Basically Mamdani had to beat the establishment candidate twice because there's a double standard in place.

this post was submitted on 16 Apr 2026
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