Fears? I'm excited that these jobs where people are treated like machines until they quit for sanity's sake are getting automated.
Exactly! It seems the other people in comments here don't understand that this is just a net positive for workers!
You already have universal basic income where you guys are living ? Failing that it’s solely less low qualification jobs and more concentration of revenues for the few above. I don’t see that as « a net positive » -although semantically, those laid off would not be workers anymore so in that you’re right. Horrifically so.
UBI is necessary for this to be positive, so that's our problem. Not the machines taking the job.
Don't throw shit at this, throw it at politicians.
And yet you cheer on the loss of jobs and hand wave away issues as someone else's problem. That makes you part of the problem as the side cheering on the destruction of people's lives. Seriously how do you "workless utopia" fuckwits not see this?
I know how actually: you don't work these jobs and it will make you feel better about your demand for more and excessive consumption because "well at least it didn't hurt a human" but it does and will. You speak from an ivory tower and say it will be good when you hear less screams from below without caring for how the screaming stops.
I actually just want UBI so every single working class can get the basic needs instead of the rich getting richer.
I'm pretty sure I'm in the ground, and not in a tower with this opinion.
Sure but right now that isn't happening and robotics dismantling jobs destroying income is real. We are focusing on idealism and not reality.
Wanting it is fine but advocating that it's the only solution right now is not.
It's a net positive if those people are able to transition into other roles/ jobs.
What a short-sighted view. Some people sacrifice themselves to be treated like machine because that's the only option for them to. earn a living. You take the job away from them, they'll end up on the street. I fear for them.
We need to find a better ways for them not to be treated badly, not ways where they'll end up badly.
How did we get to a place where awful jobs are the only ones available for people to take? How does holding back the use of technology to keep these awful jobs around help those who are worn out and tossed aside in the long run?
There's a difference between being idealistic and quixotic. With the introduction of machanization, the problem is not unemployment due to not enough jobs but there won't be any job at all. The real question is how to accommodate these people when there won't any job for them? The seemingly scary solution is this current real capitalist world is to leave them on the street. Unless you can provide the better solution to this real world problem, I suggest to keep your utopian world in your dream.
Just head up: the future is scary for the next generation inline. Even the white collar job won't be spared.
Oh I know!
Let them build more homes, big neighbourhoods of high-density living spaces. And give them for free to everyone.
Then focus energy on growing and distributing enough food.
While we're at it, give everyone healthcare.
Then watch those 'unemployed' people generate 'value' like we've never seen.
Housed fed healthy people will have great ideas and all the time to implement them.
Automation moves our society forward.
It's been happening since the industrial revolution.
When electricity was becoming widespread people feared for the lamp lighters. When the automobile was invented people feared for the farriers.
Jobs will be created in new spaces. That is how it has worked in the past. This is at a level that we younger folk haven't seen. It can be scary to some. I also won't deny this will happen at a faster pace than most other changes.
The genie is out of the bottle.
Your likely know everything I've said up to this point. Here's where we differ.
Most businesses in developed countries revolve around selling things to the middle class. Those businesses that don't directly, usually play a role to that end. Without a middle class to sell things to very few businesses will exist. If you don't believe me, browse the fortune 500 list. The Fords, GEs, Home Depots all depends on a middle class.
Philosophically, if the middle class ceases to exist were fucked. If it gets to a point where ford is failing (again) those people with political influence will be asking for ubi. We don't need to stress over this. I have no political influence. I can't call in favors with senators. Over half the country is opposed to ubi. Let it play out a little. See what happens. We'll get through this.
Any company that doesn't automate will eventually get priced out. People are just too expensive compared to robots. We're smack dab in the midst of a technological revolution and just like the industrial revolution the job-scape is about to change rapidly and radically.
Automation is not the point of argument. That going to happens no matter what. In fact I touch about it in my other comment.
The point to ponder is how to address the impact of automation. As far as I know even without full automation, the US (and many other capitalism based) don't have a good record to address the difficulty faced by low skilled workers, e.g. depicted by Nomadland. To simply give utopian solution won't address the issue and would be premature.
Unless we are talking about Scandinavian countries (socialism system), that's a whole different issue.
There are so many factors at play right now and they're all changing so fast that it's hard to even guess at what strategy might be beneficial. AI development and automated manufacturing could theoretically bring down the costs of making in America to the point where American companies bring manufacturing back to the States again. On the other hand it could exasperate the rust belt trend that killed many Midwest cities.
I think in the short term it's going to be pretty bad for unskilled labor and it already has been pretty bad especially in certain areas of the country like west Virginia. The problem is all of Scandinavia has a population lower than California's let alone the entire US. It's amazingly easier to adapt when you have a small densely populated populous. Wyoming has a population density of 6 people per square mile.
Only time will tell but if Congress's current misadventures is telling at all I'm not overly optimistic.
Weren't these jobs like, feared already cause they treat you less like a machine, they treated you like shit to the point youd have a good chance that you have to step over a dead body eventually?
Their turnover rate is ridiculously high and supply chains as an industry have been steadily moving towards automation. Robots are going to keep replacing unloaders, loaders, and pickers just as AI is going to start replacing buyers and dispatchers in the near future.
I worked for FedEx and it seems to me that Amazon didn't start this practice which is why it's confusing to me why they get the spotlight, it's just industry standard it seems (Amazon, FedEx, and UPS)
The place I work at had a 400% turnover rate for the 90 day period. Luckily I've seen other places and it doesn't seem like its a company wide thing, but a location to location issue. They pay higher than minimum wage as a standard, but that still didn't entice me or others to continue working there because of how much labor vs pay it is. Plus the stress of angry managers doesn't help it at all.
That's an important point. A lot of these places can't find or keep people even when they pay rather well. A few years ago an old neighbor of mine got a job at (I'm pretty sure) UPS and it paid well but the work just wasn't worth it and he quit and took a pay cut to have significantly less stressful job. To be fair he had a pretty bad back that caused him a lot of pain.
I honestly don’t know what to think. Yes, people need jobs, but more importantly, they need GOOD jobs. Amazon treats people terribly and, even at their best, does the bare minimum to comply with the law and keep their warehouses staffed.
Employees are being taken advantage of. Getting people out of there might be a net positive.
We need protections for those workers (i.e. UBI, et al) BEFORE they lose their jobs to capitalist dreams, preferably funded by the capitalists.
I 100% agree with this, and that's why I can't see robots taking job as bad news.
The problem is with the society. We need to build it better, so these advantages are for us - not for some scummy rich guy.
On another note: nobody should be a billionaire.
As it stands right now, we need those workers to be out of jobs and on the streets for protections to be considered. Otherwise "they have jobs," unemployment is low and the machine is "working as expected." Therefore nothing needs to be done.
If Amazon doesn't need employees then they don't need tax breaks. In fact add a new tax for any business that switches to robot labor. They can pay the missing personal wages in taxes. Texas makes electric car drivers pay more for not using gas, this seems like the same thing.
This is why any politicians say they are bringing back the manufacturing jobs back to “US” “Japan” “Germany” or whatever are extremely dumb.
If you are worried about your amazon job you need to join a government program that will train you for a better job. Amazon sucks to work for and you deserve better.
Why do they need a humanoid robot to move an empty box from one conveyor belt to the other? They could have made a conveyor belt or robot arm instead.
Whatever. I'm glad no human is needed to waste their life doing that shit job.
That’s not what these robots are doing. They are picking items out of bins, verifying them, and packing them into totes which will be put on a conveyor. A conveyor is good for moving boxes or totes, but that’s about it. It does really poorly with small items, large items, irregular shapes, and especially anything in a bag.
That’s not what these robots are doing. They are picking items out of bins, verifying them, and packing them into totes which will be put on a conveyor. A conveyor is good for moving boxes or totes, but that’s about it. It does really poorly with small items, large items, irregular shapes, and especially anything in a bag.
This guy Material Handlings. Handles Material? Does Material Handling?
I’ve heard “material handles” and “handles materials,” but you are correct. I this-guy it hard.
You think this is the only job they will ever do? They gotta start somewhere.
The big reason corporations are using robots instead of human labor is because people either don't want to work or can't hold a position.
The turnover rate is actually insane in these positions; enough so that they would rather spend more paying a technician to set up an automated cell with robots, PLC's, pneumatic slides, ect.
It's sad af but don't blame the robots or the technicians, this is not their fault.
The turnover rate at companies like Amazon is so high because the working conditions are so poor and demanding. People are just liabilities and expenses that should be burned through.
Amazon has burned through so many employees that they worry they will not have enough viable applicants to keep filling positions. That isn’t because of the workers, that is a calculated decision by management.
https://www.essence.com/news/amazon-burning-through-workers/
There is no need to a shill and push right wing talking points for corporations, they get plenty of help from the politicians and news networks they buy.
This take is so horrible - you are the first person i ever blocked in my life
I have to admit I've never heard anyone read a high attrition rate and then put the blame on the workers. I really, really, hope this person isn't in any position to make decisions in an organization.
It's amazing how they disregard the absolute shit working conditions Amazon warehouse jobs have, that can't totally be why they have a high turnover rate right?
Nobody ever considers the feelings of the poor corporations! It's all the fault of those mealy-mouthed... sneers ... humans! With their "I'm tired" and "I need to eat food" and "I need to go to the bathroom." How is that productive or efficient? How does that contribute to shareholder value?
/s
The big reason corporations are using robots instead of human labor is because people either don’t want to work or can’t hold a position.
For some reason, people aren't big fans of timed bathroom breaks and monitored smalltalk.
I work in this industry, and you couldn’t be more wrong. The turnover rate is so high because the job is incredibly demanding, working conditions are usually horrible, and the pay is absolute shit.
What are your other hot takes? Trump won the election? The "lizard people" control the media? Slavery was beneficial to black people?
This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.
