96
Kubuntu 25.10 Drops X11 Session for Wayland-Only Install (www.omgubuntu.co.uk)
submitted 4 days ago by tonytins@pawb.social to c/linux@lemmy.world
28 comments fedilink hide all child comments
top 28 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[-] lambalicious@lemmy.sdf.org 9 points 4 days ago

On the one hand that means future Kubuntus (for a while) won't have remote desktop, remote UI commands, global hotkeys, nor other such useful features. Or, heck, won't have accessibility. On the other hand, from the progress I've seen KDE are among the better positioned to change that, so who knows. Prepping for a Kubuntu LTS?

~~On the third hand, it's still Ubuntu. The Wayland fixes are probably going to be shipped as snaps for the Pro version.~~

[-] domi@lemmy.secnd.me 10 points 4 days ago

KDE already has remote desktop and global shortcuts implemented. It's applications that are lacking proper Wayland support.

[-] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 1 points 3 days ago

The remote desktop is only RDP and VNC with the built in server.

There is no API for easily starting or managing a desktop session

[-] lime@feddit.nu 8 points 4 days ago

the problem now is that while kde and gnome do have most of those things on wayland, it's all bespoke. there are no universal wayland remote desktop systems or accessibility pushes, just "the gnome one" and "the kde one".

it's fragmenting the desktop.

[-] UnityDevice@lemmy.zip 7 points 4 days ago

it's all bespoke

Unfortunately, that's by design. Mir was the display server that tried to combat that exact problem, and we burned it at the stake.

[-] lambalicious@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 2 days ago

, and we burned it at the stake.

Gotta love that about FOSS communities. Every time someone tries to do something interesting, we burn them at the stake. It's a classic of the Mozilla fandom, for example.

[-] UnityDevice@lemmy.zip 2 points 1 day ago

Ironically, everyone hated it because they thought it would cause fragmentation.

[-] lambalicious@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 4 days ago

That has always been my main criticism about wayland: it's actually vaporware.

It's just a spec (and not even a complete one) that says "now, you go do our work and implement all this". So everyone has to go and do their own thing, which is the usual big corpo strategy to kill small corpo and/or FOSS. So I wonder why don't people see it. Pulseaudio, wayland, systemd, all came in at about the same time as the "microsoftism" infection in Linux development.

From what I recall, for the first 5-or-so years there was not even a reference implementation (and I don't know if that is still the case, but do would expect it is).

[-] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 3 points 3 days ago

I don't see how Wayland could be "antifoss." It is literally controlled by the major desktops. For smaller projects there are libraries that do the heavy lifting.

The major benefit is that the performance us much better since you don't have a bloated display server that has decades worth of bad code.

[-] lime@feddit.nu 3 points 4 days ago

i think weston is the reference implementation, but i don't know if it's usable

[-] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 2 points 3 days ago

It is "usable"

Not a great experience but it does work. Honestly I don't know why it exists at this point. It is holding back Wayland in a lot of cases and they are sluggish to implement anything.

[-] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 1 points 3 days ago

What we need is a remote session API

I don't see that happening though

[-] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 3 points 3 days ago

KDE does have remote desktop support

[-] tonytins@pawb.social 2 points 4 days ago

This is going to be an interesting shake up, to say the least.

[-] kuneho@lemmy.world 7 points 4 days ago

Thing is, there's no real software KVM (or rather KM) solution for Wayland. Barrier (and the others) works only on X11.

It's a minor thing, but unfortunately major enough for me to be unable to switch to Wayland at all.

Completely dropping X11 sounds a nightmare in my case. I'm not against dropping X11, if Wayland proves to be a better alternative. But not with "holes" like this. :c

[-] mizule 6 points 4 days ago

i mean you can always reinstall the x11 session, this is just distro's dropping their x11 install by default

[-] kuneho@lemmy.world 1 points 2 days ago

well, that's true.

[-] GolfNovemberUniform@infosec.pub 3 points 4 days ago

Rest in peace Kubuntu.

[-] semperverus@lemmy.world 17 points 4 days ago

73% of plasma 6 installs with telemetry enabled are using Wayland

I think that the fantasy of X11 sticking around forever is sweet, but the writing is on the wall.

[-] vrighter@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 4 days ago

25% of users sticking with X11 is a very significant amount. which roughly means wayland does not account for the needs of a quarter of its (hostilely taken over, now) userbase

[-] semperverus@lemmy.world 6 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

Those users can stick with the last version of KDE or GNOME that supports X11. They're insisting on using unmaintained software already, so it shouldn't be much of a leap to do the same with the DE.

It's really not fair to demand that people building your DE for free maintain two vastly different rendering stacks when they clearly don't want to.

[-] lime@feddit.nu 5 points 4 days ago

is it really "insisting" when there is no alternative for your use case?

[-] semperverus@lemmy.world 2 points 4 days ago

That's the thing though, there are alternatives now. They just take more discovery and setup time than most are used to.

[-] vrighter@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 4 days ago

the word insisting shows your arrogance. Insisting on something implies one has a choice. Those who are sticking with X11 are doing so because wayland just does not do what they need.

[-] semperverus@lemmy.world 2 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

If it's not insisting, it's demanding, which is worse.

There are many tools now that replace X11 behavior. If Wayland doesn't "do what they need", at this point there's a strong chance they have not put in any effort into making it work for them.

For desktop forwarding there's waypipe.

For tablet users, KDE (And probably gnome) have pretty good tablet support at this point.

For artists, KDE JUST got much better color calibration and HDR support.

For gamers, WINE now has an experimental Wayland-native mode, and barring that we have Gamescope to make it behave semi-native (so this one is more of a future-ish solution that you can use now).

Screen recording mostly just works with pipewire and almost everything supports it now including Discord.

Etc.

[-] communist@lemmy.frozeninferno.xyz 3 points 4 days ago

Not factoring in distros that haven't switched the default like steamos

[-] GolfNovemberUniform@infosec.pub 1 points 4 days ago

As I said in another post, 73% is too low.

[-] semperverus@lemmy.world 5 points 4 days ago

You can say it in as many posts as you like, that doesn't make you right.

this post was submitted on 22 Jun 2025
96 points (100.0% liked)

Linux

11450 readers
170 users here now

Welcome to c/linux!

Welcome to our thriving Linux community! Whether you're a seasoned Linux enthusiast or just starting your journey, we're excited to have you here. Explore, learn, and collaborate with like-minded individuals who share a passion for open-source software and the endless possibilities it offers. Together, let's dive into the world of Linux and embrace the power of freedom, customization, and innovation. Enjoy your stay and feel free to join the vibrant discussions that await you!

Rules:

  1. Stay on topic: Posts and discussions should be related to Linux, open source software, and related technologies.

  2. Be respectful: Treat fellow community members with respect and courtesy.

  3. Quality over quantity: Share informative and thought-provoking content.

  4. No spam or self-promotion: Avoid excessive self-promotion or spamming.

  5. No NSFW adult content

  6. Follow general lemmy guidelines.

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
MigratingtoLemmy@lemmy.world