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Admin of VTC praises Hamas (lemmy.ca)

submitted 3 months ago by Sunshine@lemmy.ca to c/meanwhileongrad@sh.itjust.works

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[+] throwawayacc0430@sh.itjust.works 75 points 3 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

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[-] Eldritch@lemmy.world 72 points 3 months ago

Literally. Hamas has done basically nothing to help the people. The people of Gaza are the heroes Hamas and Israel are just a couple of monsters victimizing them.

[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 24 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

If Fatah was still in power, Israel would’ve had a much more difficult time in demonizing Gaza in their propaganda outlets.

[-] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 16 points 3 months ago

They also wouldn't need to, because the West wouldn't give a shit about Gaza without Hamas activities to put Palestine in the news. There's a reason Hamas won that election in 2006.

[-] BrokenGlepnir@lemmy.world 11 points 3 months ago

Israel giving them money?

[-] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 6 points 3 months ago

I'm pretty sure that was after 2006. Leading up to the 2006 elections Hamas highlighted the success of violent resistance in ejecting Israel from Gaza compared to the abject failure of peaceful resistance by Fatah. My point here is that despite their many flaws, they actually get things done, and their getting things done is a large part of why the Palestinian cause has gotten as far as it has.

[-] Syntha@sh.itjust.works 2 points 3 months ago

My point here is that despite their many flaws, they actually get things done, and their getting things done is a large part of why the Palestinian cause has gotten as far as it has.

Holy delusion. There has been no worse time for the Palestinian cause than now. They've been losing for 80 years again and again, and you call it success.

[-] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 3 points 3 months ago

Uh... enjoy. The Palestinian cause is doing pretty well... other than the genocide, anyway.

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[-] bathing_in_bismuth@sh.itjust.works 15 points 3 months ago

No you are supposed to PICK A SIDE. Don't you dare think for yourself /s

[-] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 14 points 3 months ago

Literally. Hamas has done basically nothing to help the people.

Not directly, but it's no coincidence that the Palestine solidarity movement only expands after Israel uses Hamas as an excuse to slaughter Gazans. Since at least 2006 Hamas has been a very important catalyst for the advancement of the Palestinian cause (which isn't mutually exclusive with them being massive pricks, that's also true).

[-] Eldritch@lemmy.world 9 points 3 months ago

That's like a Make-a-Wish kid thanking cancer for making them famous Etc. I think most Make-a-Wish kids would just wish that they didn't have cancer. Hamas has literally done nothing for the Palestinians since they managed to gain power. Just make things worse while working in cahoots with Israel.

[-] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 4 points 3 months ago

I think most Make-a-Wish kids would just wish that they didn't have cancer.

True, but the cancer in this analogy is Israel, which exists in both scenarios.

Hamas has literally done nothing for the Palestinians since they managed to gain power. Just make things worse while working in cahoots with Israel.

In what way did you expect things to get better for Palestinians? I mean I'm not defending Hamas's tyranny in Gaza, but there's a very clear limit to how possible it is to improve things even with the best of intentions (which Hamas doesn't have, to be clear). After the Second Intifada Israel blockaded Gaza, the Quarter (aka almost literally everyone) imposed sanctions on Palestine, Fatah launched a coup with US backing and Israel and Egypt used that as an excuse to impose the much harsher blockade that was in place until 2023. The only way for anything to get better under these conditions is to change the situation that created them, aka the Israeli occupation, and this is one thing Hamas has been successful at. To borrow your Make-a-Wish analogy, the hope is that becoming famous might lead to the kids getting treatment rather than whips.

[-] Eldritch@lemmy.world 3 points 3 months ago

I never implied wasn't a cancer. But this situation is like cheering for a brain tumor to kill a patient first before the colon cancer does. When the Palestinian people who are the patient in this analogy are just being ravaged from both ends.

As long as the genocidal Zionist who founded Israel are still in charge of Israel, and as long as they largely have Western support. There is zero militarily, Hama's can do to make the lives of Palestinians better. Does that mean they shouldn't fight back? No. But let me ask you this. Can you point to any public works, aid or assistance to the Palestinian people by Hamas? Has hamas as a government behaved as a government. Or have they only ever largely waged war? Genuine question.

I get it, the PLO accomplished very little for the Palestinians as well. That's how Hamas gained power. Hamas existing, doesn't justify Hamas existing. What have they done for the palestinians? And why shouldn't they be cast aside as other groups were. The main reason they haven't been. Is because they would kill the very Palestinians that would do it. The very Palestinians they claim to be fighting for.

[-] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 3 points 3 months ago

As long as the genocidal Zionist who founded Israel are still in charge of Israel, and as long as they largely have Western support. There is zero militarily, Hama's can do to make the lives of Palestinians better.

In the short term no, but in the long term? There very much is. The staggering growth of the Palestinian solidarity movement over the last 20 years has been and remains to be a massive threat to Israel's long-term continued existence via initiatives such as BDS, and the countdown on their demise really started with October 7th. It's easy to lose sight of this given that Gazans are currently victims of genocide (which, well, yeah our focus should be on the genocide) but this is big. If Gaza somehow survives this genocide, Hamas will have both mass death and destruction and a massive, conflict-shaping accomplishment under their belt. Not saying the genocide is a good thing; of course it's horrible, but when history books are trying to explain how Palestinians got their freedom (or died trying), half the text is going to be "Hamas did this so Israel did that and their popularity with their most ardent supporters plunged again."

Can you point to any public works, aid or assistance to the Palestinian people by Hamas? Has hamas as a government behaved as a government. Or have they only ever largely waged war? Genuine question.

I'm not sure it's possible or preferable for Hamas to build public works since they would almost immediately be bombed to oblivion, but they do a lot of the other stuff. They're definitely pretty corrupt, though.

That's how Hamas gained power. Hamas existing, doesn't justify Hamas existing. What have they done for the palestinians? And why shouldn't they be cast aside as other groups were.

Don't get me wrong I'm not defending Hamas's role as the leading Palestinian resistance organization; I would shed exactly zero tears if they were overthrown tomorrow. Nothing they're doing justifies the way they run Gaza, but that's one thing and the idea that they've done nothing to make Palestinians' lives better is another.

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[-] goodeye8@fedia.io 10 points 3 months ago

Do you think the average westerner is aware of what is happening in the West Bank?

Do you think the average westerner would be aware of what is happening in Gaza if Hamas wasn't retaliating against Isreal?

I don't condone what Hamas is doing, but I'm not going to be so naive to believe the western world would give a shit about Palestine if not for Hamas putting a spotlight on Gaza. We probably wouldn't even be having this discussion without Hamas, we (in the collective sense) would be letting Isreal annex Palestinian lands with minimal criticism.

[-] Eldritch@lemmy.world 8 points 3 months ago

Most don't know even with what Hamas is doing. Which is mostly hurting the people they're supposed to represent. Most Palestinians dislike Hamas as much as anyone else. They just can't do anything about it.

[-] goodeye8@fedia.io 5 points 3 months ago

You said Hamas has done nothing to help the people. Is getting more privileges in the eyes of the UN not help? Palestine got more rights due to the Gaza war, which Hamas started. Like I said, I don't condone their actions, but their actions do end up putting Israeli atrocities in the forefront which ultimately leads to more people turning against Israel. I wouldn't be surprised if some Palestinians are against Hamas. They're a necessary evil that should be purged as soon as Israel stops trying to eradicate Palestine, but as long as Israel is oppressing Palestine Hamas is necessary if for no other purpose than to draw global attention on Palestine.

If you want Gaza to be like the West Bank then they might as well just roll over and die.

[-] Eldritch@lemmy.world 4 points 3 months ago

Is it? Honest question. In general I support the idea of the UN and the spirit of it. What good is it?

[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 9 points 3 months ago

Shouldn’t call them “heroes”…

[-] einfach_orangensaft@sh.itjust.works 27 points 3 months ago

ngl probably russians, spewing hate online to further conflictand

[-] OmegaLemmy@discuss.online 4 points 3 months ago

Russia supports israel

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[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 16 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Of course he engages in name calling. He thinks I care much more about his community than I really do. I haven’t checked on VTC for weeks.

[-] neons@lemmy.dbzer0.com 12 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

lmao I wonder who this one single downvote may be

what a pathetic islamist 🤣

[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 11 points 3 months ago

In his words, a single downvote would be declared “vote manipulation”.

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[-] qaz@lemmy.world 15 points 3 months ago

It's always that guy

[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 11 points 3 months ago

I pay extra attention to him because his instance is the only active vegan one.

[-] njm1314@lemmy.world 10 points 3 months ago

Man I don't care what anyone says nothing's going to redeem that fascist loving instance.

[-] licheas@sh.itjust.works 5 points 3 months ago

I dunno... maybe a few server fires?

how many servers do they have?

[-] Draconic_NEO@sh.itjust.works 3 points 3 months ago

Too bad you're on lemmy.world and they don't federate with your server. You could DMCA your own comments on their server and claim you don't agree to their TOS. That can sometimes get the host or registrar to take the site down.

(This is legal, you OWN the copyright to the things you write, and your instance TOS only guarantees they have the right to host it, it doesn't guarantee anyone else that right.)

[-] Draconic_NEO@sh.itjust.works 10 points 3 months ago

I almost forgot about Vegantheoryclub.org I remember controversy about them with !vegan@lemmy.world where one of the mods of that community was also an admin on there or had ties to the admin there and was using it to ban anyone who criticized her or downvoted her. She was posting a ton of reactionary content (some of which was misinformation) and even tried to ban LW admins from the community. They eventually booted her and she tried to use alts to add herself back but ended up getting all of them booted and then used an alt to try and create more drama.

Yeah I strongly recommend people stay away from vegantheoryclub, they're not a good instance. Their admin clearly has problems.

[-] Rose@lemmy.zip 2 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

I think you're mixing things up. Beaver was not among the [!vegan@lemmy.world](/c/vegan@lemmy.world) mods who fought against the .world admin Rooki's interference in the community based on his personal beliefs and made-up rules. Beaver just briefly participated in some of the related discussions. Then long after the incident, she posted memes (which I don't believe were reactionary if you mean right-wing), including some that mocked it. A new mod of the .world vegan community called her out for that and for allegedly banning people too eagerly and removed her as a mod. None of it involved the VTC instance. Slrpnk has a decent summary of the events. There are reasons to believe that Beaver is an old account of the OP (Sunshine).

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[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 8 points 3 months ago

Could’ve left that part out…

[-] Fleur_@aussie.zone 8 points 3 months ago

To be fair genocide is vegan

[-] untakenusername@sh.itjust.works 5 points 3 months ago

c/brandnewsentence

[-] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 2 points 3 months ago

Makes sense

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[-] AllNewTypeFace@leminal.space 8 points 3 months ago

Are the Haredi the ones who believe that Israel cannot exist before the Messiah comes?

[-] RowRowRowYourBot@sh.itjust.works 11 points 3 months ago

Yes, nothing this person is saying is crazy if you understand the context of their sect's belief.

[-] Crashumbc@lemmy.world 6 points 3 months ago

Just because you understand it doesn't mean it's not crazy...

[-] OmegaLemmy@discuss.online 6 points 3 months ago

You would call the polish uprising in ww2 as bad as Hamas if it happened today

[-] vxx@lemmy.world 9 points 3 months ago

Did they use polish children as meat shields? Did they rape woman and dragged them through the streets?

[-] OmegaLemmy@discuss.online 8 points 3 months ago

Use of 'meat shields' is propaganda, Israel says that Hamas is using civilian infrastructure to store weapons and Israel labels that as using meat shields, they continue to bomb civilian infrastructure anyway
This is exaggerated but has happened unfortunately, but not under Hamas command, Israel capitalised on this tragedy by using it as propaganda to fuel anti-palestinian efforts, including false reports, not allowing independent journalism and even the example you gave, which was also false and was actually a phone taken in Syria of Kurdish Fighters

I don't know if you'll approach this in good will, but it is fully to the benefit for Israel for these to be true, and they have capitalised heavy upon it

Hamas and PLO is the only two forces in Gaza that can even push back on the genocide, and idealism that you could continue opposition just by removing Hamas is wrong, as Israel inherently wants to integrate Palestinian lands thoroughly, not solve the issues present, and will demonize any new Palestinian entity if it ever comes into existence

[-] Volcanna@sh.itjust.works 4 points 3 months ago

The IDF has literally used meat shields (and children meatshields) and raped women (and children), as reported on multiple occasions in the past year alone.

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[-] ryedaft@sh.itjust.works 2 points 3 months ago

Did I understand Gaza correctly that they elected Hamas but then Gaza hasn't had an election since, like, 2006? But the government keeps on ticking, trying to build hospitals, schools, have a health department and so on? Sounds like they have really stand up public servants to be honest.

But it's irrelevant who the government is because Israel will never acknowledge any Palestinian state?

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this post was submitted on 18 May 2025

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