How Does the NCR Manufacture Their Armor? (lemmy.blahaj.zone)

submitted 1 month ago by rosahaj to c/fallout@lemmy.world

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I've been wondering this for a while, but how does the NCR manufacture their armor, and what materials are used in it's construction? The NCR's economy seems largely backed by expansion and the brahmin industry, with a decent manufacturing industry as represented by the Gun Runners, likely using salvage rather than extraction for resources like steel. So that makes me wonder the question then, since the NCR's trooper (and patrol ranger) armors are clearly produced by the Republic, what textiles do they use to produce these? Additionally, are the armoring over the fatigues steel woven into a carrier, or maybe some kind of layered leather? What do you think?

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[-] PugJesus@lemmy.world 15 points 1 month ago

It has a DT of 10, literally no better than leather armor, so clearly whatever metal the breastplate is using is trash quality

[-] rosahaj 8 points 1 month ago

It also only covers about 25% of the torso, so it could simply be that it's not very complete coverage despite it's construction.

[-] wizardbeard@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Y'all are forgetting about all the developed post-post apocalypse stuff from Fallout 1 and (moreso) 2. The capital of NCR territory, Shady Sands, is a legitimate (not-bethesda modern fallout style) city with farms, factories, schools, hospitals, scientists researching and developing shit, local government, etc. Estimated population of 35,000 around the time of NV.

None of the 3D games have come remotely close to showing that type of post-post apoc civilization.

The area covered in New Vegas is effectively the frontier of their civilization. The unification monument is in honor of the over extended NCR rangers, too far from home and their government's resources, signing a peace treaty and making a strategic alliance with the existing Arizona Rangers. This extended NCR territory into Nevada as the additional AR troops were able to give them enough local manpower and supplies to just be able to barely hold the line against Caesar's legion at the first battle of the dam.

So the NCR territory shown in game is absolutely an American Western Frontier analogue complete with ~~cattle~~ brahmin barons, and ~~natives~~ Great Khans, but it's entirely possible for them to have brand new equipment being manufactured from new material "back home" so to speak. It would just be a logistics issue of getting all the way out to the front lines of the game.

[-] rosahaj 5 points 1 month ago

no, this is exactly what I wanted to discuss. I know the NCR is a full on nation, like the USA of old, but I wanted to discuss the logistics of their manufacturjng processes. would they have mines and quarries for raw metals? Likely not, as there's enough already extracted for salvage. this post is mostly for speculation. I fully believe that the ncr manufactures the fatigues from scratch, but with what material? surely not cotton given their water problems. I also just can't quite decide what their breastplates are shielded with. I wanted for this to be a space where people could speculate on the theoretical industries and manufacturing processes of the NCR, not a refusal to see that they exist.

I for one am a Pittsburgh truther, and believe that the NCR has exported all their industry to Ashur. /j

[-] nesc@lemmy.cafe 2 points 1 month ago

It's two hundred years from the war, it would be really hard to salvage steel with it being exposed fot this long.

They probably started with scavenging but moved to mining it. Even depleted mines usually contain enough material it's just can't be used due to small volume, but when your whole nation is 1-2 million people it will work.

They can make fabrics from whool, or nettle or any native local plant.

[-] rosahaj 2 points 4 weeks ago

Somehow I hadn't considred steel degradation, though I suppose it makes sense. I assumed salvage would be a good pathway since a lot of the work extracting it from the Earth is done for you, but I am absolutely in love with the idea of the NCR bringing old mines back into operation, I must admit.

[+] fxomt@lemm.ee 6 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

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[-] rosahaj 5 points 1 month ago

whats the fabric made out of then? some kind of hemp or canvas

[-] nickwitha_k@lemmy.sdf.org 6 points 1 month ago

Probably. There are a number of plants that can be used for textile fiber. Aloe, Indian hemp, cacti, and other native examples can make for quality fabric (nettles also make for great fabric fiber).

[-] rosahaj 3 points 1 month ago

I'm just not familiar with american ecology. I wonder if this means NCR textiles have much poorer threadcounts, maybe they have early industrialisation-style looms?

[-] nickwitha_k@lemmy.sdf.org 4 points 1 month ago

I'd definitely think that their textiles would range from "meh" to "sub-standard" when compared to pre-war. Not only would they need to deal with the looms, which may have needed to be "re-invented" to a degree but, the change in available flora and need to discover and adopt suitable processing techniques (ex. nettle needs some help from microbes to digest the connective tissue before being processed similar to flax and boiled with wood ash to soften).

Pre-war there would have been plenty of native examples that would have done the trick but, after the bombs fell, it's pretty clear that many extant plant species didn't make it so, discovering which plants grow fibers of sufficient quality and avoiding those that have bio-acumulated radioactive particles would also be important.

[-] rosahaj 2 points 1 month ago

why doesn't the ncr just import cotton from south asia? are they stupid?

good point on the new post-war new california ecology though, it's totally possible their looms run thread from an all-new plant, courtesy of atomic botany. didn't know that nettles could be used for textiles either. its now my headcanon that during famine NCR civillians raid textile mills and eat the raw nettles.

[-] nickwitha_k@lemmy.sdf.org 3 points 1 month ago

Haha! I like it! Generally, the greens are what people eat or make tea with though. In WWI, the Germans ended up resorting to wild-harvested nettle fiber for uniforms due to linen shortages.

I made some nettle fiber of the sort that could be used to make textile in the past to see if I could. It's not that challenging but is time consuming. The process is very similar to processing hemp and flax for fiber:

Cutting and bundling the stalks (ideally without getting stung too many times): However long it takes your Mr. Handy or manual cutting.
Retting, dissolving the pectin that glues the cellulose fibers that you want to the woody lignin bits that you don't with the help of microbes: "Wet" retting takes about a week of just letting the bundles sit in stagnant water. "Dew" retting is also possible but, due to the lower quantity of moisture takes closer to 2-3 weeks and results in lower quality.
Breaking, the process of breaking up the woody bits to start separating them from the fiber: Can be done very quickly by passing the retted stalks through mechanical rollers
Scutching, removing the woody bits from the fiber: Manually, takes a LOT of effort. Basically, it's scraping the stalks with a wooden knife. Apparently, a person can be expected to scutch about 6.8kg (15lbs) of fiber per day by hand. Mechanically, it can also be done with metal rollers. Much, much easier.
Heckling/hackling, further removing woody bits and coarse fibers by pulling it through progressively narrower combs (generally made of nails): Manually, more pleasant than scutching but time consuming. Mechanically, can be done on a machine compound it with the previous two steps.
(Optional) Boiling fiber in wood ash solution. The weak alkali helps to break down remaining pectin and soften the fiber.