688
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[-] crank0271@lemmy.world 249 points 5 days ago

From the article:

"...journalist Liz Pelly has conducted an in-depth investigation, and published her findings in Harper’s—they are part of her forthcoming book Mood Machine: The Rise of Spotify and the Costs of the Perfect Playlist.

...

"Now she writes:

'What I uncovered was an elaborate internal program. Spotify, I discovered, not only has partnerships with a web of production companies, which, as one former employee put it, provide Spotify with “music we benefited from financially,” but also a team of employees working to seed these tracks on playlists across the platform. In doing so, they are effectively working to grow the percentage of total streams of music that is cheaper for the platform.'

In other words, Spotify has gone to war against musicians and record labels."

[-] verstra@programming.dev 35 points 5 days ago

Can someone explain why this is bad? It seems like normal behaviour of corporations.

Or has spotify previously committed to being a fair market?

[-] yesman@lemmy.world 72 points 5 days ago

This is like a soup joint that's trying to see how much they can piss in the broth before customers notice.

[-] catloaf@lemm.ee 28 points 5 days ago

That would be a health hazard, so it's not really comparable.

It seems more like a soup joint using cheaper ingredients in their dishes, which is just... normal? I don't get what the big deal is.

[-] jonathan@lemmy.zip 27 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

It's normal if you accept it. You do not have to accept it. There's also a good chance that it's illegal in Spotify's case, if not in the US then likely in Europe.

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (7 replies)
[-] Talaraine@fedia.io 38 points 5 days ago

The normal behavior of corporations IS bad. By definition.

load more comments (5 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 170 points 5 days ago

I mean they paid Joe Rogan $100 million dollars so they have already wrecked their reputation.

[-] thejml@lemm.ee 67 points 5 days ago

Ngl, I canceled them and haven’t gone back since. Don’t really miss it much, I try to use the same cost as my subscription to buy music every month on CD when I can.

[-] Bonesince1997@lemmy.world 27 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

I have recently discovered Qobuz (French company). You can purchase digital music. They aren't cheap, but they have selection and hi-res music (sometimes 24 bit).

But good on you for the CDs, too!

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[-] brucethemoose@lemmy.world 36 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

But I am grateful for independent journalism, which is now my main hope for the future.

Well guess who's in control of eyeballs on those journalists?

Social media companies, who have clear incentives to deprioritize such content and have repeatedly shown they do.

Let’s reclaim music from the technocrats. They have not proven themselves worthy of our trust.

While I agree with the article, I have issue with this line. These are not technocrats, they are "leaders" willing to make companies and their products objectively worse in the name of short term profits. These aren't 'technical experts put in charge,' they are greedy, spineless pigs.

[-] perestroika@lemm.ee 60 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

For ease of reading, the investigation he refers to:

https://harpers.org/archive/2025/01/the-ghosts-in-the-machine-liz-pelly-spotify-musicians/

In short: fake artists with stock music (changing labels and other camouflage applied). Likely goal: to depreciate streaming counts for actual artists and increase profit margins.

What I uncovered was an elaborate internal program. Spotify, I discovered, not only has partnerships with a web of production companies, which, as one former employee put it, provide Spotify with “music we benefited from financially,” but also a team of employees working to seed these tracks on playlists across the platform. In doing so, they are effectively working to grow the percentage of total streams of music that is cheaper for the platform. The program’s name: Perfect Fit Content (PFC). The PFC program raises troubling prospects for working musicians. Some face the possibility of losing out on crucial income by having their tracks passed over for playlist placement or replaced in favor of PFC; others, who record PFC music themselves, must often give up control of certain royalty rights that, if a track becomes popular, could be highly lucrative. But it also raises worrying questions for all of us who listen to music. It puts forth an image of a future in which—as streaming services push music further into the background, and normalize anonymous, low-cost playlist filler—the relationship between listener and artist might be severed completely.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] dinckelman@lemmy.world 104 points 5 days ago

There's a reason why artists have to sell 50$ t-shirts at shows. Back in the days, the label would leech you dry, and now it's Spotify, on top of your label

[-] satanmat@lemmy.world 32 points 5 days ago

Yes and…

Lily Allen and Kate Nash are on OnlyFans and make more money there…

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] 96VXb9ktTjFnRi@feddit.nl 48 points 5 days ago

Pirate the music, use ListenBrainz (which is FOSS) to analyze your listening behavior and make recommendations

[-] mac@lemm.ee 1 points 2 days ago

My listenbrainz recs are kinda meh compared to last.fm. I scrobble to both, and maloja via multi-scrobbler.

What server do you use to host your music? Would love to set up one of the *arrs to auto download recs from the different scrobble databases and then delete them after a week or so if I don't "like" the track. Are you aware of any client can support that flow?

I will say, none of the scrobble DBs I have used have recommendations as good as Spotify. Daylists are pretty sweet. I do think the Spotify API is free to use but I havent taken a dive in on what I can get from it

[-] 96VXb9ktTjFnRi@feddit.nl 1 points 2 days ago

I don't know about spotify recommendations, but given the incredible amount of user data they have it makes a lot of sense that they have the best recommendations. I love LB for providing a FOSS alternative, and though they steadily grow, they are still comparatively tiny. But I think they are our best shot at noncorporate automated music recommendations.

For your questions, I have no idea. I'm not tech savvy at all myself.

load more comments (8 replies)
[-] Sakychu 48 points 5 days ago

"Our single best hope is a cooperative streaming platform owned by labels and musicians."

Oh yeah that worked great with movie and television streaming. I really like to pay the same price for just a tenth of the selection..

load more comments (3 replies)
[-] Hikermick@lemmy.world 19 points 4 days ago

I don't think this is earth shattering news. These companies identify when the audience is barely paying attention (to content and ads) and spits out the cheap stuff. I watch fly fishing and fly tying videos on YouTube and often fall asleep with it on. Then I wake up to the third hour of a professional bass fishing tournament. It happens a lot

[-] Boozilla@sh.itjust.works 24 points 5 days ago

Many of my friends use it. I'm old school and just keep a collection of mp3s on multiple devices for backup.

[-] Wogi@lemmy.world 21 points 5 days ago

It's all but impossible to purchase an mp3 anymore. Anywhere you can theoretically buy music does everything it can to lock you in to their ecosystem and prevent you from accessing your music outside of it.

[-] foremanguy92_@lemmy.ml 29 points 5 days ago

I believe that Bandcamp is doing a pretty good job with it. But you can always sail the seas

load more comments (16 replies)
[-] RaoulDook@lemmy.world 10 points 4 days ago

No idea why you would think it's hard to buy MP3s. I've never had a problem buying any, just go to the big name FAANG companies' music store webpages or Bandcamp for FLACs. No DRM on any that I bought.

load more comments (4 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[-] binom@lemmy.world 34 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

the german tv channel ARD actually published a three-part investigation into Spotify and Eventim middle of 2023 where they spotlighted this issue as well. it's a great watch if you understand german!

it's called Dirty Little Secrets

EDIT: here's episode two, the relevant one where they investigate what they call "ghost musicians"

[-] Pregnenolone@lemmy.world 35 points 5 days ago

I have always been surprised that Spotify was so popular. I used them a while back and was abhorred with how shit the experience was. Stopped and never touched it again.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 18 points 4 days ago

I didn't know this, but it makes sense. One of my biggest complaints about streaming (Pandora is guilty of this, too) is that anyone with a copy of Ableton and a mediocre talent can crank out tracks barely modifying the base toolset. I tend to listen to a lot of variants of electronic music. 95% of the music is absolute crap. 4.5% is tolerable. And 0.5% might end up in my playlist. Less tan 1:100/songs. I have no doubt that “band” or artist names were made up to crank something out, abandoned, and started up under a different name to churn out more boring samesies hoping for a few plays in one of those “made for you” playlists.

So the service doing this for themselves and enabling it for profit isn’t surprising.

load more comments (3 replies)
[-] Yerbouti@sh.itjust.works 22 points 5 days ago

Bandcamp is the way to go and Tidal if you really need streaming.

[-] ChaoticEntropy@feddit.uk 11 points 5 days ago

Tidal has decided to sunset it's app, which means it's basically on maintenance mode now. Somewhat off putting.

load more comments (10 replies)
[-] mattd@programming.dev 41 points 5 days ago

When some employees expressed concerns about this, Spotify managers replied (according to Pelly’s sources) that “listeners wouldn’t know the difference.”

Insulting your users, that always works out so well

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] datendefekt@feddit.org 42 points 5 days ago

After comparing the sound quality of Amazon, Spotify, Deezer and Tidal, the dynamic range of Tidal really stood out - even in lowest quality. At that time, I read that Tidal had the highest payout to the artists. I also like that the service is partially owned by several artists.

The recommendations and feeds are really top notch, just the right mix of stuff I know and like and nice surprises. The "Daily Discovery" often explores a certain genre or mood. There are so many cool bands I've found - also from genres I don't usually listen to. I can wholeheartedly recommend the service.

[-] DampSquid@feddit.uk 22 points 5 days ago

Or Qobuz, which is like Tidal, but better and they never tried to sell users on made-up MQA hi-res.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] INeedMana@lemmy.world 32 points 5 days ago

I understand that it's a different model that will not work for everyone. But check out Bandcamp's payout model. Find new music via internet radio/MusicBrains (I don't remember RN the name of music exploration based on that)/yt and buy it via the model that is straightforward and at least seems to put the most money in artists' pockets

Bandcamp also has a "discover" feature where you can set which genres you are interested in. I did find some interesting albums this way too

load more comments (5 replies)
[-] Grass@sh.itjust.works 30 points 5 days ago

didn't they sue someone for doing this on his own? I guess they want to be the only ones doing it.

[-] foremanguy92_@lemmy.ml 11 points 5 days ago

One of the best thing to do is to pirate almost all of your music and then reward the creators by going to their shows, buying them shirts or even CDs (you can also rip physical copy if piracy is not a thing)

load more comments (4 replies)
[-] Halcyon@discuss.tchncs.de 4 points 4 days ago

I don't know, do you people let Spotify decide that much about what you hear? I normally never let the music run through so that automatic recommendations play, but I choose explicitly what's added next in the queue. So the problem mentioned in the article is not relevant to me at all.

load more comments (8 replies)
[-] BigDaddySlim@lemmy.world 21 points 5 days ago

I dumped Spooterfy over a year ago now, moved all my liked song library to Tidal. I moved to AntennaPod for podcasts too. I never really make playlists, Tidals mixes are usually pretty good. The daily discovery is leagues above Spotify's weekly shit that would constantly play songs from artists I had blocked. No Spotify, I do not want to be ear raped by 100 Gecs I told you this!

They pay artists better and it's been a much better experience. My only issue was I couldn't easily like songs from the notification bar, but that was added a while ago in an update. It has started playing the same songs frequently lately, but thats not the worst I guess.

Obviously if you care about supporting your artists, buy thier CDs, vinyls (if you're into that) or buy them digitally on Bandcamp, streaming doesn't pay as much as direct support.

This reads as an ad but I'm genuinely just a satisfied user. Fuck Spotify.

As someone else here mentioned, Pandora is still a viable option too, hell my mom uses Pandora.

[-] LifeInMultipleChoice@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

The chart showing how much money the CEO has made off selling the stock.. wouldn't he run out of shares? It appears executives have sold over a billion dollars in 2024.

Makes you wonder if they heard these investigations were ongoing and figured they'd sell shares before lawsuits came and any potential dips in the company worth.

If so.. insider trading charges would be nice

[-] brucethemoose@lemmy.world 15 points 4 days ago

CEOs are often compensated with stock, AFAIK.

Insider trading is almost a joke now, and about to become way more of one under the next few years of the SEC.

[-] mctoasterson@reddthat.com 12 points 5 days ago

I just use ViMusic or RiMusic or one of those types of forks. I believe it uses YouTube and other sources. It is ad-free and has the usual stuff you'd expect like suggestions, playlists, genres etc. Occasionally the source platform will make a change that breaks it, an update comes out fixes it.

That and there are still (probably ancient at this point) desktop clients that scrape your Pandora and download local copies of all the tracks. That's another good way to never listen to ads.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] shalafi@lemmy.world 23 points 5 days ago

Spotify was my penultimate subscription. Still have to bring my AWS Lightsail instances back in house. :(

Yeah, enshitification indeed. Was quite happy 4 years ago. Worth $10/mo. to get what I want and some new stuff occasionally thrown in. Suggested music tracked my tastes, easy UI, all that.

Then they upped it $1. Fine. Then I started getting all sort of bullshit when my playlist ran out. "Fuck was that?!"

Now that I cancelled the paid version, the ads are killing me. Look, I'm a GenXer, accustomed to ads for free TV and radio. I'm fine with that revenue model. But fuck me, just like modern radio, the ads became so thick as to be distracting. And of course I can't use it in the deep woods where my internet is sketchy.

I download all my playlists. FOSS I can use to upload and play that on my phone? Guess I'm back to pirating.

[-] Meltrax@lemmy.world 18 points 5 days ago

Anyone use Deezer? How does the feature set compare? How does it compare to Tidal? I'd love to get off Spotify, just need a good replacement for all the music I listen to.

load more comments (13 replies)
load more comments
view more: next ›
this post was submitted on 24 Dec 2024
688 points (100.0% liked)

Technology

60151 readers
1495 users here now

This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.


Our Rules


  1. Follow the lemmy.world rules.
  2. Only tech related content.
  3. Be excellent to each another!
  4. Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
  5. Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
  6. Politics threads may be removed.
  7. No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
  8. Only approved bots from the list below, to ask if your bot can be added please contact us.
  9. Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed

Approved Bots


founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS