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What vendors make good dumb TVs or big monitors? (discuss.tchncs.de)
submitted 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) by Nicro@discuss.tchncs.de to c/privacy@lemmy.ml
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The EMMC on my PC-TV finally broke down and I'd like to replace it with something that doesn't run an OS or will predictably fail with a countdown. But dumb TVs are hard to come by and monitors come at a premium at that size. I want to run a PC (DP/HDMI) and an SBC (HDMI) with it. I also have an S2 satellite cable, but that's secondary. I'd like to have ~43", 16:9, 4K but without an embedded smart-hub, ideally running of eeprom-firmware, or just anything independent of write-cycles. But I can't find any good options online. Are there companies for this. Comments and recommendations welcome.

Edit: I'm EU, hence the DVB-S2 cable. Scepter would be great, but doesn't run on EU power.

Edit: I've pretty much settled on a philips 439P1/00. I'll give it another day, but it seems good. The PC over DP is my main focus and I can connect my own SBC for streaming. It lacks freesync but has adaptive sync and basic HDR. Being an office-monitor, it has no smarts and at ~600 bucks with consumer warranty and support it fits what I'm asking for well. Industry-signage wasn't really an option.

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[-] davel@lemmy.ml 51 points 1 month ago

I don’t know, but if good smart TVs are cheaper than good dumb ones, you might consider ignoring/disabling the smart bits. I might go so far as to sever the Wi-Fi/Bluetooth antennas.

Tom’s Guide: Dumb TVs — here’s why you can’t find them anymore

That’s because, for a number of reasons, it’s cheaper and more profitable for TV makers to simply include a smart platform with every TV they ship out. It’s actually a major reason why TVs have become so much cheaper in the last decade — with a smart platform, TV makers can sell the hardware at cost or even take a small loss, but in the end make money through the advertising that shows up on the homescreen.

[-] BertramDitore@lemm.ee 37 points 1 month ago

This is the advice I usually give. I hate the concept of smart TVs, but I’m not willing to spend more when I can just ensure my Hisense U8K never connects to the internet. It’s a gorgeous and completely affordable display for the quality it provides, and there are no relevant features that are unavailable because it’s offline.

[-] arthur@lemmy.zip 6 points 1 month ago

Don't tell that out loud, they may decide to block features of we don't connect it.

[-] Microplasticbrain@lemm.ee 3 points 1 month ago

Just wait till they get 5g

[-] Fusty@lemmy.ml 33 points 1 month ago

Are people aware that they can buy a smart TV and never conntect it to wi-fi and never plug in the ethernet? There is no risk if TV never gets an IP.

[-] BearOfaTime@lemm.ee 31 points 1 month ago

It's possible a smart TV will use its wifi to connect to another device of the same brand on its own. I'd read an article about it a couple years ago.

If I'm reading about it, that means a company has been working on it, and frankly it makes sense. If I were in their shoes I'd look into making it happen. It's pretty trivial to do when you think about it.

Not that I think it's happening in the wild, just an idea to keep in mind.

Also, those devices are always capturing data. So if/when they ever connect, that data will get uploaded.

[-] Fusty@lemmy.ml 5 points 1 month ago

There is no meaningful data for the OS to capture if it used as a display for externally connected devices.

The only way to have 100% privacy on all devices is not have internet service.

[-] DScratch@sh.itjust.works 26 points 1 month ago

Many tvs have microphones built into them or their remotes.

Some are even sending screenshots of what they are displaying to their backend servers.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2449198-smart-tvs-take-snapshots-of-what-you-watch-multiple-times-per-second/

[-] Fusty@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 month ago

I guess that you cannot read well so I will say it plainly, when a TV has no access to the outside internet over the lifespan of the TV, zero information or files will ever be uploaded and will stay on TV with no external copy existing anymore.

[-] otter@lemmy.ca 11 points 1 month ago

Also, those devices are always capturing data. So if/when they ever connect, that data will get uploaded.

This seems to be the key bit of the comment.

Outside of the examples listed, a more reasonable possibility is if someone else in your home (ex. A family member) connects it to the network. Also even if it doesn't automatically connect to a public network, well placed popups can also lead to mistakes.

[-] Fusty@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 month ago

Yoy can dream up every fantasy scenerio you want until you are butt stupid, it does not make it plausible.

[-] undefined@lemmy.hogru.ch 6 points 1 month ago

Have you missed the other comments? It’s pretty well documented that the TV will either find a similar brand TV to connect to (and reach the internet) or as I’ve read, it’ll find an open WiFi network to do so.

[-] fuckwit_mcbumcrumble@lemmy.dbzer0.com 17 points 1 month ago

There is no meaningful data for the OS to capture if it used as a display for externally connected devices.

Except that some of these devices are periodically "screenshotting" the screen and harvesting data from that.

Pair that with automatically connecting to open wifi networks and nothing is truly safe.

[-] lone_faerie 2 points 1 month ago

Username checks out. Your own article you linked dispels this.

the opt-out mechanisms implemented on LG and Samsung smart TVs are working

A better solution is to disconnect your Smart TV from the internet entirely... Smart TVs cannot utilize ACR when they are offline.

[-] MonkderVierte@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 month ago

Some actively listen with a microphone though.

[-] Boomkop3@reddthat.com 1 points 1 month ago

Not everywhere, like Europe

[-] MonkderVierte@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 month ago

Are you sure?

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[-] Steve@communick.news 13 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

They're called Signage Displays.
Most major names you know make them.
They do cost more, but not prohibitively so.

[-] elucubra@sopuli.xyz 6 points 1 month ago

The display specs tend to be shit, and they are often more expensive. Their design is tuned for 24/7 operation, not fidelity.

[-] Steve@communick.news 2 points 1 month ago

I suppose that depends on what you mean by "shit". They're the same displays as in retail units. Maybe a generation older. But that's it. Samsung doesn't have special lines making different screens for a niche market like this. LG even has OLED Signage Displays.

[-] MonkderVierte@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 month ago

Seriously. Leaves the $200 computer away – costs more. Market is weird.

[-] Steve@communick.news 3 points 1 month ago

Most still have the computer built in. But the software is complety different. They have some different features that would make sense for an always on screen in a shop, office, or airport. You can load up a thumb drive with images for the screen to rotate through. Upload new images through WiFi or Ethernet. Use that same network connection to setup, synchronize, and controll dozens of screens, making a video wall. Pretty cool stuff really.

Just none of the spyware. Since there is no individual or household to tie the data to, that part becomes pretty useless.

[-] Nicro@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 1 month ago

When scaled to mass production, the SBCs become dirt cheap. Then they can subsidise with sponsored/preloaded content, ads and usage data.

[-] bert@lemmy.monster 12 points 1 month ago

I have seen Scepter mentioned a few times lately.

https://www.sceptre.com/TV/4K-UHD-TV-category1category73.html

[-] Nicro@discuss.tchncs.de 5 points 1 month ago

Seen them recommended in dumb-tv articles. Will check them out.

[-] BigLime@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 month ago

Beat me to it. Yeah they have 4k LEDs with ARC

[-] fmstrat@lemmy.nowsci.com 10 points 1 month ago

Every TV is a dumb TV of you don't connect it to the internet.

[-] xia@lemmy.sdf.org 4 points 1 month ago

I do recall there being tvs with baked-in ads that play on startup even without internet service, but i was unable to easily find the reference. Also, many smart tv interfaces are much slower than dumb tv on-screen menus, so there is that.

[-] Doxatek@mander.xyz 4 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Yeah this is true. The TCL TV I have has an ad for Deadpool when I turn it on. It's a dumb TV in the sense of it's not connected to the Internet but it still has these from the brief period of time where it wasn't during setup. The ROKU tvs are even worse imo it has like weird scrolling banner ads as a TV screensaver. We have a Roku TV as well.

Honestly fuck all the manufacturers I don't even want a damn 'smart' TV and I'm also pissed at everyone else that enables this by not caring. I guess I helped perpetrate it also but I had no choice I would have bought differently if I could. A lot of people don't mind having non-stop ads jammed down their throats though even by objects they own. The only time I think my TV should be showing me ads is if it's literally free.

[-] JovialMicrobial@lemm.ee 1 points 1 month ago

Ours had a really sluggish menu with ads until we disconnected it from the internet. Now it has zero ads and the menu to switch sources is as fast as it should be.

I wish I had never connected it to begin with though. I didn't know better. It used to default to whatever console was on, but it updated and no longer does that for some shitty reason. So I have to go through the menu and manually switch sources now. Probably to make sure I saw all the ads before using my playstation. Assholes.

[-] Boomkop3@reddthat.com 2 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Exactly, why do people even bother?

[-] LazerDickMcCheese@sh.itjust.works 9 points 1 month ago

I'd like to know too. I've never used my TV as a traditional TV, and I hate the "smart" features. Ideally, I'd like a modern 16:9 CRT under 80lbs, but they don't exist

[-] skarn@discuss.tchncs.de 5 points 1 month ago

What would be the benefit of a CRT? I'm sure they last plenty, but they draw a lot of power.

[-] Fubarberry@sopuli.xyz 11 points 1 month ago

Some people prefer CRTs for gaming, there's much less input lag, and differences in the way images are displayed means that you can often run games at lower resolutions than pixel based displays without as much of a decrease in image quality. Here's a DF video talking about some of the advantages.

Also CRTs can be pushed to insanely high frame rates, although this can be limited by how much you reduce the resolution. For example, one guy got his to run at 700hz refresh rate (by dropping resolution to 120p).

[-] fuckwit_mcbumcrumble@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 1 month ago

As soon as you use a digital input you lose any real latency advantages. Plus modern digital displays have such low latency the difference really doesn't matter.

[-] skarn@discuss.tchncs.de 4 points 1 month ago

I see, I know the arguments from gamers (and have seen that video before). The discussion was on TVs and I didn't think of the gaming angle.

I'm also not convinced about that stuff, to me it's like talking to audiophiles that swear they can totally hear the difference between made by an expensive ethernet cable in the final audio, or that they can tell 16bit 48kHz from 24bit 96kHz, while basic physics and double blind tests say they can't.

[-] LazerDickMcCheese@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 month ago

Modern displays make my eyes hurt

[-] fuckwit_mcbumcrumble@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 1 month ago

And CRTs dont????

[-] LazerDickMcCheese@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 month ago

Nope! I could watch one all day, no clue why

[-] arthur@lemmy.zip 3 points 1 month ago

You could watch all day today? Or are you thinking it as when you were a child with a healthier body and knew no limits?

[-] LazerDickMcCheese@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 month ago

Today, I own 3 CRTs and they don't make my eyes burn

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[-] wildbus8979@sh.itjust.works 6 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

At 43" you're in luck, and not needing a tuner, there are still some options

https://www.usa.philips.com/c-p/BDM4350UC_27/brilliance-4k-ultra-hd-lcd-display

Also: Samsung - Odyssey Neo G7 43"

[-] Nicro@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 1 month ago

From what I can see, this is still a Tizen based smart TV masquerading as a monitor, Apps and all.

[-] mlfh@lemmy.sdf.org 6 points 1 month ago

I have a 43-inch Insignia N10 that works great in exactly that role. Dumb TV with HDMI inputs, audio outputs, and that's about it. Best Buy's in-house brand, it was like 120 bucks about a year ago, when my Vizio TV from 2003 finally died in a way I couldn't fix :(

The built-in speakers aren't great, definitely recommend hooking it up to something else.

[-] Zerush@lemmy.ml 5 points 1 month ago

Currently it's nearly impossible to find good and big dumb TV, but as mencioned, it's only smart conected to the internet. Instead of this conect it to an Satelite decoder and a Parabolic outside (not very expensive (<€100) and you have access to hundreds of channels from every country for free. and anonymous.

[-] Nicro@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 1 month ago

As stated in OP, I have an S2 dish already. Agreed that it's better than cable. But not everyone lives in a place they can set up a dish on. Rentals and such. My point was that I wanted to use the display without relying on some buggy vendor-locked OS.

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[-] Ranger 3 points 1 month ago

Look up "Business Displays"

[-] krolden@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 month ago

Sharp NEC

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this post was submitted on 22 Nov 2024
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