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This is not a coincidence, Apple purposefully make it painful to use anything with any of their products unless it's one of their products
For W10, you install an app to get the codec, then you’re done. It’s built in on W11. Same as HEVC video which is used very commonly in piracy. Are pirates out to make it “purposefully painful” or are they just using modern codecs? Android also can save to HEIC or AVIF.
Yeah it's a bit of a tossup between them. Apple definitely chose it to be a dick. However, Microsoft could rectify it easily if they wanted to.
Both HEVC and HEIC thought cost money, and the vast majority of windows users will never use the codecs. Including the license with every copy of Windows is added cost to the end user that they receive no benefit from, so I understand why they would leave it out. HEVC prompts you if you try to play to go to the store and buy the license, which is good for your entire account. Honestly it's not a terrible thing to do. I was one of the 1% of people who would play HEVC natively on Windows, so yeah the $3 license made sense
Apple definitely chose it to be a dick.
What other image format supports HDR and modern compression algorithms? AVIF also requires a special codec. This is just codec stuff, I really don't see it as anyone being a dick. Android can also use these modern formats, with the same requirements if you want to open them on Windows.
Kinda surprising to me that people so frequently recommend using Linux here, yet taking 30 seconds to install a free codec on Windows is apparently a big deal.
I literally said it was easy to do.
Let’s try this again: in a world where Apple is not a dick, what modern image format do they use that isn’t subject to these same codec requirements?
If they were doing this just to be dicks, they’d spin off one of their own formats like they did with ALAC. They didn’t, they used HEIC which was also used by Android (which is now using AVIF).
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OpenEXR. Though it probably could use a spec upgrade, in particular add JPEG-XL to the list of compression algorithms. It's not like OpenEXR's choices are bad, the lossy ones are just more geared towards fidelity than space savings, kind of the opposite of what you want for the web where saving space is often paramount and fidelity a bonus.
Bonus: Supports multi-channel, so not just RGBA. Not terribly useful for your run off the mill camera, very useful in production where you might want to attach the depth buffer, cryptomatte etc and I guess you could also use it for the output of light field cameras. Oh there's also multi-view so you can store not just stereo images but also whole all-around captures and stuff. There's practically nothing pixel-related you can't do with it though it might require custom tooling.
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Yea ... no, sorry to say but this one's on Microsoft. I get it, hurr durr Apple expensive and elitist, but they know where to put up their walled garden and where not to. For example they used to have their own video container .mov but they're way past forcing something like that onto iPhone users. And even back then, the actual codec they committed themselves to in those days was H.264, a standard that's open to adoption by anybody. You can easily turn an old .mov into an .mp4 or .mkv without needing to alter the actual content of the file and that content is playable by pretty much every media device built in the last 15+ years.
HEIC isn't Apple's thing it's from the MPEGroup, also easily licensable by anybody. I guess the reason why it wasn't part of Windows 10 from the beginning is because they both came out in mid 2015. Windows 10 seems to have adopted it for viewing (and later editing) in 2018 but they make you hit a stupid download button in their store to get it so that's lame.
Yep. Lack of format support is usually to blame on the one who doesn't support the format. You can absolutely blame Apple for this too though, their apps can't open e.g. Matroska video or FLAC.
And perplexingly, they don't support uploading HEIC, their own image format of choice, on the web iCloud Photos. So there's that too.
(At this point my music library is stored as ALAC because it's well supported in both Linux and Apple's OSes. Really wish it wouldn't have to be that way though. Someone needs to tell them about ffmpeg.)
For example they used to have their own video container .mov
It's always very very funny every time someone mentions MOV, because while it's very similar to MP4, it's actually an open format while MP4 isn't (!). You actually have to pay for the MP4 standard document while Apple just gives you the MOV documentation.
Also at least taking a screen capture on macOS still gives you a MOV container, actually.
Apple made ALAC as an alternative to FLAC due to the dubious licensing around FLAC at the time.
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HEIC is a much better-compressed format than JPEG that all Androids support; iirc JPEG XL (kinda dead) and Google's WebP are the only other big-name formats with better photographic compression. Windows was the only major operating system that chose to have consumers separately pay the patent fee, none of which goes to Apple. Since Windows 11 22H2, HEIC images work out-of-the-box.
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This is not an Apple thing. Android phones use HEIC by default as well. This is a good thing. HEIC uses smaller file sizes and has fewer artifacts than JPEG.
I just plug a cable from my iPhone to my Linux mint laptop and view/transfer what photos I want through my file browser… seems real easy.
You could use KDE Connect and do it wirelessly as well. Who needs cables for anything but charging these days?
I use the cable to charge my phone. Am I the only person still doing this?
I was mostly joking, but KDE Connect has made phone-to-PC transfers much more convenient for me. I've only tried it between Android and Linux, but once connected, it basically nounts my phone as a drive that I can browse or copy/paste to and from.
Generally, I only use a cable to charge, and I rarely need/want to transfer files at the same time as I want to charge.
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Someone tried to send me a picture they took and it looked like hot garbage until they sent it over email. Not because it couldn't be sent without feeding it through a potato first, because Apple wants a worse experience for anyone not in their ecosystem.
When they are the oddball in the group though, it just makes iPhone's look like a worse option.
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As much as I love to hate on apple, any of this format shit is 100% Windows bullshit. It's not just pictures, with shit like webm, or some random video codecs it'll ask you to FUCKING BUY! But even shit like Windows only supporting some like 3 file formats from the god knows how many out there. Ever since I switched to Linux (heck, even fucking MacOS would do better) all this stopped being an issue. Fuck windows for literally only supporting their special selection of formats. There's a good reason why the first step of many people installing windows is also Installing VLC or MUCH superior image viewers. Because Microsoft chooses to not support most things out there!
Exactly. Android's default image format is HEIC as well. Jpeg is outdated and needs to die already.
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Windows now supports other formats than BMP. It's already a huge progress.
They started to support svg (which is 23 years old by now) in Office a month or so ago. What a time to be alive!
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How many distros support h264/265 out of the box? They probably don't support most HEIC images either since they're HEVC on the inside
Almost all of them? They may prompt you to install additional codecs but thats it. Most software displaying images support thoose image formats. Man we have vlc to display any format
That's exactly the same case as Windows. The built-in photo/video players don't support them out of the box, but do if you install the free codec from the store, or you can install any 3rd party players you like.
There are lots of great things about Linux, but out of the box support for licensed video codecs isn't magically better than Windows
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GIMP opens HEIC and WEBP files and it's available on all operating systems.
I can use HEIC on Arch (btw) just fine. As I recall there's some bullshit you need to download on the Microsoft store to get it to work. It's a pain in the ass.
You can change this in Settings > Camera > Formats > choose Most Compatible to change from HEIF/HEVC to JPEG/H.264
EDIT: I use XnViewMP to browse photos and it can convert HEIC to JPG and HandBrake can handle HEVC to MP4 or MKV.
Not sure if it works for HEIC, but here's a tip for converting WEBP (common on websites) to a more universal format like PNG:
1: open Paint
2: open .WEBP in paint
3: save as -> PNG
4: give name and save
There's also a Firefox extension that I use that that lets you just save as PNG https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/save-webp-as-png-or-jpeg/
Or even better, use ImageMagick.
Possibly Linux?
This is a work problem and a lot of software we use isn't supported on Linux.
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Have you got compatibility turned on in the photos app?
I didn't take the photos.
I use an open source video codec library in Windows 10 but I'm away from my computer for a while and cannot tell you.
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this post was submitted on 14 Nov 2024
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