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Moritz Körner, Member of the European Parliament, disclosed the decision on Twitter. Swedish publisher SVG said, “The question was removed at the last moment from Thursday’s ambassadorial meeting in Brussels”.

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[-] dojan@lemmy.world 137 points 10 months ago

I’m still fucking mad the Left voted yes for this. Campaigning on a no and then turning their coats immediately after the elections. Disgraceful, and I hope whichever party members are responsible get booted.

[-] wewbull@feddit.uk 68 points 10 months ago

Don't make the mistake of thinking that left mean anti-authoritarian. Left or right is an economic stance, and is orthogonal to beliefs surrounding government rights Vs population rights.

[-] dojan@lemmy.world 34 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

When I say Left, I mean Vänsterpartiet, not some nebulous coalition. See their stance here.

Chat control was a proposal on an EU level which meant that applications and social media platforms would be forced to scan all of their users messages. The proposal has been put forth by the EU comission as a part of a larger package with the purpose of protecting children against exploitation on the internet. The Left Party considers that the part specifically about chat control wouldn't contribute to the end goals. There are more effective measures that need to be taken in order to protect children.

After significant criticism from us and many others the EU parliament has significantly improved the proposal. They have among other things removed all parts regarding automatic scanning. This has meant that all parties now are in support of the EU-parliament position. The proposal is now on hold among the member states and instead another, temporary law has been extended to counter sexual abuse of children on the internet.

Overall the Left (Vänsterpartiet) campaigns on a position of being against surveillance and the like. The Social Democrats (part of the Left coalition) however is in favour of it, because of course they fucking are. My issue here is obviously that they're lying to our faces.

On a much greater scale I have a lot of issues. For the most part I align mostly with V and MP, but we're talking on a level of like 60-70%, so they don't actually represent my views particularly well. In the grand scheme of things that's also not something I'd expect; I'm rather extreme but I also realise that there's only so much we can do when operating within the system we currently have. Thus I align with the parties that align the closest with the core beliefs I have, V and MP.

One of my biggest icks when it comes to politics is hiding behind children. It infuriates me because it's never genuine. It's never about the fucking children, they're just a convenient excuse because the moment someone criticises a suggestion, you can turn around and say "Oh so you hate children? Are you a paedophile? Why do you support children being harmed?"

[-] oce@jlai.lu 14 points 10 months ago

Left or right is an economic stance

What about the social stance?

[-] Skua@kbin.earth 9 points 10 months ago

Also that. But I'd say that wewbull's point stands that there are more and less authoritarian flavours of that too

[-] wewbull@feddit.uk 3 points 10 months ago

Measured on a different axis.

You can have authoritarian left Stalin's Russia) and authoritarian right (Nazi Germany). You can have liberal (i.e. non-authoritarian) left and right too.

It's clichéd, but the political compass explains the concept, but it's still only one extra dimension. It's still far better than just left Vs right.

[-] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 8 points 10 months ago

Check out the political compass, which is an interesting way to conceptualize political leanings. I don't think the test is particularly good (I have issues with a few of the questions), but the answer I get is pretty close to where I think I should be placed, so maybe there's some merit to it.

I'm consistently in the bottom half near the center line, and the two major parties in my country are in the top right. I guess that just demonstrates why I fail to see much difference in what I care about in the two major parties, since moving toward either direction is a move away from me.

Anyway, I hope this is a decent demonstration of how the left/right divide doesn't tell the whole story.

[-] uis@lemm.ee 3 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

The problem with political compass arises when you understand that political and economic freedoms are in conflict with each other under capitalism.

[-] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 4 points 10 months ago

? The compass takes economic systems into account. Left vs right is socialism vs free market capitalism, and top vs bottom is authoritarianism vs libertarianism.

So if you think capitalism causes issues, you'd nudge those ideologies further up the authoritarian spectrum.

[-] QuantumSoul@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 10 months ago

Not exactly orthogonal, left right could be viewed as an Principal Component Analysis reduced to only one axis. So there are correlations between stances but so much dimensions lost that it's nearly useless

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[-] LordCrom@lemmy.world 111 points 10 months ago

They are just delaying the vote for another time... Hoping that next time it will fly under the radar and there won't be a huge backlash of discontent.

If the vote fail, they just wait a year, rename it, and try again.

Same thing happens in the US. Law proposed that people hate, people organize, start a campaign that fights for news airtime, bringing awareness of the dickery about to happen, and then succeed after a hard battle and many many volunteer hours spent.

In 6 months Congress just renames it the "I love kittens" act and sticks it on a must pass bill.

Fighting bullshit laws is exhausting....

[-] Treczoks@lemmy.world 25 points 10 months ago

Don't be surprise if it reappears as an attachment to a fishing quota law or a law defining sizes for underwear...

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[-] match@pawb.social 8 points 10 months ago

It happens in the US yes, but does it happen in the EU?

[-] cows_are_underrated@discuss.tchncs.de 15 points 10 months ago

Idk about the EU(there have been cases that were exactly this, an example would be Article 13), but I can say to you, that this devinetively happens in Germany. Our conservatives party wants to pass a law, that would track and save all your online activity(Vorratsdatenspeicherung/ data preservation) to fight "paedophiles and terrorists" they bring it up once in a while, even tho, our federal court already said, that its illegal.

[-] d00ery@lemmy.world 12 points 10 months ago

As much I like the EU, politicians are politicians ...

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[-] ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago

Hungary will take the EU presidency, they just name it "child protection" and will smear everyone as a pedophile who objects it.

[-] MigratingtoLemmy@lemmy.world 78 points 10 months ago

Find the politicians by name who voted yes for this, and display them in public.

Let the capable open source community then take over going through their phones, since they must be OK with their phones being scanned, right?

[-] ripcord@lemmy.world 22 points 10 months ago

At least some of them were discussion giving themselves an exception from it. So no.

[-] MigratingtoLemmy@lemmy.world 11 points 10 months ago

All the more reason to find the friendly neighbourhood blackhat gang

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[-] andrade@infosec.pub 74 points 10 months ago

Note the vote was withdrawn, not actually voted against. They're pushing this for a later date because there was no majority.

“The EU Council did not make a decision on chat control today, as the agenda item was removed due to the lack of a majority, (...)

Belgium’s draft law, (...) was instead postponed indefinitely. (...) Belgium cannot currently present a proposal that would gain a majority. In July, the Council Presidency will transfer from Belgium to Hungary, which has stated its intention to advance negotiations on chat control as part of its work program.

[-] PrettyFlyForAFatGuy@feddit.uk 9 points 10 months ago

Absolutely fuck all is going to get done while orban has control of the council so at least theres that

[-] kilgore_trout@feddit.it 5 points 10 months ago

Hungary will have the presidency, not the total control. They propose discussions but the vote in the Council is still majority based.

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[-] MonkderDritte@feddit.de 68 points 10 months ago

Can we please identify the guys always pushing encryption-breaking ideas?

[-] jlh@lemmy.jlh.name 43 points 10 months ago

And hack their phones so we can see why they want to spy on everyone else's phones

[-] WhatAmLemmy@lemmy.world 12 points 10 months ago

I have zero doubt that many core proponents of anti-privacy laws are pedophiles — that's why they always add measures to ensure it's illegal to invade their own privacy.

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[-] fuzzy_feeling@programming.dev 17 points 10 months ago
[-] grue@lemmy.world 14 points 10 months ago

I hate dishonest titles and URLs. In reality, this shit has nothing to do with "child sex content."

[-] banana_lama@lemm.ee 47 points 10 months ago

Now put in a law saying you can't do that

[-] PonyOfWar@pawb.social 37 points 10 months ago

Nice. I guess they didn't expect to get a majority to support it anymore. Definitely a win for now, but I'm sure they'll try again.

[-] Tywele@lemmy.dbzer0.com 20 points 10 months ago

I guess that realisation came after Germany said they will vote "No"

[-] iturnedintoanewt@lemm.ee 5 points 10 months ago

Yeah. They've been trying about every year since... I don't know, two decades? They DEFINITELY will keep at it. They never give up.

[-] BlastboomStrice@mander.xyz 33 points 10 months ago

Lets gooooo🔥

(It has happened in the past, it will probably happen again in a few months, but still, its a win!)

[-] melroy@kbin.melroy.org 30 points 10 months ago

Damn.. this was almost China 2.0 in EU. This was a close call people... this is not good.

[-] Beaver@lemmy.ca 28 points 10 months ago

Thank the heavens. Now keep it that way!

[-] foremanguy92_@lemmy.ml 21 points 10 months ago

Great choice, now do not say the same thing next year!

[-] gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 20 points 10 months ago

I am suspicious they realized that they weren’t going to be able to make a loophole for themselves - I’ve seen several articles in the last week on how they were trying to do that.

[-] DoucheBagMcSwag@lemmy.dbzer0.com 12 points 10 months ago

Nah it's more like that got caught being hypocrites

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[-] Censored@lemmy.world 11 points 10 months ago

Crazy to think they were even considering it. Hopefully this is the end of it.

[-] arymandias@feddit.de 11 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

They are just edging this bill till nobody pays attention. Democracy at work!

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[-] EntropyPure@lemmy.world 10 points 10 months ago

From what I understand it was withdrawn as a vote „in favor of the goals of the commission“ was not guaranteed. In part because Germany announced its decision to withdraw support yesterday. Seems to be standard behavior.

[-] MonkderDritte@feddit.de 7 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Until next try in a few months.

What i read here sometime without source, that secret services since Snowden push for breaking of encryption, seems more and more plausible.

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[-] r@piefed.social 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

glad it got stopped. hopefully it never passes

[-] lud@lemm.ee 4 points 10 months ago

Moritz Körner, Member of the European Parliament, disclosed the decision on Twitter. Swedish publisher SVG said, “The question was removed at the last moment from Thursday’s ambassadorial meeting in Brussels”.

Who are SVG? I have never heard of them before and I can't find anything online.

[-] CautiousCharacter@awful.systems 5 points 10 months ago

It looks like they might have meant SVT (Swedish public television). This article has similar wording.

[-] ChaoticEntropy@feddit.uk 2 points 10 months ago

I was thinking they might have meant SvD (Svenska Dagbladet), who are a news organisation, though I didn't see any corresponding articles.

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this post was submitted on 20 Jun 2024
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