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submitted 4 months ago by sverit@lemmy.ml to c/technology@lemmy.world

There were a series of accusations about our company last August from a former employee. Immediately following these accusations, LMG hired Roper Greyell - a large Vancouver-based law firm specializing in labor and employment law, to conduct a third-party investigation. Their website describes them as “one of the largest employment and labour law firms in Western Canada.” They work with both private and public sector employers.

To ensure a fair investigation, LMG did not comment or publicly release any data and asked our team members to do the same. Now that the investigation is complete, we’re able to provide a summary of the findings.

The investigation found that:

  • Claims of bullying and harassment were not substantiated.

  • Allegations that sexual harassment were ignored or not addressed were false.

  • Any concerns that were raised were investigated. Furthermore, from reviewing our history, the investigator is confident that if any other concerns had been raised, we would have investigated them.

  • There was no evidence of “abuse of power” or retaliation. The individual involved may not have agreed with our decisions or performance feedback, but our actions were for legitimate work-related purposes, and our business reasons were valid.

  • Allegations of process errors and miscommunication while onboarding this individual were partially substantiated, but the investigator found ample documentary evidence of LMG working to rectify the errors and the individual being treated generously and respectfully. When they had questions, they were responded to and addressed.

In summary, as confirmed by the investigation, the allegations made against the team were largely unfounded, misleading, and unfair.

With all of that said, in the spirit of ongoing improvement, the investigator shared their general recommendation that fast-growing workplaces should invest in continuing professional development. The investigator encouraged us to provide further training to our team about how to raise concerns to reinforce our existing workplace policies.

Prior to receiving this report, LMG solicited anonymous feedback from the team in an effort to ensure there was no unreported bullying and harassment and hosted a training session which reiterated our workplace policies and reinforced our reporting structure. LMG will continue to assess ongoing continuing education for our team.

At this time, we feel our case for a defamation suit would be very strong; however, our deepest wish is to simply put all of this behind us. We hope that will be the case, given the investigator’s clear findings that the allegations made online were misrepresentations of what actually occurred. We will continue to assess if there is persistent reputational damage or further defamation.

This doesn’t mean our company is perfect and our journey is over. We are continuously learning and trying to do better. Thank you all for being part of our community.

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[-] Rognaut@lemmy.world 241 points 4 months ago

It's unbelievable how much hate for LTT there is on this platform. I like them. No one is perfect. This investigation from a third party is a good thing and the findings are good as well. The statement about defamation, I feel, is warranted because the ex-employee made a ton of very damning claims and really hurt their image. The Fediverse is a great example of this damage.

The hate from this community towards LTT is extreme and unfounded.

[-] ShaunaTheDead@kbin.social 60 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

An investigation from a neutral third party is a good thing, but in this case LTT hired the third party investigator so the investigators obviously have an incentive to find LTT innocent of all charges since LTT is paying them through Linus Media Group (LMG). It's better than nothing, but it's like when there's an internal affairs investigation into police misconduct... by the police... Nobody believes it and for good reason.

[-] PotatoPotato@lemmy.world 68 points 4 months ago

Of course LTT hired the investigator, who else would hire an investigator?

[-] JohnnyCanuck@lemmy.ca 55 points 4 months ago

The law firm would be putting themselves on the line for LTT if there was any further legal action, or if the subject of the investigation brought forth more evidence.

I doubt LTT is big enough to give them the incentive to do that.

Hiring a third party investigator is not the same as internal affairs. Internal affairs have only one client and little incentive to bite the hand that feeds them.

If LTT goes down after this and it comes out that the law firm missed something major or outright lied, it would call into question every investigation they've done (at least recently) and destroy their reputation.

[-] JRush@lemmy.ca 46 points 4 months ago

If the law firm bungled the investigation, it would affect their reputation and future business. Wouldn't that mean they have a monetary incentive not to favor LMG in their investigation?

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[-] SkaveRat@discuss.tchncs.de 58 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

The defamation statement was maybe a bit much, but also warranted. People need to know that just throwing accusations out there that are just plainly not true is actually legally problematic.

I also don't get why people feel this is "threatening people who want to speak up in the future".

If your "speaking up" has merit, it's not defarmation. Plain and simple.

Companies make mistakes (and aparently some were made in this case, and dealt with).

But I find it concerning that people also just blindly trust any and all claims that individuals make about these kind of situations. Believe that they are telling the truth, but also verify that this is actually true. The latter part is important. Blind trust is as damaging as not doing anything at all about a proble, There are people out there who get laid off for legitimate reasons, and try to retaliate for that. Even by claiming BS reasons.

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[-] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 41 points 4 months ago

I don't have LTT, I just find it worthless. Their content is frequently shallow, I dislike the presentation (clickbait-y titles and thumbnails, annoying segways, etc), and I find Linus himself annoying. Then again, I do watch their content from time to time, if they have something worth watching. That's not very often, but they do make some decent content occasionally. I rarely care about PC shenanigans, but sometimes I'll watch Jays2Cents if I want some of that (he's perhaps more annoying than Linus, but it is what it is, I guess).

I mostly watch Gamers Nexus for reviews, news, and benchmarks. I find the delivery much more in-line with what I'd like, though I find Steve a bit long-winded so I tend to skip a bunch in the videos. But the content is high quality.

To each their own though. My coworker really like LTT and went to LTX recently, so I'll watch a video here and there for water-cooler discussions.

The hate from this community towards LTT is extreme and unfounded.

Are you just going to ignore Linus and the companies abhorrent response to the situation? That alone should make anyone lose any respect they had for them.

[-] Aphelion@lemm.ee 31 points 4 months ago

Yeah, same for me. Linus' response was so stereotypicaly defensive, dismissive and shitty, I lost all trust. Couple that with GN's fact checking of LMGs sloppyness, and I was done ever watching their channel.

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[-] erwan@lemmy.ml 33 points 4 months ago

I just don't like Linus because he's annoying and abuses clickbait thumbnails and titles.

Some of their videos (from other people than himself) are good, but usually I'll avoid LTT content all together.

For that reason I'm not really sure what happened, and I don't really care.

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[-] JoMiran@lemmy.ml 29 points 4 months ago

It's unbelievable how much hate for LTT there is on this platform.

They have a huge reach and tremendous influence, but are not always conscientious, careful, and thorough as they should be given their sway. Still, that doesn't justify the vitriol.

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[-] xkforce@lemmy.world 119 points 4 months ago

I feel like the fact they paid the same party that investigated them is an obvious enough conflict of interest to dismiss this out of hand. Whether the report is actually trustworthy or not, there is an incentive to come to a conclusion that aligns with whomever paid them and that alone should make people question the conclusions being made.

[-] MSids@lemmy.world 61 points 4 months ago

At my work we pay auditors to assess our security controls and I would chose a different company if I thought they were being anything less than honest with us on their findings. The agreements and SOW are set up at the beginning of the engagement, so the investigators get paid regardless of their findings. It's not like the bond rating agencies on Wall Street.

[-] whereisk@lemmy.world 38 points 4 months ago

There's a difference in stakes and impact and intent: the client firm is actively interested in finding security holes and the outcome of a negative security report does not (usually) directly affect the continuing operations of the business or impact on the personal reputations of the business owners their ability to conduct business, or how moral they're perceived by society.

A negative report here would be a devastating blow on Linus himself, his business is built around him and relies on audiences trusting him, it would also open up the door for legal action that could result in massive monetary damages and fines.

I've had "independent" valuations and audits. I've seen how these firms work - and it's not independent. They obey the people that pay them or they don't get any work in the future from anyone else "that firm destroyed my business".

The most suspect aspect of the report is that they found nothing negative, everything was perfect. This on its face doesn't ring true for any business I've ever seen, as well as how they responded to the accusations and how many people came out to accuse them.

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[-] psion1369@lemmy.world 47 points 4 months ago
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[-] Zedstrian@lemmy.dbzer0.com 111 points 4 months ago

As with corporate mediators though, wouldn't such investigation companies have a financial incentive to favor their clients, so as to improve the odds of being rehired?

[-] IrateAnteater@sh.itjust.works 128 points 4 months ago

Yes and no. The reason companies are hiring them is for the image of impartiality they bring. If your firm gets a reputation for just always siding with the company, regardless of what actually happened, that image gets destroyed.

Plus, I'm willing to bet that there's not a whole lot of recurring business from individual companies for this type of service. That would kind of defeat the purpose of being the "neutral third party".

[-] Pudutr0n@feddit.cl 47 points 4 months ago

As someone who used to work in a job that involved giving companies reports they paid for, I gotta say while large auditing firms will likely defend their reputation before the company that hired them, mid and small companies will just follow the paycheck. Doesn't look that big to me.

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[-] Aphelion@lemm.ee 30 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

It's a business completely built on reputation for impartiality and thruthfullness. The second they take money to tilt their findings and it's discovered, their whole business it dead.

Having worked at a company that had to hire a similar firm, I can tell you they had a huge contract up front that stipulates that they will find everything, they will be impartial, and if you, as their customer try and obfuscate or hinder their findings, they'll terminate the contract, and report any actions they're legally required to report.

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[-] Vivendi@lemmy.zip 91 points 4 months ago

So basically they hired a law firm that gets paid by corporations to dissolve evidence and destroy lawsuits and they "didn't find anything"

Right, another day in capitalist heaven

[-] Mataresian@lemmy.dbzer0.com 61 points 4 months ago

Though that is fruit for thought I can not find any information to back op that claim. I did however found articles about them defending remote working. It's a bit too easy to me to throw out claims such as this without backing it up with facts. But if you do have any other examples I would love to read them.

[-] rayashino@lemmy.world 34 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

I did not do any research but to me the comment you replied to made me pause and think for a bit.

If someone immediately assumes that a third party investigator is just being paid off by the firm they're investigating, how is that firm supposed to prove their "innocence" to someone like that? A second investigator could just get a paycheck aswell, so that doesn't change anything. They obviously can't just publish the relevant information for privacy reasons.

What else are they supposed to do? I think that a certain amount of mistrust is good, especially when it comes to things where money and/or reputation is on the line, but the closer you get to personal relationships the more harmful unwarranted mistrust can be. Idk why I'm writing this reply to you, its more directed at the original comment poster, but ig I'm continuing on a tangent

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[-] Rentlar@lemmy.ca 76 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

I think part of it was the stress of the grindset that Linus running the show was getting all the staff into. Pushing out content at a regular schedule, getting sponsorships and all of that.

The whole GN saga with data accuracy and the donated cooler that made LMG look inward for a bit and improve their process was for the best I think.

The investigation to me is just one element making sure LMG weren't getting off on the wrong foot.

I think the complainant wasn't wrong or defamatory at all to bring up concerns because even in LTT's channel there was a video where the front and center stars of the team comment on how stressful things can be. When there's an implicit hierarchy imbalance (Linus can say "we're all equals here" all he wants) but fact is there's a leadership structure in one way or another, which can cause one to take certain treatment in different ways.

[-] Dagnet@lemmy.world 51 points 4 months ago

It was a necessary "drama" imo. You mentioned the stress the team was put through but also I think Linus' ego needed to be brought down a lot. The way he talked on wan show about the cooler is like someone who thinks he is a tech god, saying something is bad is expected but outright claiming the product is worthless and will never amount to anything is just bad taste specially when you got it for free AND didn't bother testing it properly.

One can hope this situation will bring positive lasting change to the way the company is run but also the image Linus has of himself.

[-] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 30 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

specially when you got it for free

This is irrelevant IMO, getting a product for free shouldn't impact your review at all. The issue is they didn't test it properly, which is what people watch the video for.

That said, I like GN's policy here: no free stuff.

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[-] credo@lemmy.world 59 points 4 months ago

I really key in on the language of these types of releases. First is,

To ensure a fair investigation, LMG did not comment or publicly release any data and asked our team members to do the same.

So.. keeping yo mouth shut is not ensuring a “fair investigation.” It’s protecting yourself.

Next, phrases like,

Claims of bullying and harassment were not substantiated.

Is not proof of anything- other than there was no proof. That’s why you hire a third party to speak for you. Instead of you saying, “I didn’t do it,” (which of course almost anyone would - true or not) the “independent” investigator can say, “I didn’t find any proof.”

The strongest language here,

Allegations that sexual harassment were ignored or not addressed were false.

..is interesting. I guess it depends on what they mean by “addressed.” If I slapped a colleague on the back and said, “That was hilarious!”, I hardly ignored it. You could even say I addressed it.

I’m not saying I believe I’ve way or the other. All I’m pointing out is this means basically nothing.

[-] iAmTheTot@kbin.social 51 points 4 months ago

Is not proof of anything

You'll be waiting a while then. You can't prove a negative. If LMG says they didn't do a thing, and an investigation concluded that there was no substantial evidence that they did that thing, what more do you want?

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[-] RanchOnPancakes@lemmy.world 55 points 4 months ago

I mean I guess its slightly reassuring. Truth is, its hard to trust a "moderator" that you paid for. Its just the nature of how shit works.

[-] kn33@lemmy.world 57 points 4 months ago

The thing is that it's the best they can do, which is about all we can ask for. No one is going to do a good job at the investigation for free.

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[-] db2@lemmy.world 42 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

"We've thoroughly investigated ourselves and found we did nothing wrong"

Is anyone shocked?

e: imagine being so pathetic you get your rocks off by being a ltt boot licker. Oh wait at least 50 of you don't need to imagine that do you.

[-] twei@discuss.tchncs.de 56 points 4 months ago

We’ve thoroughly investigated ourselves

but that's the point... they didn't

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[-] Drummyralf@lemmy.world 53 points 4 months ago

How would you suggest a firm to investigate wrongdoings other than asking a third party to do it?

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[-] Empricorn@feddit.nl 33 points 4 months ago

I get it's fun to dunk on them with a meme comment, but that's literally the exact opposite of what they did.

[-] iAmTheTot@kbin.social 29 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

We’ve thoroughly investigated ourselves

They didn't though?

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[-] greencactus@lemmy.world 37 points 4 months ago

That changes my perspective on them a lot. Well, another lesson taken - don't jump too quickly onto conclusions.

[-] Boozilla@lemmy.world 35 points 4 months ago

Assume for a moment the investigators were acting in good faith and knew what they were doing. They are still only able to find what they are given access to, and evidence that wasn't destroyed. LTT is not the most technically competent staff in the world, but I bet if those guys know how to do anything technical, covering their tracks is probably high on that list.

I'm not skeptical of the firm that was hired. I'm skeptical that LTT and gang didn't scrub everything before handing over the keys. We know LTT aren't dumb, and we know they are unethical.

I understand my argument falls into "can't prove a negative" territory. I'm going on instincts. The main dude has techbro-creep energy. Reminds me of a Blizzard executive. The whole thing stinks of a South Park apology episode to me.

I understand you can't put someone in jail over instincts. I wouldn't want that, either. That's not how the system should work.

But it's 100% OK to stop following some dumbass YouTuber because you trust your instincts.

I'd rather get my tech infotainment elsewhere. It's a big wide world out there on the internet. LTT isn't the only game in town. And honestly, they were never that great to begin with. Their methodologies are lousy.

[-] five82@lemmy.world 29 points 4 months ago

I don't understand why LTT wouldn't negotiate a settlement first with the accuser in exchange for a nondisclosure and non-disparagement agreement before releasing any statement. You could view their posturing as defiance.

[-] nutsack@lemmy.world 36 points 4 months ago

that's probably what the accuser wanted and i respect the refusal

[-] echodot@feddit.uk 27 points 4 months ago

And that's of course they actually didn't do anything and the accusations are entirely false in which case why would they settle with someone trying to just get money out of them?

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[-] myliltoehurts@lemm.ee 28 points 4 months ago

Yea idk.

After having dealt with some audits (although not this exact topic), in general they followed the same format. "Assert that we do the thing we claim to be doing". So if the thing they claim to be doing is a low bar, the audit means nothing. If they dont release any evidence, or a report of what they were ascertaining it means very little IMO.

I can't remember if the employee released any evidence with her claims either though, but in general I'd prefer my odds with assuming her story is closer to the truth against a company which has had other mishaps recently, underpinned by evidence. All of which they tried to brush under the carpet.

So yeah. I'm pressing X for doubt.

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this post was submitted on 24 May 2024
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